Burying Tubes: Practicality or Defiance ?

[ColonelBuckwalter]

I've read a lot about how capturing field pieces was considered quite the victory. But I had never really thought about why?

Was it a 'we broke their lines so bad we got the cannons too' or in the Confederate case 'we broke their line, captured the cannon, and now we have more cannons'?

That got me thinking about burying tubes. You'll excuse my not having links to the posts. I've read a few accounts of artillerists burying the barrels and I guess destroying the carrages and cassons. One was a ANV battery that slipped away from Appomotox and buried their guns in a churchyard. The other was a recent post about a mountain howitzer that was buried and now on display.

Was this an act of defiance, practicality, or both? Was there any thought of retrieval in doing it?

 

[Rhea Cole]

The obsolete muzzle loading cannon in seacoast forts was unceremoniously dumped into the sea or moat in many cases.

During Hood's retreat from Nashville artillery was dumped off bridges into rivers & streams.

My personal impression is that the considerable amount of work it took to bury a cannon barrel signals an intent to recover it at a later date. Or in the case of the battery that refused to surrender ll, a final act of defiance.

After the war, captured ordinance was sent to armories. That is why Rock Island has a collection of Confederate artillery.

Adolph Metzner's drawing of the frantic attempt to save a cannon from being overrun says it all. A shattered carriage, rider's flailing the horses & a withdrawal by prolong didn't leave many opportunities for interring cannons.

 

[Dan Kohli]

It's my understanding that it was mostly to prevent their capture and use by the enemy.

 

[Rhea Cole]

Here are links to the recovery of Confederate artillery that was deliberately abandoned. Read more here.

Link:

Archaeologists Recover Three Civil War Cannons From South Carolina River

Three Civil War were raised from the Pee Dee River in South Carolina.

abcnews.go.com

Link:

Fort Branch Civil War Site

fortbranchcivilwarsite.com

Link:

Archaeologists find even more old cannons in the Savannah River. They hope to solve the mystery of their origin and history

civil-war-picket.blogspot.com

Legendary tales abound, read more here.

Link:

Find The Lost Civil War Cannon In The New River Gorge

We all misplace things but have you ever lost anything like a cannon? Learn about the mystery Civil War gun that might still be in the West Virginia woods.

www.summitbsa.org

 

[Rusk County Avengers]

I think enough has been said already on the military end on tubes, but on the defiance end, yeah there was definitely some of that at the end of the war.

Great example, the Valverde Battery here in Texas. Check out the second article:

Adolphus Confederate Uniforms Published Article Downloads

Published Article Downloads

www.adolphusconfederateuniforms.com

That said, I know of several missing cannon unaccounted for here in Texas, in Arkansas, and Oklahoma in 1865 that existed, then just poof missing by the time the Feds got here.

Also an incident when I was a teenager with either a M1841 6-pounder or Napoleon that was dug up, then scrapped by unknowing buffoons over in Jefferson, TX. Legends always persisted of Confederates burying them in 65 to keep from surrendering them over there, just for some alcoholics digging post holes for beer money finding one and taking it to the scrap yard for a nice pay day. They thought.

 

[rebelatsea]

Here in the UK it was once common practice to bury old cannon muzzle down as mooring bollards or street furniture. They can stlll be found in port cities and towns but also in odd places far from the sea. This was also done in France, was it a thing in the USA?

 

[Old Soldier]

The cannon is the artilleryman's colors. To let your piece fall into enemy hands was the same disgrace as losing your regimental and national standards - the Colors. That was always why the gunners always tried to save their guns before they were overrun. It seems to have applied more to the field artillerymen rather than garrison or siege gunners., mainly because they COULD be moved - much more easily.
The alternative was 'spiking' - hammering a metal spike into the touchhole to prevent use. This was a last minute measure, carried out before the bayonet got you and applied to ALL guns. Any attempt to disable even modern guns and gun mounts is still termed 'spiking'.

 

[ColonelBuckwalter]

Here in the UK it was once common practice to bury old cannon muzzle down as mooring bollards or street furniture. They can stlll be found in port cities and towns but also in odd places far from the sea. This was also done in France, was it a thing in the USA?

From what I've seen they generally end up in parks for show, in museums or on battlefields.

Until my wife let's me buy one. Then it'll also be in my garage.

 

[ColonelBuckwalter]

The cannon is the artilleryman's colors. To let your piece fall into enemy hands was the same disgrace as losing your regimental and national standards - the Colors. That was always why the gunners always tried to save their guns before they were overrun. It seems to have applied more to the field artillerymen rather than garrison or siege gunners., mainly because they COULD be moved - much more easily.
The alternative was 'spiking' - hammering a metal spike into the touchhole to prevent use. This was a last minute measure, carried out before the bayonet got you and applied to ALL guns. Any attempt to disable even modern guns and gun mounts is still termed 'spiking'.

That's what I thought. Last thing you want to be is the battery with no battery. For shame.

I was at an antiques store that specialized in CW stuff.

The woman had some things from the Castillo de San Marcos (or Ft Marion) St Augustine. I felt bad for her because she desperate to sell things, business wasngood so I bought some Minnie balls, either provenance (one pretty mailed and I seriously hope it just hit a tree) and there were these metal spikes that she referred to as "miniature swords", while makes little sense. I mean, they were not makung martinis and Manhattans then; no olives or cherries there.

They were spikes for thr guns. Couldn't have been anything else. I told her what she she had and I got a free Union button out of the deal.

 

[Nathan Stuart]

In a standardized 1864 artillery instruction manual (see https://archive.org/details/instructionsforf00star/page/n4/mode/1up ), found no specific instruction referring to burying guns. Instead, there was only instructions on how to 'spike a piece, or to render it unserviceable'. (@ pp. 258-59). (It does not appear from the manual contents that any cannon capture was envisaged).

Thought any decisions to bury guns were individually made by the artillerymen involved, at their discretion. The main reason for any such drastic action would have been to permanently prevent enemy use of the piece, if it was captured. There might also have been an element of 'honor' involved in deciding to bury a gun, in order to symbolize the end of its useful service period. (Similarly, at the end of the war, can recall reading that some Confederate whitworth riflemen chose to bury their highly-prized rifles, rather than surrender these weapons to the enemy).

 

[rebelatsea]

From what I've seen they generally end up in parks for show, in museums or on battlefields.

Until my wife let's me buy one. Then it'll also be in my garage.

The area of Woolwich Arsenal has been redeveloped in recent years, resulting in an extraordinary collection of guns, and projectiles being unearthed from the marshes used as firing ranges and also from the rebuilt river front. Some have been found places in museums and public spaces but the majority are uncatalogued in a warehouse belonging to the Department of Science and Industry alongside the Science Museum's depository in Wiltshire - both a repository of treasures with no public access!

 

[James Brenner]

"The Ninety-eighth [Illinois] while attached to the First Brigade, Second Division of Cavalry, as Mounted Infantry, assisted in the capture at Macon, Ga., of four brass cannon which had been buried near the small-pox hospital, as deceased soldiers, marking them with head and foot-boards. One of these pieces was given to the Ninety-eighth and subsequently it was presented to Illinois, when it was placed on exhibition in Memorial Hall."

Source:
Illinois Adjutant General's Report
Regimental and Unit Histories
Containing Reports for the Years 1861– 1866
Histories of Illinois Civil War Regiments and Units