Give the enemy no quarter-

[Lubliner]

Having heard this saying many years ago, I can no longer reference where and when and by whom it was said. I certainly agree it was the Armed Forces here in my own country, but still uncertain of its War Origin. Without being too presumptuous, I am asking members that have some definite source to verify or refute my simple guess, which is this;

-When the Confederates were invested in Corinth Mississippi during the Spring of 1862, possibly before the attack on Shiloh.

My reason is based on General Bragg's general announcement that any wasted bullet fired at random, as target practice, or hunting game was in violation, and the soldier would be charged a quarter out of his pay for each infraction depleting the ammunition on hand.

 

[TomP]

Ha! That's a good one.

I'm a Ranger at Corinth and I have to repeat this story.

Tom

 

[Patrick H]

I have no idea, but that's a great story.

 

[Patrick H]

Well, I got curious and did a Google search. Wiki has a few theories, and I like the first one, too:

Etymology
The term may originate from an order by the commander of a victorious army that they "will not quarter (house)" captured enemy combatants. Therefore, none can be taken prisoner and all enemy combatants must be killed.[7] A second derivation, given equal prominence in the Oxford English Dictionary (OED), is that quarter (n.17) can mean "Relations with, or conduct towards, another" as in Shakespeare Oth. II. iii. 180, "Friends all..In Quarter, and in termes like Bride, and Groome." So "no quarter" may also mean refusal to enter into an agreement (relations) with an enemy attempting to surrender. The OED mentions a third possible derivation but says "The assertion of De Brieux (1672 Origines..de plusieurs façons de parler, 16) that it arose in an agreement between the Dutch and Spaniards, by which the ransom of an officer or private was to be a quarter of his pay, is at variance with the constant sense of the phrases give and receive quarter."

 

[Lubliner]

Well, I got curious and did a Google search. Wiki has a few theories, and I like the first one, too:

Etymology
The term may originate from an order by the commander of a victorious army that they "will not quarter (house)" captured enemy combatants. Therefore, none can be taken prisoner and all enemy combatants must be killed.[7] A second derivation, given equal prominence in the Oxford English Dictionary (OED), is that quarter (n.17) can mean "Relations with, or conduct towards, another" as in Shakespeare Oth. II. iii. 180, "Friends all..In Quarter, and in termes like Bride, and Groome." So "no quarter" may also mean refusal to enter into an agreement (relations) with an enemy attempting to surrender. The OED mentions a third possible derivation but says "The assertion of De Brieux (1672 Origines..de plusieurs façons de parler, 16) that it arose in an agreement between the Dutch and Spaniards, by which the ransom of an officer or private was to be a quarter of his pay, is at variance with the constant sense of the phrases give and receive quarter."

Number 1, American G. I. It is so nice to have the brain-fog dispersed by intelligence. The moral of the story is---if you believe too much in your own wit, you may become blind to the true light that shines. Thank you Patrick H.

 

[UCVRelics]

Great Story but them term "No Quarter" was around a long time before the CW. It was a phrase no captured soldier wanted to hear,

 

[archieclement]

Great Story but them term "No Quarter" was around a long time before the CW. It was a phrase no captured soldier wanted to hear,

agree, here it was form of parole both sides doled out that had a zero parole violation rate. As it tended to release you of all earthly bounds, not just capture

 

[jackt62]

Wasn't the common term for "No Quarter" during the Civil War, "Flying the Black Flag?"

 

[UCVRelics]

Yes it was, to include the one raised at Ft. Pillow.

 

[Patrick H]

I have a hunch that "black flag" is largely a figure of speech, but everyone knew what the term meant.

A young lady who admired Quantrill designed and sewed him a black flag with the initial letter ""Q" and the misspelled name "Quantrell" also on the flag. The Jolly Roger pirate flag was black. Other than those two examples I can't think of another actual black battle flag. There might be others.

An incident in the second Battle of Boonville, MO illustrates the common knowledge of the term. It was raining very hard and the Missouri State Guard troops had their flag wrapped in dark oil cloth. The rain darkened the furled cloth even more. Defenders inside the fort were convinced that their enemy was carrying a black flag. Their fort couldn't be taken, and the defenders actually negotiated a deal which allowed the attackers to withdraw from town!

 

[Ole Miss]

General Santa Ana ordered that "no quarter" would be given to the defenders of the Alamo in 1836 but the practice was far older.

In October of 1664 the English Parliament issued a decree stating:

"... no quarter shall be given hereafter to any Irishman, nor any Papist whatsoever born in Ireland, who shall be taken in hostility against the Parliament ... every officer that shall be remiss or negligent in observing the tenor of this ordinance shall be reputed a favourer of that bloody rebellion in Ireland."*

I have listed below another site which covers the history "no quarter" which is probably as old as human warfare.
Regards
David
*https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/give-no-quarter.html

 

[archieclement]

I have a hunch that "black flag" is largely a figure of speech, but everyone knew what the term meant.

A young lady who admired Quantrill designed and sewed him a black flag with the initial letter ""Q" and the misspelled name "Quantrell" also on the flag. The Jolly Roger pirate flag was black. Other than those two examples I can't think of another actual black battle flag. There might be others.

An incident in the second Battle of Boonville, MO illustrates the common knowledge of the term. It was raining very hard and the Missouri State Guard troops had their flag wrapped in dark oil cloth. The rain darkened the furled cloth even more. Defenders inside the fort were convinced that their enemy was carrying a black flag. Their fort couldn't be taken, and the defenders actually negotiated a deal which allowed the attackers to withdraw from town!

Frank James said a black flag was carried AVE Johnston's 39th Missouri Infantry Volunteers at Centralia

the sharp piercing eyes of James flashed "I don't care what your histories say, they carried a black flag. It was apparently a black apron tied to a stick. We captured it in the battle that followed. No we had no flag. We had no time to get one and no chance to carry it if we had.

Both Edwards and McCorkle accounts also have the militia carrying a black flag.

 

[Lubliner]

And it was such a good story, too...! (Thanks @Ole Miss).
Edit: Okay, keeping in tune with the scheme of things concerning black flags; if white is surrender, then black is....the opposite.

 

[John Hartwell]

Last year we had quite a long thread on the Black Flag and no quarter in the Civil War:

https://civilwartalk.com/threads/the-black-flag.132831/#post-1504072​

 

[Lubliner]

Last year we had quite a long thread on the Black Flag and no quarter in the Civil War:

https://civilwartalk.com/threads/the-black-flag.132831/#post-1504072​

Wow, seven pages of it. That will take some time for me to read through. Excuse any ignorance here on my part for the time being; I am a new member and the diversity of topics become overwhelming. I am not usually willy-nilly, if you get my meaning, and I do lack certain habits of organization and research in the higher learnings. Thanks for the direction there. My comments are not feigned.
Lubliner.

 

[John Hartwell]

Wow, seven pages of it. That will take some time for me to read through. Excuse any ignorance here on my part for the time being; I am a new member and the diversity of topics become overwhelming. I am not usually willy-nilly, if you get my meaning, and I do lack certain habits of organization and research in the higher learnings. Thanks for the direction there. My comments are not feigned.
Lubliner.

No problem. I understand fully.
Our search-engine also isn't always the most responsive.

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

It's a great story anyway. We could start a rumor, leaving one, more myth for the next generation to bust. They should have something left to do, poor things.

 

[Lubliner]

It's a great story anyway. We could start a rumor, leaving one, more myth for the next generation to bust. They should have something left to do, poor things.

@JPK Huson 1863, allow me a humble welcome to you. I had seen many of your posts in The Naval War Forum and must compliment you on an amazing eye for discernment, and a vast memory of collected research. Also allow me to add your wonderful humility in the face of recognition proves an unruffled modesty. Ha! On to the point...*chuckle*….Myths you say, or just plain colorful stories, such as Booth dying in Oklahoma? Or maybe the story of a General's headquarters being in his saddle, who was it; Pope? Without covering anyone up in scapegoat cloth it could be fun, especially with Bragg, and his meticulous obedience to military protocol. Now, I am truly a beginner here (hint: message count), and with profound courtesy let me not be the first to make claim I am otherwise. I can point you to LAND HO! on the greetings, and believe me, I truly feel graced with your presence. Bon Adieu,
Lubliner.

 

[Patrick H]

And it was such a good story, too...! (Thanks @Ole Miss).
Edit: Okay, keeping in tune with the scheme of things concerning black flags; if white is surrender, then black is....the opposite.

I hadn't thought about that, but it's a neat insight.

 

[Patrick H]

General Santa Ana ordered that "no quarter" would be given to the defenders of the Alamo in 1836 but the practice was far older.

In October of 1664 the English Parliament issued a decree stating:

"... no quarter shall be given hereafter to any Irishman, nor any Papist whatsoever born in Ireland, who shall be taken in hostility against the Parliament ... every officer that shall be remiss or negligent in observing the tenor of this ordinance shall be reputed a favourer of that bloody rebellion in Ireland."*

I have listed below another site which covers the history "no quarter" which is probably as old as human warfare.
Regards
David
*https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/give-no-quarter.html

Yes, the term has obviously been in use far longer than the CW. Everyone knows what it means, too. But why that specific term? I still like the theory that prisoners will not be taken because then they must be fed and housed (quartered.) But I don't know if that's really it.