Chancellorsville Confederate Casualties during Jackson's Flank Attack

[New Haven]

May 2, 1863 between 6 and 9 on the 2nd, NOT MAY 3---this is all during Jackson's last 3 hours of his attack
If you disagree please tell me.
I know a lot of you had relatives there and let me know if you are related to any of them. The more I study this I think the real heroes at Chancellorsville were from North Carolina. I think the 18th NC has gotten a unfair bad rap. And the more I study Brigadier General James Lane I am beginning to see how great the Branch-Lane Brigade was from the very beginning to the very end.
This is my source

Second Corps of the Confederate Army of Northern Virginia in May 1863

Organization of the Second Corps of the Confederate Army of Northern Virginia in May of 1863 in the American Civil War

civilwarintheeast.com

Here's the list:

Rodes' (D.H. Hill's) Division May 2 1863

Major David Rowe (mw 5/2) 12th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Philip Cook (w 5/2) 4th Georgia Infantry Regiment
Colonel Thomas W. Garrett (w 5/2) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Major William J. Hill (w 5/2) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Captain Speight B. West (w) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Thomas F. Toon (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Nelson Slough (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Major John S. Brooks (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Brigadier General Stephen D. Ramseur (w 5/2) 2nd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William Cox (w 5/2) 2nd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Edward A. O'Neal (w 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Lieutenant Colonel E. Lafayette Hobson (w 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Captain W. T. Renfro (mw 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Lieutenant Colonel John S. Garvin (w 5/2) 26th Alabama Infantry Regiment

A.P. Hill's Division, May 2, 1863

Major General Ambrose Powell Hill (w 5/2)
Brigadier General Henry Heth (w 5/2)
Brigadier General Dorsey Pender (w 5/2)
Captain S. D. Stewart (k) 5th Alabama Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel James Aiked (w 5/2) 13th Alabama Infantry
Major John T. Smith (k 5/2) 13th Alabama Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel John A. Fite (w 5/2) 7th Tennessee Infantry
Colonel William McComb (w 5/2) 14th Tennessee Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Fleet W. Cox (w 5/2) 40th Virginia Infantry
Colonel Francis Mallory (k 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel William S. Christian (w 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Major Andrew D. Saunders (k 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Colonel Edward G. Haywood (w 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Junius L. Hill (k 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Major William L. Davidson (w 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Thomas J. Purdie (k 5/2) 18th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Forney George (w 5/2) 18th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Mark M. Avery (w 5/2) 33rd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William M. Barbour (w 5/2) 37th North Carolina Infantry
Brigadier General J Samuel McGowan (w 5/2)
Colonel Oliver E. Edwards (mw 5/2)
Colonel James M. Perrin (mw 5/2) 1st South Carolina Rifle
Colonel Oliver E. Edwards (mw 5/2) 13th South Carolina Infantry
Colonel Alfred M. Scales (w 5/2) 13th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel William A. Stowe (w 5/2) 16th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William A. Stowe (w 5/2) 16th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Christopher C. Cole (k 5/2) 22nd North Carolina Infantry
Major Laben Odell (k 5/2) 22nd North Carolina Infantry
Captain Greenlee Davidson (mw 5/2) Richmond Letcher (VA) Artillery

 

[W Charles Young]

Time has precluded me from taking a deep dive into this list. I did find in the OR's within the report of the 55th Virginia, that Major Andrew D. Saunders was killed on May 3rd. The source you are using might need further investigation and the list further confirmation.

 

[General JJ]

A great majority of these officer casualties certainly happened on May 3rd. Hill's Division was in the third line during the flank attack, and only lightly engaged, if at all.

Rodes' division was more seriously engaged against the 11th Corps, who did put up enough resistance to cause moderate casualties in some of his brigades. But still, most of the officer casualties were sustained on the 3rd.

 

[New Haven]

Time has precluded me from taking a deep dive into this list. I did find in the OR's within the report of the 55th Virginia, that Major Andrew D. Saunders was killed on May 3rd. The source you are using might need further investigation and the list further confirmation.

A great majority of these officer casualties certainly happened on May 3rd. Hill's Division was in the third line during the flank attack, and only lightly engaged, if at all.

Rodes' division was more seriously engaged against the 11th Corps, who did put up enough resistance to cause moderate casualties in some of his brigades. But still, most of the officer casualties were sustained on the 3rd.

OK I did use a reference that lists those casualties. Do you have a reference that refutes it? The point I am making here is that the 11th, and the Bushbeck line(just purchased by American Battlefield Trust) begins to tell another story. It was only through some deep digging that I found these occurring on May 2. You have to remember that everyone was told that the 11th ran off. I found Dilger---a Medal of Honor winner that held Jackson up long enough to runout the daylight. I found out that Jackson was a late riser that day and started two hours after daybreak . I want to know more. Now either the Union army caused those May 2 casualties or the Confederates were running a circular firing squad that went beyond Jackson. I am now counting bodies and it seems as if there has been some underreporting. I am ready if anyone wants to do a play by play headcount

 

[Luke Freet]

May 2, 1863 between 6 and 9 on the 2nd, NOT MAY 3---this is all during Jackson's last 3 hours of his attack
If you disagree please tell me.
I know a lot of you had relatives there and let me know if you are related to any of them. The more I study this I think the real heroes at Chancellorsville were from North Carolina. I think the 18th NC has gotten a unfair bad rap. And the more I study Brigadier General James Lane I am beginning to see how great the Branch-Lane Brigade was from the very beginning to the very end.
This is my source

Second Corps of the Confederate Army of Northern Virginia in May 1863

Organization of the Second Corps of the Confederate Army of Northern Virginia in May of 1863 in the American Civil War

civilwarintheeast.com

Here's the list:

Rodes' (D.H. Hill's) Division May 2 1863

Major David Rowe (mw 5/2) 12th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Philip Cook (w 5/2) 4th Georgia Infantry Regiment
Colonel Thomas W. Garrett (w 5/2) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Major William J. Hill (w 5/2) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Captain Speight B. West (w) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Thomas F. Toon (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Nelson Slough (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Major John S. Brooks (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Brigadier General Stephen D. Ramseur (w 5/2) 2nd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William Cox (w 5/2) 2nd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Edward A. O'Neal (w 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Lieutenant Colonel E. Lafayette Hobson (w 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Captain W. T. Renfro (mw 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Lieutenant Colonel John S. Garvin (w 5/2) 26th Alabama Infantry Regiment

A.P. Hill's Division, May 2, 1863

Major General Ambrose Powell Hill (w 5/2)
Brigadier General Henry Heth (w 5/2)
Brigadier General Dorsey Pender (w 5/2)
Captain S. D. Stewart (k) 5th Alabama Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel James Aiked (w 5/2) 13th Alabama Infantry
Major John T. Smith (k 5/2) 13th Alabama Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel John A. Fite (w 5/2) 7th Tennessee Infantry
Colonel William McComb (w 5/2) 14th Tennessee Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Fleet W. Cox (w 5/2) 40th Virginia Infantry
Colonel Francis Mallory (k 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel William S. Christian (w 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Major Andrew D. Saunders (k 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Colonel Edward G. Haywood (w 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Junius L. Hill (k 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Major William L. Davidson (w 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Thomas J. Purdie (k 5/2) 18th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Forney George (w 5/2) 18th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Mark M. Avery (w 5/2) 33rd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William M. Barbour (w 5/2) 37th North Carolina Infantry
Brigadier General J Samuel McGowan (w 5/2)
Colonel Oliver E. Edwards (mw 5/2)
Colonel James M. Perrin (mw 5/2) 1st South Carolina Rifle
Colonel Oliver E. Edwards (mw 5/2) 13th South Carolina Infantry
Colonel Alfred M. Scales (w 5/2) 13th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel William A. Stowe (w 5/2) 16th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William A. Stowe (w 5/2) 16th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Christopher C. Cole (k 5/2) 22nd North Carolina Infantry
Major Laben Odell (k 5/2) 22nd North Carolina Infantry
Captain Greenlee Davidson (mw 5/2) Richmond Letcher (VA) Artillery

All reports show that Heth & Pender were not wounded on the 2nd of May. In fact, A. P. Hill's Division was not heavily engaged on May 2nd. The vast majority of the casualties suffered by Jackson on May 2nd came in Rodes' Division, though more specifically Doles & O'Neal. I need to check again, but i believe one of Doles' regiments lost 100 men on May 2nd from their total battle loss of 123 throughout the battle.
According to J.E.B. Stuart's report for Second Corps, on the "Sunday Battle" (May 3rd), Heth, Ramseur & McGowan were among those reported wounded, with Elisha Paxton reported killed. To my knowledge, Ramseur & McGowan were not significantly engaged until May 3rd.
Rodes' Divisional report (O.R. Volume 25 Part 1 pg. 939-949) gives the following table in the appendix regarding his senior officers in the battle, which also notes what dates the officers were killed/wounded on.

According to Heth's report for A. P. Hill's Light Division: It appears Heth's Brigade was involved in the late night sortie after Jackson's wounding, where Colonel Mallory of the 55th Virginia was killed. Heth took command from A. P. Hill after he was wounded, and thus was in command on the morning of May 3rd. McGowan was wounded in the assault on May 3rd; Col. Oliver E. Edwards assumed command of McGowan's Brigade before his mortal wounding soon after.
Captain Betts, 40th Virginia, reported the loss of 1 officer (Capt. A. J. Syndor) wounded & 10 or 12 enlisted men killed or wounded on May 2nd during the sortie. The regiments remaining losses, both officers & enlisted men, were sustained on May 3rd.
Lt. Col. William Christian, 55th Virginia, reported Colonel Mallory's death & his own wounding on May 2nd, though most of the rest of the regiment's officer casualties were sustained on May 3rd. No breakdown in losses between the two days is known, neither with 47th Virginia's report.
Pender's brigade report barely talks about May 2nd, implying they were not engaged, while giving a detailed description of the brigade's actions on May 3rd, going so far as to estimate his brigade's casualties that day at around 700 officers & men lost.
I'd dig more but I also don't have the time for this. 99% of these guys were killed or wounded on May 3rd, when Lee was flinging the Second Corps against Hooker's lines, unless otherwise noted.
I'll dig up some of the full casualty tables when I've got the time. I've got my own projects I'm working on, thought I'd might lend a helping hand as I have been given by other members back in my early days here.

 

[New Haven]

All reports show that Heth & Pender were not wounded on the 2nd of May. In fact, A. P. Hill's Division was not heavily engaged on May 2nd. The vast majority of the casualties suffered by Jackson on May 2nd came in Rodes' Division, though more specifically Doles & O'Neal. I need to check again, but i believe one of Doles' regiments lost 100 men on May 2nd from their total battle loss of 123 throughout the battle.
According to J.E.B. Stuart's report for Second Corps, on the "Sunday Battle" (May 3rd), Heth, Ramseur & McGowan were among those reported wounded, with Elisha Paxton reported killed. To my knowledge, Ramseur & McGowan were not significantly engaged until May 3rd.
Rodes' Divisional report (O.R. Volume 25 Part 1 pg. 939-949) gives the following table in the appendix regarding his senior officers in the battle, which also notes what dates the officers were killed/wounded on.

View attachment 483200View attachment 483201
According to Heth's report for A. P. Hill's Light Division: It appears Heth's Brigade was involved in the late night sortie after Jackson's wounding, where Colonel Mallory of the 55th Virginia was killed. Heth took command from A. P. Hill after he was wounded, and thus was in command on the morning of May 3rd. McGowan was wounded in the assault on May 3rd; Col. Oliver E. Edwards assumed command of McGowan's Brigade before his mortal wounding soon after.
Captain Betts, 40th Virginia, reported the loss of 1 officer (Capt. A. J. Syndor) wounded & 10 or 12 enlisted men killed or wounded on May 2nd during the sortie. The regiments remaining losses, both officers & enlisted men, were sustained on May 3rd.
Lt. Col. William Christian, 55th Virginia, reported Colonel Mallory's death & his own wounding on May 2nd, though most of the rest of the regiment's officer casualties were sustained on May 3rd. No breakdown in losses between the two days is known, neither with 47th Virginia's report.
Pender's brigade report barely talks about May 2nd, implying they were not engaged, while giving a detailed description of the brigade's actions on May 3rd, going so far as to estimate his brigade's casualties that day at around 700 officers & men lost.
I'd dig more but I also don't have the time for this. 99% of these guys were killed or wounded on May 3rd, when Lee was flinging the Second Corps against Hooker's lines, unless otherwise noted.
I'll dig up some of the full casualty tables when I've got the time. I've got my own projects I'm working on, thought I'd might lend a helping hand as I have been given by other members back in my early days here.

Thank you for the help. I gave also been reading the individual company/brigade reports by the unit historian. Some of the numbers begin to vary.

 

[Belfoured]

OK I did use a reference that lists those casualties. Do you have a reference that refutes it? The point I am making here is that the 11th, and the Bushbeck line(just purchased by American Battlefield Trust) begins to tell another story. It was only through some deep digging that I found these occurring on May 2. You have to remember that everyone was told that the 11th ran off. I found Dilger---a Medal of Honor winner that held Jackson up long enough to runout the daylight. I found out that Jackson was a late riser that day and started two hours after daybreak . I want to know more. Now either the Union army caused those May 2 casualties or the Confederates were running a circular firing squad that went beyond Jackson. I am now counting bodies and it seems as if there has been some underreporting. I am ready if anyone wants to do a play by play headcount

I found Dilger---a Medal of Honor winner that held Jackson up long enough to runout the daylight

I wouldn't overstate what he was able to accomplish with 6 M1857 Napoleons. After the initial confrontation (in which he lost one piece) he staged a fighting withdrawal with one piece and sent his remaining guns to the rear. Dilger performed manificently but Battery I 1st Ohio did not accomplish what you think it did. Nor could it have ...

 

[New Haven]

I wouldn't overstate what he was able to accomplish with 6 M1857 Napoleons. After the initial confrontation (in which he lost one piece) he staged a fighting withdrawal with one piece and sent his remaining guns to the rear. Dilger performed manificently but Battery I 1st Ohio did not accomplish what you think it did. Nor could it have ...

Corporal Sidney Allen's gun fired canister and round shot down the Plank Road into the ranks of Jackson's troops during the desperate retreat of the 11th Corps on the evening of May 2nd. Corporal Allen likened it to shooting rounds down a bowling alley and stated "I think we made some ten strikes."​ Our battery took position and did nobly- not a man left his post. We stayed until our infantry was all gone and the Rebels were within ten rods of us. We sweetened them nicely with canister. I think more Rebels fell from the shots of my gun than they killed in our whole corps. Captain Dilger took my gun out into the road and I kept it clear, for as often as they would fill it up, it was cleared with a few rounds of canister. We retreated slowly down the road firing at nearly every step and had no infantry to support us. I was wounded after we retreated over a mile and half and came very near being captured. After the other corps came up and checked the Rebels, General Carl Schurz came up and inquired what gun came down the road. Captain Dilger told him and he came and shook hands with all the men. He said he never saw such determined bravery in all his life and did not know that men could work a gun under such a fire.

 

[Belfoured]

View attachment 483246

Corporal Sidney Allen's gun fired canister and round shot down the Plank Road into the ranks of Jackson's troops during the desperate retreat of the 11th Corps on the evening of May 2nd. Corporal Allen likened it to shooting rounds down a bowling alley and stated "I think we made some ten strikes."​ Our battery took position and did nobly- not a man left his post. We stayed until our infantry was all gone and the Rebels were within ten rods of us. We sweetened them nicely with canister. I think more Rebels fell from the shots of my gun than they killed in our whole corps. Captain Dilger took my gun out into the road and I kept it clear, for as often as they would fill it up, it was cleared with a few rounds of canister. We retreated slowly down the road firing at nearly every step and had no infantry to support us. I was wounded after we retreated over a mile and half and came very near being captured. After the other corps came up and checked the Rebels, General Carl Schurz came up and inquired what gun came down the road. Captain Dilger told him and he came and shook hands with all the men. He said he never saw such determined bravery in all his life and did not know that men could work a gun under such a fire.

I think more Rebels fell from the shots of my gun than they killed in our whole corps

Here's a friendly suggestion - apply some common sense and skepticism to personal accounts like this. The proposition is ridiculous on its face. Allen's statement in his letter to the hometown newspaper refers to the initial position of the battery, where it was closed on by the infantry and where it had to quickly limber up and flee while leaving one piece behind. This is one M1857. If you were familiar with the casualty rates actually inflicted by artillery rounds (including canister), you would understand the absurd character of this statement. There are a lot of highly dramatic primary accounts about the devastation wreaked by canister which are exaggerated.

Moreover, the steps required to "clear" the gun after firing a few rounds, and to load and fire, didn't happen at warp speed.The notion that one M1857 Napoleon withdrawing and occasionally firing materially stoned an assault by c. 25,000 troops speaks for itself.

 

[New Haven]

Here's a friendly suggestion - apply some common sense and skepticism to personal accounts like this. The proposition is ridiculous on its face. Allen's statement in his letter to the hometown newspaper refers to the initial position of the battery, where it was closed on by the infantry and where it had to quickly limber up and flee while leaving one piece behind. This is one M1857. If you were familiar with the casualty rates actually inflicted by artillery rounds (including canister), you would understand the absurd character of this statement. There are a lot of highly dramatic primary accounts about the devastation wreaked by canister which are exaggerated.

Moreover, the steps required to "clear" the gun after firing a few rounds, and to load and fire, didn't happen at warp speed.The notion that one M1857 Napoleon withdrawing and occasionally firing materially stoned an assault by c. 25,000 troops speaks for itself.

Not my quote. Do you think his MOH should be revoked posthumously?
The President of the United States of America, in the name of Congress, takes pleasure in presenting the Medal of Honor to Captain (Field Artillery) Hubert Dilger, United States Army, for extraordinary heroism on 2 May 1863, while serving with Battery I, 1st Ohio Light Artillery, in action at Chancellorsville, Virginia. Captain Dilger fought his guns until the enemy were upon him, then with one gun hauled in the road by hand he formed the rear guard and kept the enemy at bay by the rapidity of his fire and was the last man in the retreat.

And Belfoured, Do you think it was Dilger's gun that bagged the Bishop about a year later?
Major General Joseph Hooker, Major General Oliver Howard, and Captain Hubert "Leatherbritches" Dilger, the Union Champions of Chancellorsville, who were supposedly defeated there, went on to a very illustrious military career after that battle. About a year later, at Pine Mountain, Georgia on June 14, 1874 all three played a part in the killing of the "The Bishop" General Polk. General Sherman himself was down below and spotted the group of Rebel officers, Johnston, Hardee and Polk. "How saucy they are!" General Howard remembered Sherman saying. Sherman ordered nearby batteries to open fire. A German soldier nicknamed "Leatherbritches" Dilger fired his 12-pounder cannon, killing Bishop Polk as he stood on the crest of the mountain. Interesting note is that Dilger received the Medal of Honor for his performance at Chancellorsville that caused another delay for Stonewall Jackson. Jackson was already running late because of his late start from oversleeping that day in May 1963 according to my friends at the Trust.

Either way Belfoured he was the fashion king of the Civil War. I don't think the Confederates had anyone to match the Leatherbritches

 

[New Haven]

A great majority of these officer casualties certainly happened on May 3rd. Hill's Division was in the third line during the flank attack, and only lightly engaged, if at all.

Rodes' division was more seriously engaged against the 11th Corps, who did put up enough resistance to cause moderate casualties in some of his brigades. But still, most of the officer casualties were sustained on the 3rd.

Thank you. Do you think that the 11th, Dilger, and the Bushbeck Line held Jackson up long enough to run out the daylight clock? So if , a lot of guys on here like to play what if, they did not impede his progress he might have lived?

 

[General JJ]

Thank you. Do you think that the 11th, Dilger, and the Bushbeck Line held Jackson up long enough to run out the daylight clock? So if , a lot of guys on here like to play what if, they did not impede his progress he might have lived?

The 11th Corps made a couple stands to slow down the rebel juggernaut. Von Gilsa's brigade was the first to be struck, and only fired a couple volleys before they were completely overwhelmed. McLean's brigade had a little more notice, and put up enough resistance to absorb heavy casualties, but overall I doubt that Devens' division was able to slow the rebel advance. That was through no fault of the soldiers, but Devens' ignorance.

Schurz' division was able to make a stand, and subsequent fighting withdrawal at the Wilderness Church, before they fell back onto the Bushbeck Line, where they rallied around Buschbeck's brigade. I believe this line held the longest, before it was completely routed, its flanks turned.

The poor generalship of the 11th Corps and Hooker caused the corps' defeat, that is certain. But I do think an argument could be made that Schurz' and Buschbeck's fighting was important, as it slowed Jackson down enough for night to fall, before he could do even more damage.

 

[Belfoured]

Not my quote. Do you think his MOH should be revoked posthumously?
The President of the United States of America, in the name of Congress, takes pleasure in presenting the Medal of Honor to Captain (Field Artillery) Hubert Dilger, United States Army, for extraordinary heroism on 2 May 1863, while serving with Battery I, 1st Ohio Light Artillery, in action at Chancellorsville, Virginia. Captain Dilger fought his guns until the enemy were upon him, then with one gun hauled in the road by hand he formed the rear guard and kept the enemy at bay by the rapidity of his fire and was the last man in the retreat.

And Belfoured, Do you think it was Dilger's gun that bagged the Bishop about a year later?
Major General Joseph Hooker, Major General Oliver Howard, and Captain Hubert "Leatherbritches" Dilger, the Union Champions of Chancellorsville, who were supposedly defeated there, went on to a very illustrious military career after that battle. About a year later, at Pine Mountain, Georgia on June 14, 1874 all three played a part in the killing of the "The Bishop" General Polk. General Sherman himself was down below and spotted the group of Rebel officers, Johnston, Hardee and Polk. "How saucy they are!" General Howard remembered Sherman saying. Sherman ordered nearby batteries to open fire. A German soldier nicknamed "Leatherbritches" Dilger fired his 12-pounder cannon, killing Bishop Polk as he stood on the crest of the mountain. Interesting note is that Dilger received the Medal of Honor for his performance at Chancellorsville that caused another delay for Stonewall Jackson. Jackson was already running late because of his late start from oversleeping that day in May 1963 according to my friends at the Trust.

Either way Belfoured he was the fashion king of the Civil War. I don't think the Confederates had anyone to match the Leatherbritches

Do you think his MOH should be revoked posthumously?

No. Show me where I said that he didn't earn it. That said, I very strongly recommend reading up on the criteria for the MOH and how it significantly changed after a boatload were awarded in the 1890's - often at the behest of the recipients themselves. Approximately half of those ever awarded were for the Civil War. Now of course it's possible that those guys were just far more prone to acts of courage than the larger numbers who have served since in WW I, WW II, Korea, Viet Nam, Iraq, etc. Or .....

Do you think it was Dilger's gun that bagged the Bishop about a year later?

No on that one, as well. In the report of Brig. Gen William Grose, he states specifically that it was a shot fired by the Fifth Independent Battery, Indiana Light (commanded by Capt. Peter Simonson, who was KIA two days later). There are other sources supporting this. IIRC, by this point it had four 3" Ordnance Rifles. Those would be more likely candidates for "sharp shooting" at an individual/group of a few individuals.

 

[Belfoured]

The 11th Corps made a couple stands to slow down the rebel juggernaut. Von Gilsa's brigade was the first to be struck, and only fired a couple volleys before they were completely overwhelmed. McLean's brigade had a little more notice, and put up enough resistance to absorb heavy casualties, but overall I doubt that Devens' division was able to slow the rebel advance. That was through no fault of the soldiers, but Devens' ignorance.

Schurz' division was able to make a stand, and subsequent fighting withdrawal at the Wilderness Church, before they fell back onto the Bushbeck Line, where they rallied around Buschbeck's brigade. I believe this line held the longest, before it was completely routed, its flanks turned.

The poor generalship of the 11th Corps and Hooker caused the corps' defeat, that is certain. But I do think an argument could be made that Schurz' and Buschbeck's fighting was important, as it slowed Jackson down enough for night to fall, before he could do even more damage.

Fair point, although I've always thought the bigger reason was Jackson's late deployment and then late commencement of the attack. I think the extent of resistance was (understandably) embellished some by the reports that were submitted later. It' a good idea to keep in mind that CO's weren't prone to reporting that their own units bolted - as opposed to those commanded by others. I also have always believed that at some point in the attack the terrain exerted its influence on how that was progressing.

 

[General JJ]

It' a good idea to keep in mind that CO's weren't prone to reporting that their own units bolted - as opposed to those commanded by others. I also have always believed that at some point in the attack the terrain exerted its influence on how that was progressing.

I do agree that the late deployment and commencement were the major reasons. But the Wilderness Church and Buschbeck lines are worth consideration as well.

Oh 100%, commanders were usually reluctant to admit if their unit routed, and some embellishment occured. But I do think the casualties in most of Schurz and Buschbeck's troops show that they didn't flee at the first fire, with the exception of maybe a couple units. (Thinking the 61st OH and 74th PA, but both units rallied at the Buschbeck Line)

 

[jtabn82]

May 2, 1863 between 6 and 9 on the 2nd, NOT MAY 3---this is all during Jackson's last 3 hours of his attack
If you disagree please tell me.
I know a lot of you had relatives there and let me know if you are related to any of them. The more I study this I think the real heroes at Chancellorsville were from North Carolina. I think the 18th NC has gotten a unfair bad rap. And the more I study Brigadier General James Lane I am beginning to see how great the Branch-Lane Brigade was from the very beginning to the very end.
This is my source

Second Corps of the Confederate Army of Northern Virginia in May 1863

Organization of the Second Corps of the Confederate Army of Northern Virginia in May of 1863 in the American Civil War

civilwarintheeast.com

Here's the list:

Rodes' (D.H. Hill's) Division May 2 1863

Major David Rowe (mw 5/2) 12th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Philip Cook (w 5/2) 4th Georgia Infantry Regiment
Colonel Thomas W. Garrett (w 5/2) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Major William J. Hill (w 5/2) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Captain Speight B. West (w) 5th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Thomas F. Toon (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Nelson Slough (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Major John S. Brooks (w 5/2) 20th North Carolina Infantry
Brigadier General Stephen D. Ramseur (w 5/2) 2nd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William Cox (w 5/2) 2nd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Edward A. O'Neal (w 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Lieutenant Colonel E. Lafayette Hobson (w 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Captain W. T. Renfro (mw 5/2) 5th Alabama Infantry Regiment
Lieutenant Colonel John S. Garvin (w 5/2) 26th Alabama Infantry Regiment

A.P. Hill's Division, May 2, 1863

Major General Ambrose Powell Hill (w 5/2)
Brigadier General Henry Heth (w 5/2)
Brigadier General Dorsey Pender (w 5/2)
Captain S. D. Stewart (k) 5th Alabama Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel James Aiked (w 5/2) 13th Alabama Infantry
Major John T. Smith (k 5/2) 13th Alabama Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel John A. Fite (w 5/2) 7th Tennessee Infantry
Colonel William McComb (w 5/2) 14th Tennessee Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Fleet W. Cox (w 5/2) 40th Virginia Infantry
Colonel Francis Mallory (k 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel William S. Christian (w 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Major Andrew D. Saunders (k 5/2) 55th Virginia Infantry
Colonel Edward G. Haywood (w 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Junius L. Hill (k 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Major William L. Davidson (w 5/2) 7th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Thomas J. Purdie (k 5/2) 18th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Forney George (w 5/2) 18th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel Mark M. Avery (w 5/2) 33rd North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William M. Barbour (w 5/2) 37th North Carolina Infantry
Brigadier General J Samuel McGowan (w 5/2)
Colonel Oliver E. Edwards (mw 5/2)
Colonel James M. Perrin (mw 5/2) 1st South Carolina Rifle
Colonel Oliver E. Edwards (mw 5/2) 13th South Carolina Infantry
Colonel Alfred M. Scales (w 5/2) 13th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel William A. Stowe (w 5/2) 16th North Carolina Infantry
Colonel William A. Stowe (w 5/2) 16th North Carolina Infantry
Lieutenant Colonel Christopher C. Cole (k 5/2) 22nd North Carolina Infantry
Major Laben Odell (k 5/2) 22nd North Carolina Infantry
Captain Greenlee Davidson (mw 5/2) Richmond Letcher (VA) Artillery

What about Doles' Brigade of Georgians? Hard fighters in all their battles but rarely recognized.

 

[J. Felton]

All reports show that Heth & Pender were not wounded on the 2nd of May. In fact, A. P. Hill's Division was not heavily engaged on May 2nd. The vast majority of the casualties suffered by Jackson on May 2nd came in Rodes' Division, though more specifically Doles & O'Neal. I need to check again, but i believe one of Doles' regiments lost 100 men on May 2nd from their total battle loss of 123 throughout the battle.
According to J.E.B. Stuart's report for Second Corps, on the "Sunday Battle" (May 3rd), Heth, Ramseur & McGowan were among those reported wounded, with Elisha Paxton reported killed. To my knowledge, Ramseur & McGowan were not significantly engaged until May 3rd.
Rodes' Divisional report (O.R. Volume 25 Part 1 pg. 939-949) gives the following table in the appendix regarding his senior officers in the battle, which also notes what dates the officers were killed/wounded on.

View attachment 483200View attachment 483201
According to Heth's report for A. P. Hill's Light Division: It appears Heth's Brigade was involved in the late night sortie after Jackson's wounding, where Colonel Mallory of the 55th Virginia was killed. Heth took command from A. P. Hill after he was wounded, and thus was in command on the morning of May 3rd. McGowan was wounded in the assault on May 3rd; Col. Oliver E. Edwards assumed command of McGowan's Brigade before his mortal wounding soon after.
Captain Betts, 40th Virginia, reported the loss of 1 officer (Capt. A. J. Syndor) wounded & 10 or 12 enlisted men killed or wounded on May 2nd during the sortie. The regiments remaining losses, both officers & enlisted men, were sustained on May 3rd.
Lt. Col. William Christian, 55th Virginia, reported Colonel Mallory's death & his own wounding on May 2nd, though most of the rest of the regiment's officer casualties were sustained on May 3rd. No breakdown in losses between the two days is known, neither with 47th Virginia's report.
Pender's brigade report barely talks about May 2nd, implying they were not engaged, while giving a detailed description of the brigade's actions on May 3rd, going so far as to estimate his brigade's casualties that day at around 700 officers & men lost.
I'd dig more but I also don't have the time for this. 99% of these guys were killed or wounded on May 3rd, when Lee was flinging the Second Corps against Hooker's lines, unless otherwise noted.
I'll dig up some of the full casualty tables when I've got the time. I've got my own projects I'm working on, thought I'd might lend a helping hand as I have been given by other members back in my early days here.

You are correct about Ramseur's Brigade. On May 2nd, they were in the second line of Rodes' Division in support of Alfred Colquitt on the right of the division. Colquitt imagined some Federal cavalry to his right and Ramseur moved up in support. By that time they were both not seriously engaged. However, on May 3rd, Ramseur was, I argue (hopefully soon to be published) the deciding attack on Fairview Heights

 

[13 IL Cav & 64 GA Inf]

OK I did use a reference that lists those casualties. Do you have a reference that refutes it? The point I am making here is that the 11th, and the Bushbeck line(just purchased by American Battlefield Trust) begins to tell another story. It was only through some deep digging that I found these occurring on May 2. You have to remember that everyone was told that the 11th ran off. I found Dilger---a Medal of Honor winner that held Jackson up long enough to runout the daylight. I found out that Jackson was a late riser that day and started two hours after daybreak . I want to know more. Now either the Union army caused those May 2 casualties or the Confederates were running a circular firing squad that went beyond Jackson. I am now counting bodies and it seems as if there has been some underreporting. I am ready if anyone wants to do a play by play headcount

I thought that Dilger got the Medal of Honor for his actions with artillery on May 3rd. Will look further into this.

 

[rpkennedy]

I thought that Dilger got the Medal of Honor for his actions with artillery on May 3rd. Will look further into this.

May 2. The citation reads:

Fought his guns until the enemy were upon him, then with one gun hauled in the road by hand he formed the rear guard and kept the enemy at bay by the rapidity of his fire and was the last man in the retreat.

Ryan

 

[13 IL Cav & 64 GA Inf]

May 2. The citation reads:


Ryan

Love it. Brave indeed!