'Clouds of Glory' covers Robert E. Lee

[CMWinkler]

Clouds of Glory' covers Robert E. Lee
Gregory Korte, USA TODAY , USA TODAY 2:03 p.m. EDT June 1, 2014

Clouds of Glory: The Life and Legend of Robert E. Lee
by Michael Korda
(Harper)
in History
USA TODAY Rating

Confederate Gen. Robert E. Lee often concluded orders to his generals with polite phrases easily misinterpreted as escape clauses. On the first day of the Battle of Gettysburg, he ordered Lt. Gen. Richard Ewell to Cemetery Hill and told him to "Take that hill, if practicable."

Ewell decided it wasn't.

Lee's ability to dig in and defend while launching quick, unexpected flanking attacks worked miracles for the Army of Northern Virginia while Lt. Gen. Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson was alive. Jackson had an almost telepathic understanding of what Lee wanted to accomplish, even as Lee gave Jackson leeway in deciding how to accomplish it.

For the rest: http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/...-the-life-and-legend-of-robert-e-lee/9321687/

 

[chellers]

Thanks for the reviews, Mr. Winkler.

 

[NedBaldwin]

"Jackson had an almost telepathic understanding of what Lee wanted to accomplish"

Can anyone given me an example of what this is talking about?

 

[NedBaldwin]

"But at Gettysburg, Lee's vague, non-existent or insufficiently stern orders caused Ewell to effectively sit out the first day of fighting..."

This seems grossly unfair to Ewell. His Corps suffered over 2,000 casualties on the first day of fighting.

 

[Elennsar]

The second day, on the other hand, leaves quite a bit to be desired on Ewell's part.

Interesting sounding book.

 

[dvrmte]

"Jackson had an almost telepathic understanding of what Lee wanted to accomplish"

Can anyone given me an example of what this is talking about?

One example might be Jackson at Gordonsville confronting Pope.

July 26, 1862
I will send you A.P. Hill's division. I want Pope suppressed. Cache your troops as much as possible till you can strike a blow, and be prepared to return to me when done, if necessary. I will endeavor to keep General McClellan quit till it is over, if rapidly executed.

Another would be while Jackson was at Winchester prior to the Battle of Fredericksburg. Lee and Longstreet were at Fredericksburg 175 miles from Jackson. Lee's orders:

"remain in the valley as long as you see your presence there cripples and embarrasses the general movement of the enemy, and yet leaves you free to unite with Longstreet for a battle."

There were no following orders from Lee, Jackson perceived when to move.

 

[NedBaldwin]

Another would be while Jackson was at Winchester prior to the Battle of Fredericksburg. Lee and Longstreet were at Fredericksburg 175 miles from Jackson. Lee's orders:

"remain in the valley as long as you see your presence there cripples and embarrasses the general movement of the enemy, and yet leaves you free to unite with Longstreet for a battle."

Lee was at Culpeper (about 60 miles from Winchester) when he wrote that

 

[whitworth]

No clouds of glory covered R.E. Lee in the Civil War. He exercised his tyranny and rebelled against the United States, a government he had served as an army officer for some thirty years. If there was any saving grace, Lee accepted defeat for the remaining five years of his life and refused to rebel against the U.S. government again.

Lee lost on a number of fronts leading his army into Pennsylvania. The blame for Ewell rests with Lee and his original orders to separate his army widely in Pennsylvania. Ewell's army was spread over much of central PA. Part was in the Carlisle/Harrisburg area and part was near York and Wrightsville on the Susquehanna river. It was not Ewell's decision. Nor was it Ewell's decision to quickly assemble this spread out corps near Gettysburg. It wasn't Ewell's fault that he met the Union army near Gettysburg, fought in the 90 degree heat for much of the daylight hours after rapidly marching there, and then received an order, not clear, to take an already fortified hill, as it turns out, with not all his corps available for a late attack that day. A division of troops and his reserve artillery had not arrived to assist in any assault of Cemetery Hill.
It wasn't Ewell's fault that the Union army had left a division and union artillery on Cemetery Ridge, pending the need to fortify a future point of Confederate attack.

It wasn't Ewell's fault that Lee totally underestimated the Union advance across the Potomac river, thereby not giving Ewell time to attack Harrisburg and cause Lee to rapidly recall Ewell and the rest of his army to meet at Gettysburg.
The cause of the defeat at Gettysburg laid with R.E. Lee. Not some other Confederate or Confederate Corps commander. The defeat laid with the planning and expectations of R. E. Lee. Lee lost Gettysburg.
Not Ewell, not Longstreet, not Hill, not Heth or some other minor general, nor the artillery horses that had supplies to feed them only three pounds of corn a day.

The Confederates best lost Gettysburg with too ambitious of an attack plan and an underestimation of the enemy. All due to its leader, General Robert E. Lee.
The Union army took advantage of the errors and beat the Confederates best.
R.E. Lee lost Gettysburg with his overestimation of his Confederate army and the underestimation of the Union army.

 

[Eagle eye]

Lee had no success north of the Potomac did he?

 

[mathias]

I will surely devour this one too. Thanks for the post CM!

 

[cash]

Considering Korda's book on Grant wasn't worth a plugged nickel, I'm very skeptical about this work. I haven't seen it yet, but based on what a few historians who read it have said, it has quite a few inaccuracies. I may wait until the library has a copy and check it out to read then and not risk any of my own money on it.

 

[godofredus]

Saint Robert never, apparently, understood artillery. He retained a man who has been characterized as a total incompetent as his chief of artilleryn William Pendleton. It was Federal artillery that ended what is commonly known as Pickett's charge. Lee totally misread the Federal artillery.

 

[Elennsar]

"Saint Robert" reorganized his artillery so as to all but render Pendleton's position nominal between Chancellorsville and Gettysburg. That has to be noted when talking about Lee's understanding of artillery. As does grouping batteries into battalions instead of clinging to the attachment of batteries to brigades (like was done by Bragg).

And Federal artillery alone did not end Pickett's Charge, despite Hunt's wishes.

There's plenty of room to criticize Lee without treating him as if he had no military skills except audacity and tact.

 

[godofredus]

"Saint Robert" reorganized his artillery so as to all but render Pendleton's position nominal between Chancellorsville and Gettysburg. That has to be noted when talking about Lee's understanding of artillery. As does grouping batteries into battalions instead of clinging to the attachment of batteries to brigades (like was done by Bragg).

And Federal artillery alone did not end Pickett's Charge, despite Hunt's wishes.

There's plenty of room to criticize Lee without treating him as if he had no military skills except audacity and tact.

As with Dan Sickles, goat or hero, Lee is never either. He is always a hero....my understanding of Lee's use of artillery at Gettysburg on the third day is 1) he fell for the USA's strategy of silencing the guns as though they had been put out of action 2) he assumed the huge pre-charge bombardment worked. I agree, USA "artillery alone did not end Pickett's Charge, despite Hunt's wishes." but it sure as heck helped.
It is not that I "criticize Lee without treating him as if he had no military skills except audacity and tact." it is just that over and over again INHO Lee gets a pass when anyone else would have been crucified.
I keep thinking of Grant's three pronged attack - Banks supposedly at Mobile, Sigel in the Valley, Butler in front of Richmond - all three men encountered disaster, but Banks got a pass, Butler still got another command, only Sigel was regulated to the backstage. I happen to like Butler, detest Banks and have a fondness for Sigel, but the way these three men were treated just proves to me that luck, personality, and political clout counted enormously in the writing of history as much as on the ground in the ACW.

 

[Elennsar]

As with Dan Sickles, goat or hero, Lee is never either. He is always a hero....my understanding of Lee's use of artillery at Gettysburg on the third day is 1) he fell for the USA's strategy of silencing the guns as though they had been put out of action 2) he assumed the huge pre-charge bombardment worked. I agree, USA "artillery alone did not end Pickett's Charge, despite Hunt's wishes." but it sure as heck helped.
It is not that I "criticize Lee without treating him as if he had no military skills except audacity and tact." it is just that over and over again INHO Lee gets a pass when anyone else would have been crucified.

Lee has been at times criticized. I'm not sure if many people would still agree with the early writings of him as an infallible figure.

And neither of those mistakes indicate that Lee "never understood artillery", and he wasn't the only Confederate who made those mistakes there to boot

I don't dispute it helped - Hunt's performance was magnificent. But artillery alone against charging infantry tends not to be enough.

But back on Lee:
While certainly Lee has been defended even in his blunders, I think you're presentation is making it sound as if Lee is merely benefiting from a zealous defense team regardless of any actual ability.

I keep thinking of Grant's three pronged attack - Banks supposedly at Mobile, Sigel in the Valley, Butler in front of Richmond - all three men encountered disaster, but Banks got a pass, Butler still got another command, only Sigel was regulated to the backstage. I happen to like Butler, detest Banks and have a fondness for Sigel, but the way these three men were treated just proves to me that luck, personality, and political clout counted enormously in the writing of history as much as on the ground in the ACW.

But what does that have to do with Lee's merits as a general?

I'd be happy to discuss with you on another thread on if Sigel was treated unfairly in that situation, but not this one.

 

[Rebforever]

Lee had no success north of the Potomac did he?

Yes. At Monacacy.

 

[Elennsar]

Yes. At Monacacy.

Even given that Early was operating independently (more in the sense of Jackson in the Valley than say Ewell in the Gettysburg campaign)?

Not trying to pick a fight or slight Lee, just curious how broadly you define the area where Lee as commander is deserving of credit or criticism. Presumably Hill's performance down in North Carolina in the spring of 1863 (technically subordinate to Lee) is different than say, South Mountain.

 

[CSA Today]

Yes. At Monacacy.

Wasn't it at Monacacy that the Confederates nearly picked off the rubbernecking Lincoln? Another glaring Confederate failure north of the Potomac.

 

[Rebforever]

Wasn't it at Monacacy that the Confederates nearly picked off the rubbernecking Lincoln? Another glaring Confederate failure north of the Potomac.

That was at Fort Stevens where Linclon watched General Early's attack.

 

[Rebforever]

Even given that Early was operating independently (more in the sense of Jackson in the Valley than say Ewell in the Gettysburg campaign)?

Not trying to pick a fight or slight Lee, just curious how broadly you define the area where Lee as commander is deserving of credit or criticism. Presumably Hill's performance down in North Carolina in the spring of 1863 (technically subordinate to Lee) is different than say, South Mountain.

General Early was ordered to do exactly what he did by General Lee.