Freedom

[Carla Krawczyk]

When I first started visiting civil war battlefields, a friend of mine from the Phillipines asked me "why are Americans so obsessed with the past and visiting cemeteries? I tried to explain to her that Americans have always cherished freedom and those that died, so that we might be free. It is what our country is founded on ,and it is woven in the fabric of the unique experience of being American. No other county understands or appreciates freedom like we do. It is the reason I am studying this very important and tragic war, it is the reason I go to tea parties, and it is the reason I still get chills down my spine when the events of September 11th are revisited again.

 

[BillO]

When I first started visiting civil war battlefields, a friend of mine from the Phillipines asked me "why are Americans so obsessed with the past and visiting cemeteries? I tried to explain to her that Americans have always cherished freedom and those that died, so that we might be free. It is what our country is founded on ,and it is woven in the fabric of the unique experience of being American. No other county understands or appreciates freedom like we do. It is the reason I am studying this very important and tragic war, it is the reason I go to tea parties, and it is the reason I still get chills down my spine when the events of September 11th are revisited again.

I can see some irony in telling a Phillipino about America's love of freedom considering our history with them.

 

[M Anthony Young]

Whoa, hold on there Carla Krawczyk! Don't go losing the run of yourself! Our struggle for and interest in the heady concept of freedom predates yours by about 3 centuries. It had to be wrung--eventually[and partially]--from a mighty, powerful, imperial neighbour at great blood sacrifice. Our investment in its purchase was formidable. All sorts of countries across the world have struggled similarly. Ironically our mutual adversary, Britain, can make a pretty cogent claim to being the "cradle of democracy" so I wouldn't go putting the USA on the gold-medal podium of freedom-loving countries.
Micky.

 

[AndyHall]

I can see some irony in telling a Phillipino about America's love of freedom considering our history with them.

Up to and including water-boarding insurgents (though it was called the "water cure" at the time).

 

[Carla Krawczyk]

Whoa, hold on there Carla Krawczyk! Don't go losing the run of yourself! Our struggle for and interest in the heady concept of freedom predates yours by about 3 centuries. It had to be wrung--eventually[and partially]--from a mighty, powerful, imperial neighbour at great blood sacrifice. Our investment in its purchase was formidable. All sorts of countries across the world have struggled similarly. Ironically our mutual adversary, Britain, can make a pretty cogent claim to being the "cradle of democracy" so I wouldn't go putting the USA on the gold-medal podium of freedom-loving countries.
Micky.

But who REALLY has freedom across this continent like the United States? I am of the opinion that it is a God-given right and although it doesn't make us better than other countries, I believe freedom is cherished all over the world. Sorry I don't mean to sound self-righteous.

 

[Carla Krawczyk]

Whoa, hold on there Carla Krawczyk! Don't go losing the run of yourself! Our struggle for and interest in the heady concept of freedom predates yours by about 3 centuries. It had to be wrung--eventually[and partially]--from a mighty, powerful, imperial neighbour at great blood sacrifice. Our investment in its purchase was formidable. All sorts of countries across the world have struggled similarly. Ironically our mutual adversary, Britain, can make a pretty cogent claim to being the "cradle of democracy" so I wouldn't go putting the USA on the gold-medal podium of freedom-loving countries.
Micky.

But who REALLY has freedom across this continent like the United States? I am of the opinion that it is a God-given right and although it doesn't make us better than other countries, I believe freedom is cherished all over the world. Sorry I don't mean to sound self-righteous.

I can see some irony in telling a Phillipino about America's love of freedom considering our history with them.

I admit I don't know what our history is with the Phillipines, why don't you enlighten me? That really wasn't the point though. I was talking about freedom and the it's constant prescense in American history NOT what other countries think of us.

 

[AndyHall]

I was talking about freedom and the it's constant prescense in American history NOT what other countries think of us.

That's the best one-line definition of jingoism I've ever encountered.

 

[BillO]

Carla, I hope you don't feel that we are pilling on. If you don't know, you don't know. Here's a pretty good link that will explain things better than I could.
http://www.historyguy.com/PhilipineAmericanwar.html

 

[James B White]

That's the best one-line definition of jingoism I've ever encountered.

But you've got to admit that in combination with this:

But who REALLY has freedom across this continent like the United States? I am of the opinion that it is a God-given right and although it doesn't make us better than other countries, I believe freedom is cherished all over the world.

it defines manifest destiny pretty well too.

 

[Republican Blues]

I admit I don't know what our history is with the Phillipines, why don't you enlighten me? That really wasn't the point though. I was talking about freedom and the it's constant prescense in American history NOT what other countries think of us.

hmmmm well lets see, first we were gracious enough to liberate the Philippines from the Spanish during the Spanish American War... then we decided to stick around for a while. In 1899 the Phillippinos decided they had had enough of the Americanos, and rebelled.... we crushed them in 1902. They remained an overseas possession (i.e. Colony) Then the Moros rebelled, and we fought our first war with Muslim extremists... The P.I.s remained a colony until 1934 when they were granted Independence, but the Japanese had something to say about it from 1941-1945. the Philippines finally gained full independence in 1946.

During the Phillippine American War, aka Phillipine Insurrection, there was a lovely little dity:


In that land of dopy dreams, happy peaceful Philippines,
Where the bolo-man is hiking night and day;
Where Tagalos steal and lie, where Americanos die,
There you hear the soldiers sing this evening lay :

cho: D__n, d__n, d__n the Filipinos, cross-eyed kakiack ladrones,
Underneath our starry flag, civilize 'em with a Krag,*
And return us to our own beloved homes.

Underneath the nipa thatch, where the skinny chickens scrath,
Only refuge after hiking all day long,
When I lay me down to sleep, slimy lizards o'er me creep,
Then you hear the soldiers sing this evening song:

Social customs there are few, all the ladies smoke and chew.
And the men do things the padres say are wrong.
But the padres cut no ice -- for they live on fish and rice--
Where you hear the soldiers sing this evening song:


* US Springfield model 1892 Krag-Jorgenson Rifle

 

[Carla Krawczyk]

That's the best one-line definition of jingoism I've ever encountered.

Look I'm not going to get into a pissing contest here but I daresay every country fighting for it's rights always thinks they're in the right. I am not an expert on international history and that is not what this website is for in my mind. I was merely trying to relate the struggle to be free to the civil war experience. You are correct, other countries have stuggled to be free, like Ireland and I support them wholeheartedly. Just curious, what is your interest in the civil war?

 

[Carla Krawczyk]

Carla, I hope you don't feel that we are pilling on. If you don't know, you don't know. Here's a pretty good link that will explain things better than I could.
http://www.historyguy.com/PhilipineAmericanwar.html

Thanks for the info ! (and the support)

 

[BillO]

Thanks for the info ! (and the support)

Your welcome. I'm old school southern and charging to the rescue is what we do.

 

[wondering]

Just when we thought chivalry was dead! I tip my cap, BillO!

 

[Republican Blues]

Carla, I hope you don't feel that we are pilling on. If you don't know, you don't know. Here's a pretty good link that will explain things better than I could.
http://www.historyguy.com/PhilipineAmericanwar.html

I concur!!! I hope some that we're not piling on, but alot of us post at the same time I guess LOL

 

[John Hartwell]

hmmmm well lets see, first we were gracious enough to liberate the Philippines from the Spanish during the Spanish American War... then we decided to stick around for a while.

I'd rather point out that the Philippine Republic had already been established (in a free and open election) and had liberated almost all of the country (except for Manila and a few other fortified ports still held by the Spanish) before the Americans arrived. We then stopped cooperation with the Filippino authorities, and began encroaching on their territory. THEN they "rebelled" (if you can call it that).

Not our proudest moment as a nation.

jno

 

[Carla Krawczyk]

Your welcome. I'm old school southern and charging to the rescue is what we do.

You mean chivalry is not dead? I like that!

 

[Monitor]

"No other county understands or appreciates freedom like we do." Well, Carla, I'm sure that the thousands of Aussie troops who died and are buried in graves (known and unknown) across New Guinea and other Pacific islands stopping the Japanese 1942 - 1945, might just disagree with you. Australians, like our US brothers and sisters, have a long history of fighting for freedom, which we value just as much as you do.

 

[Carla Krawczyk]

"No other county understands or appreciates freedom like we do." Well, Carla, I'm sure that the thousands of Aussie troops who died and are buried in graves (known and unknown) across New Guinea and other Pacific islands stopping the Japanese 1942 - 1945, might just disagree with you. Australians, like our US brothers and sisters, have a long history of fighting for freedom, which we value just as much as you do.

I do apologize if I offended you or anybody else. Perhaps I worded my intention incorrectly. What I meant was that America is a very new country in comparison to others and was founded on freedom. This has been a real lesson in history for me. Thank you for your input.