Citizen POWs

[debwallsmith]

Does anyone know why civilian POWs were listed as citizens instead of civilians?

 

[RedRover]

From Webster's 1828 dictionary;

CIVILIAN, noun [from civil.]
1. One who is skilled in the Roman law; a professor or doctor of civil law.
2. In a more extended sense, one who is versed in law and government.
3. A student of the civil law at the university.

CITIZEN, noun
1. The native of a city, or an inhabitant who enjoys the freedom and privileges of the city in which he resides; the freeman of a city, as distinguished from a foreigner, or one not entitled to its franchises.
2. A townsman; a man of trade; not a gentleman.
3. An inhabitant; a dweller in any city, town or place.
4. In general sense, a native or permanent resident in a city or country; as the citizens of London or Philadelphia; the citizens of the United States.
5. In the United States, a person, native or naturalized, who has the privilege of exercising the elective franchise, or the qualifications which enable him to vote for rulers, and to purchase and hold real estate
CITIZEN, adjective Having the qualities of a citizen


A "prisoner of war" from Bouvier's law dictionary, volume 2 (1856);

 

[debwallsmith]

From Webster's 1828 dictionary;

CIVILIAN, noun [from civil.]
1. One who is skilled in the Roman law; a professor or doctor of civil law.
2. In a more extended sense, one who is versed in law and government.
3. A student of the civil law at the university.

CITIZEN, noun
1. The native of a city, or an inhabitant who enjoys the freedom and privileges of the city in which he resides; the freeman of a city, as distinguished from a foreigner, or one not entitled to its franchises.
2. A townsman; a man of trade; not a gentleman.
3. An inhabitant; a dweller in any city, town or place.
4. In general sense, a native or permanent resident in a city or country; as the citizens of London or Philadelphia; the citizens of the United States.
5. In the United States, a person, native or naturalized, who has the privilege of exercising the elective franchise, or the qualifications which enable him to vote for rulers, and to purchase and hold real estate
CITIZEN, adjective Having the qualities of a citizen


A "prisoner of war" from Bouvier's law dictionary, volume 2 (1856);

View attachment 519744

Thank you. I am familiar with the definitions of all of these terms. I am curious as to why civilians (those with no regimental affiliations) were listed as citizens rather than civilians in the Andersonville records.

 

[Gary Morgan]

Because they were not enrolled in the military or any organized type of police, rescue, or defense organization. A civilian is not a member of any sort of armed forces, but a citizen can be. All civilians are citizens, but not all citizens are civilians. A police officer, for example, would properly refer to himself as a citizen of his city or town, but he would refer to non-police or rescue people as civilians.

The citizens were working for an organization (usually the adjutant general's office as teamsters) when they were captured, but weren't technically soldiers. There were a few from the telegraph company and railroad as well. Being civilians totally screwed over their families when they got captured. If they weren't working as teamsters, they didn't get paid, and if they died or became disabled, they and their families were SOOL - there were no pensions or assistance provided to them, which really stunk.

Hope this helps. I struggled a bit with this one, along with the difference between hanged and hung (people are hanged; inanimate objects are hung).

I think I have a partially written chapter here somewhere on Citizen prisoners at Andersonville if you want to take a look.

 

[RedRover]

Thank you. I am familiar with the definitions of all of these terms. I am curious as to why civilians (those with no regimental affiliations) were listed as citizens rather than civilians in the Andersonville records.

In the prisoner cartels between the US Military and the CSA, the exchange of citizens held as prisoners was made allowance for.

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A number of citizens arrested by CS Military forces for various reasons were forwarded to prison at Andersonville, and a number of them died there.

Early in the war the Confederate Government had passed an act barring any citizens of the United States from the jurisdiction of the Confederacy, otherwise treating them as alien enemies of the Confederacy.

 

[debwallsmith]

Because they were not enrolled in the military or any organized type of police, rescue, or defense organization. A civilian is not a member of any sort of armed forces, but a citizen can be. All civilians are citizens, but not all citizens are civilians. A police officer, for example, would properly refer to himself as a citizen of his city or town, but he would refer to non-police or rescue people as civilians.

The citizens were working for an organization (usually the adjutant general's office as teamsters) when they were captured, but weren't technically soldiers. There were a few from the telegraph company and railroad as well. Being civilians totally screwed over their families when they got captured. If they weren't working as teamsters, they didn't get paid, and if they died or became disabled, they and their families were SOOL - there were no pensions or assistance provided to them, which really stunk.

Hope this helps. I struggled a bit with this one, along with the difference between hanged and hung (people are hanged; inanimate objects are hung).

I think I have a partially written chapter here somewhere on Citizen prisoners at Andersonville if you want to take a look.

Thanks for the explanation. I have actually located a relative of a "citizen" that was transferred to Millen. We're not certain but we think he was working for a railroad when he was captured. His job prior to the war was railroad track repair. For some unknown reason, I learned hanged and hung long time ago.

 

[Gary Morgan]

Thanks for the explanation. I have actually located a relative of a "citizen" that was transferred to Millen. We're not certain but we think he was working for a railroad when he was captured. His job prior to the war was railroad track repair. For some unknown reason, I learned hanged and hung long time ago.

Was it Isaiah Cooper, by any chance? I have just under 300 citizen prisoners at Andersonville in my database, and some of them went to Millen afterwards.

You probably had a better English teacher than I did. I wasn't taught to read in standard English as a kid.

 

[debwallsmith]

Was it Isaiah Cooper, by any chance? I have just under 300 citizen prisoners at Andersonville in my database, and some of them went to Millen afterwards.

You probably had a better English teacher than I did. I wasn't taught to read in standard English as a kid.

His name is Overmire. I've got 32 non-regimental types at Millen including a couple of farriers, blacksmiths and teamsters. In each case, the entry in the Andersonville ledgers only lists their "job" or "cit".

 

[DixieRifles]

I've researched the 1864 Battle of Fort Pillow using OR's and Service records but one main source is Andrew Ward's book "River Run Red". Ward made a few mistakes but he documented many soldiers, civilians and eye witnesses. He referred to the citizens who fought as Civilian Armed Combatants. That is a good description of them.

There were several CAC's at Fort Pillow who were there for several reasons. Some worked in the nearby town and the store run by the Army. Some were "camp followers" where others seem to have worked as cooks or horse handlers for the officers. Most of the civilians were placed on a barge and taken across the river. I can't say I have found any civilian names on the unofficial roll of Prisoners. Here are a couple of examples that explain why.

George Washington Craft and Charles Robinson were given a blouse and rifle and went to the fort. Charles Robinson fought with 13 Tenn Cav(US) and was captured. After the fighting stopped, Charles Robinson saw George Craft with the rank of prisoners but lost contact and never saw him again. Charles Robinson was taken to the officer's tents where he was released by Colonel McCulloch.

James Brigham was another civilian combatant who was captured but released by Colonel McCulloch.

John Penwell of Michigan was able to fire one round but before he could reload, he was forced to surrender. He was shot and left for dead but survived.

Edward Benton was the owner who ran a business on the bluff. He ran to the fort to get a rifle and said he fired off 48 rounds. A Confederate captain captured him and while the captain was looting the town, Benton escaped by walking away.

Cordy Revelle was a local civilian who worked in the town store and had a similar story.. His brother Lt. Cordy Revelle, was commander of Company E, 13th Tenn Cavalry(US). Revelle was a witness inside the fort and was standing next to Major Booth when he was shot by a sniper. He was captured to taken to the store by his captors to help them loot. Another Confederate officer joined the looting. For his help, his captors gave him permission to depart and instructed him on the best means of escape.

There were about 4 other CAC's who were wounded and killed in the battle. Some civilians may have been recorded among the wounded who where shipped north to Cairo.

 

[lelliott19]

the difference between hanged and hung (people are hanged; inanimate objects are hung).

Thanks! I will never mess this one up again!

 

[Gary Morgan]

His name is Overmire. I've got 32 non-regimental types at Millen including a couple of farriers, blacksmiths and teamsters. In each case, the entry in the Andersonville ledgers only lists their "job" or "cit".

Check your email. I sent you what I had for citizens, both survivors and the ones in the National Cemetery. I listed sources, and it they're mentioned in multiple sources, I listed them all.

 

[debwallsmith]

Check your email. I sent you what I had for citizens, both survivors and the ones in the National Cemetery. I listed sources, and it they're mentioned in multiple sources, I listed them all.

Will do. Thank you.