General Rosser's Shad Bake

[13 IL Cav & 64 GA Inf]

Whole fried catfish, crappie, and bream are excellent if fried correctly!!!!

Amen!

 

[35th MA InfRegt]

Maybe he found it relaxing!

Could be. One of Winston Churchill's field-marshals was a dedicated birdwatcher in his spare time, even during the war. Personally, I think everyone-even generals-could benefit by having a relaxing hobby. Mind you, I wouldn't suggest that anyone neglect their duties in the middle of a crisis in favour of their hobby. That was unwise on Rosser's part.

 

[SWS]

A week before Five Forks J.B. Jones complained:

"I tried in vain this morning to buy a small fish-hook; but could not find one in [Richmond]. None but coarse large ones are in the stores. A friend has promised me one—and I can make pin-hooks, that will catch minnows. I am too skillful an angler to starve where water runs; and even minnows can be eaten. Besides, there are eels and catfish in the [James] river. The water is always muddy."

 

[7th Texas Mounted Rifles]

But I chuckled at the thought of a CSA general with flyfishing rod in hand casting in a creek during a major troop movement.

Aside from the 'general' part, that would have been/was me.

Iraq had some roughfish that bent an 8 weight over double and tried to spool you, no problem… like snook or juvenile tarpon - but in the desert.

Masgouf is awesome, though - I'm of the opinion only Iraqis and Cajuns can pull off preparing carp.

Here in Texas, gizzard shad (like carp) are cut/trotline bait… and threadfin shad are phenomenal for yellow cats.

I'd like to hit up a New England shad bake sometime!

 

[Rhea Cole]

Shad migrate upstream from the ocean into freshwater streams to spawn. They were & are harvested using nets. Read more here.

Link;

American Shad Project | Department Of Natural Resources Division

The harvest of American shad dates back centuries. An important food source for native Americans and early American settlers, the historical relevance of the fish has well been documented, including reports that the fish provided a much-needed food source to George Washington and his soldiers...

georgiawildlife.com

Link:

TASTY SHAD HELPED LEAD CONFEDERACY TO ITS DOWNFALL

Link:

A Taste of Early America: To Bake a Shad | Washington Crossing Historic Park

The Original Recipe From The Virginia Housewife (1824) The shad is a very indifferent fish (meaning it can be boney) unless it be large and fat. When you get a good one prepare it nicely. Put some force meat inside and lay it at full length in a pan, with a pint of water, a

www.washingtoncrossingpark.org

The contemporary accounts mention fried rather than baked shad. Large cast iron kettles used to render hog fat were readily at hand.

My great uncle held an annual fish fry with cast iron kettles. Hushpuppies were fried in separate kettles. My uncle carried on the tradition serving over a hundred family & guests. The fish was bass & other species caught on Lake Barkley in Kentucky.

 

[JerryD]

Shad migrate upstream from the ocean into freshwater streams to spawn. They were & are harvested using nets. Read more here.

Link;

American Shad Project | Department Of Natural Resources Division

The harvest of American shad dates back centuries. An important food source for native Americans and early American settlers, the historical relevance of the fish has well been documented, including reports that the fish provided a much-needed food source to George Washington and his soldiers...

georgiawildlife.com

Link:

TASTY SHAD HELPED LEAD CONFEDERACY TO ITS DOWNFALL

Link:

A Taste of Early America: To Bake a Shad | Washington Crossing Historic Park

The Original Recipe From The Virginia Housewife (1824) The shad is a very indifferent fish (meaning it can be boney) unless it be large and fat. When you get a good one prepare it nicely. Put some force meat inside and lay it at full length in a pan, with a pint of water, a

www.washingtoncrossingpark.org

The contemporary accounts mention fried rather than baked shad. Large cast iron kettles used to render hog fat were readily at hand.

My great uncle held an annual fish fry with cast iron kettles. Hushpuppies were fried in separate kettles. My uncle carried on the tradition serving over a hundred family & guests. The fish was bass & other species caught on Lake Barkley in Kentucky.

Now you're getting me hungry for some fried fish and hushpuppies....

 

[G Low]

Shad migrate upstream from the ocean into freshwater streams to spawn. They were & are harvested using nets. Read more here.

Link;

American Shad Project | Department Of Natural Resources Division

The harvest of American shad dates back centuries. An important food source for native Americans and early American settlers, the historical relevance of the fish has well been documented, including reports that the fish provided a much-needed food source to George Washington and his soldiers...

georgiawildlife.com

Link:

TASTY SHAD HELPED LEAD CONFEDERACY TO ITS DOWNFALL

Link:

A Taste of Early America: To Bake a Shad | Washington Crossing Historic Park

The Original Recipe From The Virginia Housewife (1824) The shad is a very indifferent fish (meaning it can be boney) unless it be large and fat. When you get a good one prepare it nicely. Put some force meat inside and lay it at full length in a pan, with a pint of water, a

www.washingtoncrossingpark.org

The contemporary accounts mention fried rather than baked shad. Large cast iron kettles used to render hog fat were readily at hand.

My great uncle held an annual fish fry with cast iron kettles. Hushpuppies were fried in separate kettles. My uncle carried on the tradition serving over a hundred family & guests. The fish was bass & other species caught on Lake Barkley in Kentucky.

We've used this one to fry fish in too,

it has Brunswick stew in this pic. Smooth as a baby's a** on the inside.

 

[Rhea Cole]

PICKET WASN'T THE FIRST REBEL GENERAL TO BE UNDONE BY A FISH FRY !

On the morning of June 24, 1863 the Army of the Cumberland began the 100 mile advance from Murfreesboro TN to Chattanooga. Baring the way was the Highland Plateau.

Only two gaps, Liberty & Hoovers, led up to the high ground. Hoover's Gap was so narrow that wagons could not pass one another.

General Thomas, commander of the 14th Corps in the center of the line, estimated that forcing the gap would take three days & 2,000 casualties. Assigned to lead the assault was Wilder's 2,000 man experimental mounted infantry brigade armed with Spencer Repeating Rifles.

Utilizing their mobility, Wilder's Brigade was participating in Rosecrans' deception that threatened an attack on Bragg's left when ordered to their jumping off position 40 miles away. In large measure the Spencer's metal cartridges facilitated Wilder's men overwhelming the defenders in a driving rain storm. Charging through the single file, Wilder's brigade earned its name when they burst out on the far side at Beechgrove.

The newly Christened Lightening Brigade deployed on high ground. The baptism of fire for repeating rifles was about to begin.

On the Confederate side, the reaction to Wilder's sudden appearance was haphazard because the officers of Bate's veterans brigade were at a fish fry.

Wilder's men were deployed in a skirmish line, six feet apart. Chasing off cavalry was no big deal, so the first attack advanced in expectation of a token volley followed by a mounted skedaddle.

Imagine their shock when at rifle range round after round, never pausing to load in nine times poured down on them. Unaffected by the rain, the horse's feed bags held 100 rounds.

Repeated assaults left men huddled on a swale. Unable to advance or withdraw, they raised their muskets by the muzzled & were allowed to pass into Wilder's line.

The commander of the infantry wading knee deep in a rushing creek through the gap, ordered Wilder to withdraw. Cavalry with soaking wet cartridge boxes couldn't possibly hold the entrance to the gap.

Not only did the infantry relieve Wilder, General Thomas in person observed the successful breakthrough, Rosecrans ordered an immediate advance through Hoover's Gap.

Shocked by the sudden appearance of the 14th Corps threatening to envelope his line, Bragg had no option but to order a hasty abandonment of the Tullahoma fortifications & retreat. Only a 500 year rain event (re: TVA) saved the Army of Tennessee.

So, it would appear that fish fries were a secret Yankee weapon that guaranteed breakthroughs that caused entire Confederate armies to abandon their earthworks & flee.

This is a vivid & accurate first person account that I highly recommend . Read more here.

Link:

The Battle of Hoover's Gap

A first-hand account of the June 24, 1863 Battle of Hoover's Gap, Tennessee.

www.battlefields.org

 

[13 IL Cav & 64 GA Inf]

PICKET WASN'T THE FIRST REBEL GENERAL TO BE UNDONE BY A FISH FRY !

On the morning of June 23, 1863 the Army of the Cumberland began the 100 mile advance from Murfreesboro TN to Chattanooga. Baring the way was the Highland Plateau.

Only two gaps, Liberty & Hoovers, led up to the high ground. Hoover's Gap was so narrow that wagons could not pass one another.

General Thomas, commander of the 14th Corps in the center of the line, estimated that forcing the gap would take two days & 2,000 casualties. Assigned to lead the assault was Wilder's 2,000 man experimental mounted infantry brigade armed with Spencer Repeating Rifles.

Utilizing their mobility, Wilder's Brigade was participating in Rosecrans' deception that threatened an attack on Bragg's left. Because of the metal cartridges, Wilder's men overwhelmed the defenders in a driving rain storm. Charging through the single file, Wilder's brigade earned its name when they burst out on the far side at Beechgrove.

The newly Christened Lightening Brigade deployed on high ground. The baptism of fire for repeating rifles was about to begin.

On the Confederate side, the reaction to Wilder's sudden appearance was haphazard because the officers of Bate's veterans brigade were at a fish fry.

Wilder's men were deployed in a skirmish line, six feet apart. Chasing off cavalry was no big deal, so the first attack advanced in expectation of a token volley followed by a mounted skedaddle.

Imagine their shock when at rifle range round after round, never pausing to load in nine times poured down on them. Unaffected by the rain, the horse's feed bags held 100 rounds.

Repeated assaults left men huddled on a swale. Unable to advance or withdraw, they raised their muskets by the muzzled & were allowed to pass into Wilder's line.

The commander of the infantry wading knee deep in a rushing creek through the gap, ordered Wilder to withdraw. Cavalry with soaking wet cartridge boxes couldn't possibly hold the entrance to the gap.

Not only did the infantry relieve Wilder, General Thomas in person observed the successful breakthrough, Rosecrans ordered an immediate advance through Hoover's Gap.

Shocked by the sudden appearance of the 14th Corps threatening to envelope his line, Bragg had no option but to order a hasty retreat. Only a 500 year rain event (re: TVA) saved the Army of Tennessee.

So, it would appear that fish fries were a secret Yankee weapon that guaranteed breakthroughs that caused entire Confederate armies to abandon their earthworks & flee. Read more here.

Link:

The Battle of Hoover's Gap

A first-hand account of the June 24, 1863 Battle of Hoover's Gap, Tennessee.

www.battlefields.org

Your good summary makes me recall reading about that.

 

[Rhea Cole]

Your good summary makes me recall reading about that.

Thank you.

Hoover's Gap is 15 miles from my house, so am very familiar with it. I was Ed Bearss' "local guy" when his bus tour came through here. That was the best way ever to learn about the Tullahoma Campaign.

 

[G Low]

Now you're getting me hungry for some fried fish and hushpuppies....

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

Well so anyway -- "Fightin'" Tom Rosser in "Riding With Rosser" only says that he had obtained some "excellent fresh shad" when the remnants of his division were camped on that river (the Nottoway) near Spencer's Mill. When ordered to Five Forks March 30, he brought them along in an ambulance wagon (in a bucket of water, maybe, but it was chilly enough, probably, to where spillage wouldn't be an issue.)

Rosser was wounded in a heavy skirmish with Union cavalry March 31 and spent a "feverish, restless night." At 8 am came the order to fall back to Five Forks. He met Pickett at the Forks. "Seeing as the country was heavily wooded I could see no opportunity for the use of cavalry." He asked permission to withdraw to the other side of Hatcher's Run. Permission granted, so he invited Pickett to lunch. Pickett said Sure, in an hour, and at the appointed time he and Fitz Lee showed up at Rosser's camp.

More detail from (no surprise) D.S. Freeman. He notes that Rosser, while the division was on the way to Five Forks, "ordered the fish be cleaned and placed on spits in front of brisk fires of dry wood." Which is the way we did it with crappie when I was a kid.

Anyway, Rosser offers a sort of half-assed CYA regarding Pickett (It seems, Rosser says, that Pickett was surprised"yet one would have thought that he would have been on the alert in the presence of an enemy"). The book concludes on a generous sort of note: "The soldiers of the two armies have long since become reconciled to each other, and if politicians had not interposed General Grant and General Lee would have soon restored the Union and saved the country the expense and shame of the Freedman's Bureau and the carpetbagging robberies of reconstruction."

Rosser, btw, was not Custer's roomie at West Point, but did live next door.

 

[Rhea Cole]

Well so anyway -- "Fightin'" Tom Rosser in "Riding With Rosser" only says that he had obtained some "excellent fresh shad" when the remnants of his division were camped on that river (the Nottoway) near Spencer's Mill. When ordered to Five Forks March 30, he brought them along in an ambulance wagon (in a bucket of water, maybe, but it was chilly enough, probably, to where spillage wouldn't be an issue.)

Rosser was wounded in a heavy skirmish with Union cavalry March 31 and spent a "feverish, restless night." At 8 am came the order to fall back to Five Forks. He met Pickett at the Forks. "Seeing as the country was heavily wooded I could see no opportunity for the use of cavalry." He asked permission to withdraw to the other side of Hatcher's Run. Permission granted, so he invited Pickett to lunch. Pickett said Sure, in an hour, and at the appointed time he and Fitz Lee showed up at Rosser's camp.

More detail from (no surprise) D.S. Freeman. He notes that Rosser, while the division was on the way to Five Forks, "ordered the fish be cleaned and placed on spits in front of brisk fires of dry wood." Which is the way we did it with crappie when I was a kid.

Anyway, Rosser offers a sort of half-assed CYA regarding Pickett (It seems, Rosser says, that Pickett was surprised"yet one would have thought that he would have been on the alert in the presence of an enemy"). The book concludes on a generous sort of note: "The soldiers of the two armies have long since become reconciled to each other, and if politicians had not interposed General Grant and General Lee would have soon restored the Union and saved the country the expense and shame of the Freedman's Bureau and the carpetbagging robberies of reconstruction."

Rosser, btw, was not Custer's roomie at West Point, but did live next door.

Your reference has given me an urge to smoke some fish.

Does anyone actually believe that Pickett could have done anything to stop Sheridan's assault? Objectively, Pickett's options were nonexistent. So it seems to me.

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

Your reference has given me an urge to smoke some fish.

Does anyone actually believe that Pickett could have done anything to stop Sheridan's assault? Objectively, Pickett's options were nonexistent. So it seems to me.

Pickett and Co did well on March 31, when it was just Sheridan's lads. But once Warren's V Corps came up, and Humphreys right behind him -- doubtful, to say the least. There were around 50k Union soldiers west of Hatcher's Run then, I think? If I remember correctly, after Pickett withdrew to Five Forks from Dinwoodie Court House, he posted the weaker of the divisions borrowed from Anderson on his left. So when Gen. Griffin hit them, that was all she wrote. So "nonexistent" is appropriate, methinks.

At any rate. I've always had something of a soft spot for Warren. He always struck me as a decent and honorable man. I hope I don't offend anyone if I opine that Sheridan's treatment of Warren at the Breakthrough was disgraceful.

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

Thank you.

Hoover's Gap is 15 miles from my house, so am very familiar with it. I was Ed Bearss' "local guy" when his bus tour came through here. That was the best way ever to learn about the Tullahoma Campaign.

I've always thought Tullahoma was the most brilliant "strategic movement" of the war.

 

[repman66]

Pickett and Co did well on March 31, when it was just Sheridan's lads. But once Warren's V Corps came up, and Humphreys right behind him -- doubtful, to say the least. There were around 50k Union soldiers west of Hatcher's Run then, I think? If I remember correctly, after Pickett withdrew to Five Forks from Dinwoodie Court House, he posted the weaker of the divisions borrowed from Anderson on his left. So when Gen. Griffin hit them, that was all she wrote. So "nonexistent" is appropriate, methinks.

At any rate. I've always had something of a soft spot for Warren. He always struck me as a decent and honorable man. I hope I don't offend anyone if I opine that Sheridan's treatment of Warren at the Breakthrough was disgraceful.

Warren also suffered from PTSD.

 

[Rhea Cole]

Pickett and Co did well on March 31, when it was just Sheridan's lads. But once Warren's V Corps came up, and Humphreys right behind him -- doubtful, to say the least. There were around 50k Union soldiers west of Hatcher's Run then, I think? If I remember correctly, after Pickett withdrew to Five Forks from Dinwoodie Court House, he posted the weaker of the divisions borrowed from Anderson on his left. So when Gen. Griffin hit them, that was all she wrote. So "nonexistent" is appropriate, methinks.

At any rate. I've always had something of a soft spot for Warren. He always struck me as a decent and honorable man. I hope I don't offend anyone if I opine that Sheridan's treatment of Warren at the Breakthrough was disgraceful.

I agree that Sheridan was going to keep driving them until they broke… Missionary Ridge comes to mind. Warren was a competent professional soldier… Army of the Potomac to the core. Warren was added to the list of A of the P generals that the war had gone off & left. Sheridan had fought like a tiger at Stones River, advanced to Chattanooga & onward… not bounced back & forth between battles & winter quarters for three years. He brought a profoundly different mentality to the fight than a Virginia general had. The drive needed to destroy Lee's army was simply not in Warren's military DNA.

It is notable that years later an inquiry agreed that Sheridan should not have relieved Warren… somehow that speaks volumes to me. Victory in an office building, not in the field. It is just my opinion.

 

[SWS]

Sheridan seems something of a stereotype to me... namely the hotheaded, pugnacious little Irishman with a lot to prove.

 

[13 IL Cav & 64 GA Inf]

Sheridan seems something of a stereotype to me... namely the hotheaded, pugnacious little Irishman with a lot to prove.

Sheridan may have been a "right place at the right time" guy, kind of like Custer.