I Used To Think...

[Stryker65]

Like my other whimsy-related thread, Funny Research Finds, this thread is mostly for fun, and would rely on audience (your) participation. I saw this in a YouTube video once, and I thought it could be applied here -- what is something you used to think when you were first starting out with research, and learned it was not so later on?

I used to think a "12-pounder" meant that the cannon weighed only twelve pounds. Embarrassing that I even considered it.

 

[DixieRifles]

Does anyone know who is laid to rest in Grants tomb?

Hiram Ulysses & Julia Boggs

 

[CWdiaryPA]

I know the list of things I've come to understand better is too long in its entirety, but your post makes me want to add one thing on this list.

I used to think that Northerners looked down on Southerners. I was certainly raised to believe that all Northerners thought we were stupid. Full stop - by default. Any Northerner you meet is going to think you are dumb. Lots of years have passed since I was young and I think it is time for Southerns to stop passing along this myth to their children because it just isn't true. Maybe at one time it was, back when there was a lack of public schools in the south, but that hasn't been true for a long time.

It is kind of a persecution complex I think, that some, mostly older, folks just can't seem to shake off. It's a "play the victim card" that gets whipped out as needed. Any discussion, argument, conflict, etc. in which the person disagreeing with me is someone from north of the Mason/Dixon line - Well! The problem is that person thinks I'm stupid!

No- they are just disagreeing with you on that issue. No more, no less. The two of you could no doubt find a number of things to agree on, but whatever you are discussing now just isn't it.

We did, & it was wrong. I was wrong. But it's how I was indoctrinated. And I'd have stayed thinking that the rest of my life had I not been forced to delve into this war. That's the plain truth. It's all down to section, which area of the country you're from & when you were raised. There's no denying the cliches about north & south, that those stereotypes once existed & do linger today. Some of us learn, others of us stay in our ignorance. It's like anything else. That said, there's definitely a persecution complex. I've been accused of "having a northern agenda," one of the funniest things ever said to me. But it's important to remember a persecution complex doesn't come out of the dust. There's a reason for everything where the war & its legacy will linger for quite some time after we're all dead & gone. Just my cheap 2¢. Thanks

 

[CWdiaryPA]

I never knew that! And I certainly never thought that!

I used to think that "the South" was in South America though when I was little!

I thought Guerrilla Warfare meant giant apes were running around the woods strapped with machine guns, so don't feel bad. I just couldn't work it out in my mind how they were able to fire their weapons, but they have opposing thumbs though, like us, right?

 

[John Winn]

We did, & it was wrong. I was wrong. But it's how I was indoctrinated. And I'd have stayed thinking that the rest of my life had I not been forced to delve into this war. That's the plain truth. It's all down to section, which area of the country you're from & when you were raised. There's no denying the cliches about north & south, that those stereotypes once existed & do linger today. Some of us learn, others of us stay in our ignorance. It's like anything else. That said, there's definitely a persecution complex. I've been accused of "having a northern agenda," one of the funniest things ever said to me. But it's important to remember a persecution complex doesn't come out of the dust. There's a reason for everything where the war & its legacy will linger for quite some time after we're all dead & gone. Just my cheap 2¢. Thanks

Yeah, y'all did (and many probably still do). I've lived in the southeast (where I was born), in Michigan, in Montana (western and eastern), in Nevada, and in Oregon (eastern and western). My wife, born in Missouri, has lived in more places than me, mostly in northeastern states. Both of us experienced the southerners are stupid thing. But I also witnessed each region having other notions about other folks being stupid - e.g. in Michigan there was a thing between the UP and those from "under the bridge"; in Montana it was anybody not born in Montana with Canadians and people from Idaho in particular; in Nevada it was people from Utah; in New Mexico (where I visited friends several times) it was people from Mexico (well, amongst the non-Hispanics); in Oregon it was (and is) people from California and we have a big urban vs rural cultural divide (e.g. Portland vs eastern Oregon). I've heard of other places where folks have these kinds of notions and downright rivalries. I guess it's just human tribalism on display.

I've met both remarkably intelligent people and idiots in all the places I've lived and fail to see a geographic correlation; just a bell curve everywhere. My wife has had a similar experience.

 

[Josh The Lighthouse Guy]

I used to think that Northerners looked down on Southerners. I was certainly raised to believe that all Northerners thought we were stupid. Full stop - by default. Any Northerner you meet is going to think you are dumb. Lots of years have passed since I was young and I think it is time for Southerns to stop passing along this myth to their children because it just isn't true.

Regionalism does strange things.

I live in South Florida, which is no longer part of the South. Here the children of Yankee invaders from the mid-20th century despise the Yankee-come-latelys of recent decades because they're ruining everything.

 

[Rebforever]

Typical. They came down to straighten us up.

 

[JackADriscoll]

Regionalism does strange things.

I live in South Florida, which is no longer part of the South. Here the children of Yankee invaders from the mid-20th century despise the Yankee-come-latelys of recent decades because they're ruining everything.

How uncivil

 

[Josh The Lighthouse Guy]

I thought Guerrilla Warfare meant giant apes were running around the woods strapped with machine guns, so don't feel bad. I just couldn't work it out in my mind how they were able to fire their weapons, but they have opposing thumbs though, like us, right?

The Apes of Wrath: A Biography of General Grodd, The Greatest Guerilla Warrior by John Silverback.

I may have been reading DC comics during English class.

 

[13 IL Cav & 64 GA Inf]

We did, & it was wrong. I was wrong. But it's how I was indoctrinated. And I'd have stayed thinking that the rest of my life had I not been forced to delve into this war. That's the plain truth. It's all down to section, which area of the country you're from & when you were raised. There's no denying the cliches about north & south, that those stereotypes once existed & do linger today. Some of us learn, others of us stay in our ignorance. It's like anything else. That said, there's definitely a persecution complex. I've been accused of "having a northern agenda," one of the funniest things ever said to me. But it's important to remember a persecution complex doesn't come out of the dust. There's a reason for everything where the war & its legacy will linger for quite some time after we're all dead & gone. Just my cheap 2¢. Thanks

If you served in the U.S. military, with the amalgamated population of service members from all over the nation, that might have influenced you to think of us all as equals, too.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

There's a reason for everything where the war & its legacy will linger for quite some time after we're all dead & gone.

Evidently that is so, just from reading some of these posts.

Some things have lingered long enough though, and it is time to put them to rest, because if they ever were true they are not true anymore. I worry that websites like this inadvertently help those old, old resentments linger. There are plenty of posters here and on other sites who seem to be arguing as if the war is still going on and their national and personal honor is at stake. The vast majority of the current population is trying to figure out how to live in the 21st century, however.

Part of the reason so many of the younger folks in the country today have a dwindling interest in the CW, I think, is because they look at the burning issues of 1860 and don't see any point in discussing it. There is nothing about slavery as it related to state's rights that they want to defend. The idea that a person's intelligence is decided by the shade of their skin is bizarre. They don't care if their new best friend's gg-grandfather fought against their gg-grandfather in 1862.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

If you served in the U.S. military, with the amalgamated population of service members from all over the nation, that might have influenced you to think of us all as equals, too.

Certainly worked for my dad. He came back from WW2 with an entirely different viewpoint on any number of stereotypes he learned growing up.

 

[CWdiaryPA]

Evidently that is so, just from reading some of these posts.

Some things have lingered long enough though, and it is time to put them to rest, because if they ever were true they are not true anymore. I worry that websites like this inadvertently help those old, old resentments linger. There are plenty of posters here and on other sites who seem to be arguing as if the war is still going on and their national and personal honor is at stake. The vast majority of the current population is trying to figure out how to live in the 21st century, however.

Part of the reason so many of the younger folks in the country today have a dwindling interest in the CW, I think, is because they look at the burning issues of 1860 and don't see any point in discussing it. There is nothing about slavery as it related to state's rights that they want to defend. The idea that a person's intelligence is decided by the shade of their skin is bizarre. They don't care if their new best friend's gg-grandfather fought against their gg-grandfather in 1862.

For sure, 100% all the way. National & personal honor at stake is how it's often come across, at least to me. In a twisted way, it's almost a privilege to even understand that more than just intellectually. And it's understandable some of can be off-putting to younger generations about pressing the thing, still. Goes to show either we're all certifiable in 2025, or the unfinished business of 1861--1865 still rips through the land unabated. It always comes down (imo) to what the men who took part would have wanted from us. It was their war. How would they want us to recognize it & them through the eras? What should survive memory on their behalf. I think it's beneficial to embrace reconciliation, to keep at the forefront we are ALL Americans. Everyone has their degree of comfort with words we use around the Confederacy. Some "celebrate" various aspects of it. Others just remember their ancestors. It's a free country.

 

[CWdiaryPA]

Yeah, y'all did (and many probably still do). I've lived in the southeast (where I was born), in Michigan, in Montana (western and eastern), in Nevada, and in Oregon (eastern and western). My wife, born in Missouri, has lived in more places than me, mostly in northeastern states. Both of us experienced the southerners are stupid thing. But I also witnessed each region having other notions about other folks being stupid - e.g. in Michigan there was a thing between the UP and those from "under the bridge"; in Montana it was anybody not born in Montana with Canadians and people from Idaho in particular; in Nevada it was people from Utah; in New Mexico (where I visited friends several times) it was people from Mexico (well, amongst the non-Hispanics); in Oregon it was (and is) people from California and we have a big urban vs rural cultural divide (e.g. Portland vs eastern Oregon). I've heard of other places where folks have these kinds of notions and downright rivalries. I guess it's just human tribalism on display.

I've met both remarkably intelligent people and idiots in all the places I've lived and fail to see a geographic correlation; just a bell curve everywhere. My wife has had a similar experience.

Yeah, I think the North versus South of the Mason-Dixon thing under discussion is more a concept stuck for centuries now in the cultural consciousness. Sure, each state makes fun of other states. California & Jersey probably get it the worst. And New Yorkers, Florida Man, all that. Tribalism is also real.

 

[CWdiaryPA]

The Apes of Wrath: A Biography of General Grodd, The Greatest Guerilla Warrior by John Silverback.

I may have been reading DC comics during English class.

God that's clever

 

[Pat Answer]

I thought Guerrilla Warfare meant giant apes were running around the woods strapped with machine guns, so don't feel bad. I just couldn't work it out in my mind how they were able to fire their weapons, but they have opposing thumbs though, like us, right?

It took a while for me on this one, too. The Charlton Heston Planet of the Apes movie and sequels were pretty big with us kids… (at least the gorillas with guns part even if we didn't quite get the implications of the whole story)

The Apes of Wrath: A Biography of General Grodd, The Greatest Guerilla Warrior by John Silverback.

I may have been reading DC comics during English class.

Now that's just too funny!

 

[J C J Barefoot]

I know the list of things I've come to understand better is too long in its entirety, but your post makes me want to add one thing on this list.

I used to think that Northerners looked down on Southerners. I was certainly raised to believe that all Northerners thought we were stupid. Full stop - by default. Any Northerner you meet is going to think you are dumb. Lots of years have passed since I was young and I think it is time for Southerns to stop passing along this myth to their children because it just isn't true. Maybe at one time it was, back when there was a lack of public schools in the south, but that hasn't been true for a long time.

It is kind of a persecution complex I think, that some, mostly older, folks just can't seem to shake off. It's a "play the victim card" that gets whipped out as needed. Any discussion, argument, conflict, etc. in which the person disagreeing with me is someone from north of the Mason/Dixon line - Well! The problem is that person thinks I'm stupid!

No- they are just disagreeing with you on that issue. No more, no less. The two of you could no doubt find a number of things to agree on, but whatever you are discussing now just isn't it.

I live in Ohio and had two great great grandfathers fight for the Union. To a person-- in my family and friend circle there is a feeling of kinship between Midwestern's and Southerner's. Ohioans have much more in common with Kentucky or South Carolina than it does with Vermont or Mass. Yet there is one institution that thinks the southern people are stupid, backward, and the source of social injustice. Hollywood. The trash they put out as films of the South is of extreme prejudice. Ted Turner did his best to correct this..to his great credit.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

I live in Ohio and had two great great grandfathers fight for the Union. To a person-- in my family and friend circle there is a feeling of kinship between Midwestern's and Southerner's. Ohioans have much more in common with Kentucky or South Carolina than it does with Vermont or Mass. Yet there is one institution that thinks the southern people are stupid, backward, and the source of social injustice. Hollywood. The trash they put out as films of the South is of extreme prejudice. Ted Turner did his best to correct this..to his great credit.

Hollywood is worthless for presenting anything with historical accuracy.

I recall the age of "The Beverly Hillbillies and Gomer Pyle" so I hear what you are saying. The golden age of Hollywood in the last century was less than golden in the way they often characterized lots of people from various regions of our country. (Was everyone from Chicago a mobster?) Thankfully that isn't the money making formula it used to be, because bottom line, most people today have no interest in those kinds of movies.

As you point out, sharing beliefs with other people has absolutely nothing to do with what side of the Ohio River they live on. The Civil War is over — and has been for a long time.

 

[Josh The Lighthouse Guy]

Hollywood is worthless for presenting anything with historical accuracy.

Hollywood has no incentive to produce historically-accurate films.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

Hollywood has no incentive to produce historically-accurate films.

None whatsoever - and as long as viewers are aware of that and don't accept the movies as carefully vetted documentaries we will be fine. Fingers crossed.

 

[Stryker65]

Yeah, I think the North versus South of the Mason-Dixon thing under discussion is more a concept stuck for centuries now in the cultural consciousness. Sure, each state makes fun of other states. California & Jersey probably get it the worst. And New Yorkers, Florida Man, all that. Tribalism is also real.

I'd say there's something bad you can say about every state. I live in Delaware (the forgotten state), close to Jersey (which needs no moniker), and bordering Pennsylvania (which has abysmal roads).

Tangentially related, I've come across some of my early Civil War work in which, if I was confronted with a pair of unknown initials for first and middle, I would make up a name. What does the E in E. Kirby Smith stand for? Probably Edward.