Muzzleloader Identification Help

[Tlitton]

Hi
I know this is not a civil war item but maybe someone could help me to date this
I just pick this up a few weeks ago an very old looking inline muzzleloader. At first look from a distance I thought it was a old 22 or toy gun by just looking at the bolts and spring in the back. After looking around in the shop and glancing up at the wall again I notice size of the barrel. asking the shopkeeper if I can take a closer peek at the rife. It was just something weird about it having an old antique patina . barrel band had a hammered surface. As for the rear bolts when pulled back you could see the nipple. Their are no markings that I could see. The wood stock is not machine made you can tell in few places it wasn't completely sanded down right in the hard-to-reach places. The bore is 10.4mm and with an endoscope I could see some faint riffling or grooves. The ram rod has a worm made on the end and doesn't screw come off like modern ones .This gun has all traits of being very old but this is a design I never seen before

someone at some time installed thumbtacks on the gun to make it look more like a trade rifle


Could someone help me find information on this

 

[UCVRelics]

Interesting gun. I don't have a clue but maybe @johan_steele has a clue.

 

[Tommyg84]

It looks like something that's been heavily altered from its original design over the years. Do you see the imprint made by the barrel band? Looks as if it was originally further down making me wonder if the while thing wasn't at one point longer. It appears the lock and breech areas are altered. At some point someone.... uhhhh... studded it out also? The fact that you noticed rifling has me wondering if at some point it was a combination rifle? That double bolt action mechanism is really strange... maybe it's actually multiple guns and it's entirely homemade? Never seen anything like it thanks for sharing.

 

[johan_steele]

Interesting gun. I don't have a clue but maybe @johan_steele has a clue.

Whoa… @frankconrad might have some insight.

 

[tbuckley]

I'm just guessing that this is a home-made muzzleloader put together from assorted parts. The stock looks like it's from a .22 rifle. I get the impression that it might have been assembled in the 1950s or '60s. Just my thoughts.

 

[Tlitton]

The only screws found on the gun is located is the rear main and two holding the trigger guard. It appears that the barrel is held down to the stock by the old style needle pins. I have a old Pennsylvania rifle made in the 1830's which has the same kind of pins driven though the stock wood from side to side. I will take it apart in a few weeks maybe I will fine something else about it under the barrel. If there is something I will share Thanks for your comments

 

[DixieRifles]

Its general shape reminds me of the .22 caliber automatic we had as a kid---I think a Winchester Model 74.

I was trying to see what they did to the breech. Was that breech cut out? It almost looks like the edge is a fracture surface. The rear of the barrel/breech has similar look of the Winchester.

I guess when the trigger is pulled, that entire breech block with the two studs will spring forward to strike the cap? Can you take a photo of it in the "fired" position??

 

[Booner]

The action on this gun appears to be that of a plunger type in-line muzzle loader, somewhat similar to some of the first in-lines made by Knight in the early 1980's. But due to the crudeness of the assembly, and lack of any markings, I would think this gun was home made; maybe in the 1950's? The two bolts perpendicular to the action I'm assuming were used to pull the bolt back to cock the rifle and to allow the cap to be placed on the nipple, (I don't see anything that would act like a safety), and perhaps the bolt spring is stout enough where both hands are needed to cock the bolt? The nipple doesn't look like any that would be used on a traditional cap lock muzzle loader, so perhaps it's for a modern shotgun primer? Black powder substitutes, like Pyrodex, needs a hotter ignition temperature than that of regular black powder, therefore the need of a shotgun primer The bore, at 10.4 mm equals a caliber of 0.4094 inches, and some of the blueing that remains appears to me to be modern and without a patina of an older gun. The trigger guard is hand made and many of the bolts and screws are also of a more modern manufactory. The stock has a more modern look, and as someone has previously said, has a look of a modern-style stock.

I said earlier that this gun has a crudely made, but I don't mean this to be a criticism. I do think it was home made, but who ever built it had some talent. They combined some of the features of a more traditional muzzleloader with some innovated designs. The gun is just not finished to the degree that one would see on a gun made for the general market. Who knows, maybe this gun is a prototype; made to work out some design ideas and is the great grandfather of todays modern in-line muzzleloaders?