Fredericksburg

[ErnieMac]

Same at Slaughter Pen at the other side of the battlefield. Sending a Division at a time forward. One would think someone like a Hancock or Meade would have talked him out of it.

Unfortunately, neither were in a position to do so. Meade would not obtain a corps command for nearly two weeks after the battle and Hancock was serving in his first battle as a division commander.

 

[Saphroneth]

The typical rule is that a two-deep line should be about 6,000 men per mile. That means a typical ANV Confederate division at this time should have a bit more than a mile of frontage.

 

[Saphroneth]

Burnside is the ranking general; if he wants something done, he has the authority to order it.
The people who are most at liberty to argue with him are his immediate subordinates, and in this case that means the GD commanders - Franklin, Hooker and Sumner. (They're not able to override him, though - if he issues specific orders they have to be obeyed, and at most the subordinate can exercise discretion in how they're done.)

Franklin originally outlined a concept of operation for the battle, and Burnside seemed to agree, but Burnside then issued orders which were different. Franklin appears to have employed his discretion to make the attack on his side as heavily as possible (and in fact heavier than the orders imply).
Burnside wouldn't have been willing to listen to Hooker - my understanding is that Burnside took the role partly to keep Hooker out of AotP command. Indeed Hooker did do a recce and advised against continuing the attack, but he was overridden.
Sumner was stressed and possibly unwell at the time. McClellan had previously recommended that Sumner be relieved on grounds of health, as he felt Sumner would be unable to survive another campaign, and indeed Sumner was so exhausted that when he went to his daughter's home before his next posting he caught a fever and died. In addition, Sumner had recommended occupying a tete du pont before the Confederates arrived, but Burnside refused.

 

[James N.]

Marye's is apparently 1500 feet long, but when you add the often overlooked adjoining Willis Hill you get another 1300 or so feet.
The gunners on both hills used a small tree to sight their pieces and set their fuses beforehand. As the federals passed the tree, shells were so welled timed they passed through and exploded inside the ranks for maximum kill power.
Yes Burnside made many mistakes as commander. The biggest I can't understand is why he didn't use his artillery to destroy the stone wall at Sunken road before sending his troops forward.
Hope you enjoyed your visit.

Although it turned out to be a vital part of the Confederate defense, it was probably both an unseen obstacle at that distance and at the extreme range of the twenty-pounder and thirty-pounder Parrotts on Stafford Heights across the Rappahannock. Also, during my visit in 2018 I was surprised to see that at least the stretch below was actually a stone-lined sunken road and not a wall at all:

 

[Kathy the history sleuth]

A very vivid battlefield visit in 1996 for me, certainly. Thanks.

I'll be there at the end of the month for what I'm sure will be just my first visit. It was perfect to read so much this month about it because of the anniversary. I too wonder why Burnside was allowed to continue and make even more mistakes.

 

[James N.]

I'll be there at the end of the month for what I'm sure will be just my first visit. It was perfect to read so much this month about it because of the anniversary. I too wonder why Burnside was allowed to continue and make even more mistakes.

In a word, politics. He was well-liked by the New Englanders, of which he was one; and the abolitionists too.

 

[Kathy the history sleuth]

In a word, politics. He was well-liked by the New Englanders, of which he was one; and the abolitionists too.

That explains it. It was inexplicable from his actions.

 

[Saphroneth]

There was a bit of a problem early in the war which was that the top ranks of the command structure needed populating, and people ended up very high up the ranks; they were then highly senior and it was often hard to shift them. Sumner, Heintzelman, Keyes, McDowell... there are plenty of other examples just in the East.

 

[Tony Z]

I've visited Fredericksburg a number of times, with the first around 1994. One must really walk Marye's Heights, to really appreciate/understand what happened. Also, walk the National Cemetary.

The area has had explosive growth through the years, with said growth encroaching every part of the battlefield. Thankfully we have protection through the National Park system.

 

[jackt62]

The area has had explosive growth through the years, with said growth encroaching every part of the battlefield. Thankfully we have protection through the National Park system.

That is very true. In fact, if one looks at photographs of many CW battle sites that were taken during the war or just thereafter, there is a big difference in the amount of tree growth between then and now.

 

[Cycom]

That is very true. In fact, if one looks at photographs of many CW battle sites that were taken during the war or just thereafter, there is a big difference in the amount of tree growth between then and now.

A lack of growth due to shelling?

 

[jackt62]

A lack of growth due to shelling?

Interesting point, but not what I was referring to. Vast expanses of United States land were still so-called virgin forest, which in the century and half since then have grown and encroached on previously open areas. Of course, many forested areas have also been cleared for suburban developments as for example in Atlanta, where almost all the battle sites have been overtaken by strip malls and housing tracts.

 

[Cycom]

Makes sense. Guess most forests, in time, would recover from massive artillery engagements

 

[Saphroneth]

Makes sense. Guess most forests, in time, would recover from massive artillery engagements

We actually have an example of what it takes to do damage that lasts ~100 years, which is the Zone Rouge in northeastern France. These were areas which were the focus of an unprecedented level of intense fighting which stayed in a small geographical area rather than ranging back and forth over time.

The number of shells fired in the Verdun fighting (the battle itself, not all the fighting over that terrain) for example was approximately 50 million over a small area, along with multiple poison gas attacks (some of them delivered by shell) and large quantities of dug fortifications. Despite this, much but not all of the Verdun area is in the Zone Rouge, and that area has in fact largely returned to nature (considered too dangerous for human habitation, owing to heavy metals contamination and unexploded ordnance).

 

[Woods-walker]

Although it turned out to be a vital part of the Confederate defense, it was probably both an unseen obstacle at that distance and at the extreme range of the twenty-pounder and thirty-pounder Parrotts on Stafford Heights across the Rappahannock. Also, during my visit in 2018 I was surprised to see that at least the stretch below was actually a stone-lined sunken road and not a wall at all:

View attachment 400108

I believe you will find the "Sunken road" was indeed sunken during the mid 19th century. The road has been through extensive changes since the war, including a moder-day asphalt which was applied in , I believe, the 1940's. It was open to through traffic until the 1970s, when it was built up once more with the current-day layer of gravel, dirt and sand.

 

[James N.]

I believe you will find the "Sunken road" was indeed sunken during the mid 19th century. The road has been through extensive changes since the war, including a moder-day asphalt which was applied in , I believe, the 1940's. It was open to through traffic until the 1970s, when it was built up once more with the current-day layer of gravel, dirt and sand.

That sounds much like the road leading out of Sharpsburg over Burnside's Bridge; when I first visited there with my mother in that Centennial year 1961 it was still open to vehicular traffic, so it was possible to actually DRIVE across the bridge until the NPS redirected traffic.

 

[American87]

Went to Fredericksburg Battlefield for the first time on 4/5/21. Given the length of the Confederate line - over 8 miles, I thought Marye's Heights would have been taller, deeper and wider. Was amazed that the sunken road was so close to Marye's Heights. I read about this site for years but seeing it was a game changer in my mind. In my mind Burnside is among the most tragic figures in the war. No one hated him but, man, was he over his head and he knew it. He told Lincoln as much but Lincoln assigned him anyway. What a tragedy...what a mess. How do you order 11 assaults on those heights and still be able to look at yourself in the mirror the next day.

BTW, the female park ranger was something to behold. I know this is inapropriate but I have to say, in a standard issue park uniform and with a mask covering half her face, there is no denying she was an extraordinary girl. Knew the battlefield like the back of her hand as well. What a combo!

I think you have to remember that the town was built up closer to Marye's Heights since the battle. In 1862, the Confederates would have had a much deeper field of fire than what there is today.

 

[Saphroneth]

Which mostly matters for artillery purposes.

 

[Woods-walker]

That sounds much like the road leading out of Sharpsburg over Burnside's Bridge; when I first visited there with my mother in that Centennial year 1961 it was still open to vehicular traffic, so it was possible to actually DRIVE across the bridge until the NPS redirected traffic.

Good point. My first trip to Sharpsburg was 1962. I don't recall driving across the bridge but , my memory was that we drove up to it. I could be wrong.

 

[James N.]

Good point. My first trip to Sharpsburg was 1962. I don't recall driving across the bridge but , my memory was that we drove up to it. I could be wrong.

That changed sometime between 1961 and my next visit in 1964 when we found it different; likely that was one of the changes made for the Centennial of the battle the year you first visited, which also included the opening of the then-brand-new Visitor Center.