Model 1832 Artillery Sword makers mark?

Bugattimiller

Private
Joined
Apr 19, 2024
Has anyone seen or can identify this makers mark on a Model 1832 artillery short sword. I haven't got a photo of the other side so I don't know if there is anything else marked. The stamp looks like a bird of some sort but not an american eagle. Any help appreciated.

art.jpg
 
It's the marking on the fake Ames artillery short sword. They are very good copies so you do need to look closely. The eagle looks more like a chicken. The markings on the reverse side will be all aligned to the left. They are dated 1839 and tend to have the "MS" Massachusetts marking stamped on the cross guard.
Thank you so much for the information, it certainly looks like a chicken. I suspected non original and again thanks for the confirmation.
 
These fake Ames artillery short swords have been around for many years and must have been made in good numbers, as I think I have seen more of them than original 1839 dated "MS" marked swords (there were about 300 originals). Many of the fakes show good age and have fooled a lot of collectors and sellers. I've had to tell several people that their swords were fakes. Arizona Swords does go into good detail about these fakes in the "Fakes" tab on his website. In fact when I was looking at his offerings last week he did have an original 1839 "MS" example for sale, as well as one of the fakes if someone wanted to buy for comparison. Not sure if he still still has them.
 
A helpful info source reference
Yes, I was aware of that website. Thank you, John. My sword and scabbard appear completely original based on the information there. It was purchased from a sword collector and sword expert who was recommended to me by a mutual friend, the Curater of Collections at the Pittsburgh Soldiers & Sailors Hall & Museum.
 
That reminds me of when I was a kid and took the Indian three quarters groove axe head that had been handed down in the family to the local archaeological society meeting. One of the guys told me that a stain on it was a blood stain. That seemed really neat. Over the time I realized it dated to the Archaic Period thousands of years ago and the old guy was probably pulling my leg. Then, over more time, I learned that scientists had been able to detect organic material on stone artifacts and identify different species of animals that had been hunted by Native Americans using different tools. I don't know if any of the tools were polished stone axes. I doubt polished axes were used for hunting, but they could have been used to smash bones for marrow.

I have also seen suggestions that certain types of corrosion on metals was due to contact with blood while others suggest that those claims are false. I've never researched the topic. I have at least one sword in a scabbard that shows evidence of having had the pommel removed and hand guard disfigured as if it was hit by an artillery shell fragment. If I recall correctly there is evidence that some sort of liquid gunk splattered onto the scabbard. It's not handy at the moment or I would dig it out and check. I have wondered if there was a cheap and easy way to see if it could be blood residue.
 
That reminds me of when I was a kid and took the Indian three quarters groove axe head that had been handed down in the family to the local archaeological society meeting. One of the guys told me that a stain on it was a blood stain. That seemed really neat. Over the time I realized it dated to the Archaic Period thousands of years ago and the old guy was probably pulling my leg. Then, over more time, I learned that scientists had been able to detect organic material on stone artifacts and identify different species of animals that had been hunted by Native Americans using different tools. I don't know if any of the tools were polished stone axes. I doubt polished axes were used for hunting, but they could have been used to smash bones for marrow.

I have also seen suggestions that certain types of corrosion on metals was due to contact with blood while others suggest that those claims are false. I've never researched the topic. I have at least one sword in a scabbard that shows evidence of having had the pommel removed and hand guard disfigured as if it was hit by an artillery shell fragment. If I recall correctly there is evidence that some sort of liquid gunk splattered onto the scabbard. It's not handy at the moment or I would dig it out and check. I have wondered if there was a cheap and easy way to see if it could be blood residue.
Blood is actually corrosive if left on many surfaces and will leave marks if not cleaned off. Found that out personally!
 

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