Ambrotype with an Interesting Shell Jacket

[CyleKostello]

Hi all, recently picked up this 9th plate relievo ambrotype.

He sports a shell jacket with cloth shoulder tabs and a shell jacket with likely no more than 6 buttons. Based on the spacing of the visible three buttons.

My first thought was maybe early Michigan Engineers but he lacks the slash pocket and lemon trim. Shoulder tabs rule out early war Wisco as well. Not enough buttons for NY/Midwestern state jackets. No buttons on the cuffs either. No visible detail on his buttons. Anecdotally, most of the relievos I've seen have been southern photographers but in a vacuum that doesn't mean much

Regardless of his affiliation he's got a great "look". Hope you enjoy.

Any thoughts on this jacket? Thanks in advance!

 

[14NYSM]

Nice vest!

 

[Sowbelly and Hardtack]

It might be a variation of a state issue sack coat.

 

[CyleKostello]

It might be a variation of a state issue sack coat.

Could be but the placement/number of buttons is super unusual for a state jacket. Most have around 8.

Off the top of my head. Two states (MI, and WI) had 5 button jackets but this jacket doesn't match either pattern.

 

[Dan Kohli]

The the man in the photograph kind of has the civilian look going on.

 

[Old Soldier]

The the man in the photograph kind of has the civilian look going on.

My first thoughts too. There is nothing to suggest a military uniform - or a soldier.

 

[CyleKostello]

My first thoughts too. There is nothing to suggest a military uniform - or a soldier.

I disagree. I think his jacket itself is pretty distinctly military. I personally haven't seen a civilian jacket with shoulder tabs.


I'd agree the vest is civilian but I've seen loads of photos where the subject is wearing a military shell or frock over civilian clothes

 

[Old Soldier]

The big problem is the habit of the photographer on these contact prints to paint out anything that has letters on them as they were a mirror-image and stood out like a sore thumb! Buttons and belt buckles were a prime example, so any 'US' disappeared. He also appears to have done something with the shirt in the 'V' of the vest (the edges are too sharp). The jacket is not dark enough to be a sack coat of the Union army and they did not have epaulettes sewn in. The only ones I have seen in full dress are the more metalic ones worn by bandsmen and some NCOs. It MAY be a Confederate jacket, but they were similar to the federal uniform and without epaulettes. This jacket shows no cuffs or facing colors either.

 

[Old Breck]

Looks close to the 5 button version of Michigan blouse, but something just seems off about it.

Details about these things are kind of vague but there is evidence variations of these were issues to some the first nine regiments. I believe this guy is identified to the 5th.

 

[CyleKostello]

Looks close to the 5 button version of Michigan blouse, but something just seems off about it.

Details about these things are kind of vague but there is evidence variations of these were issues to some the first nine regiments. I believe this guy is identified to the 5th.

View attachment 482630

Yeah the Michigan blouses were one of my first ideas. But he's lacking the front pocket and the fabric looks different (to my eye).

The sleeves on the Michigan blouses also look a little narrower/more tightly tailored than my subject's jacket

 

[Palmetto1862]

Hi all, recently picked up this 9th plate relievo ambrotype.

He sports a shell jacket with cloth shoulder tabs and a shell jacket with likely no more than 6 buttons. Based on the spacing of the visible three buttons.

My first thought was maybe early Michigan Engineers but he lacks the slash pocket and lemon trim. Shoulder tabs rule out early war Wisco as well. Not enough buttons for NY/Midwestern state jackets. No buttons on the cuffs either. No visible detail on his buttons. Anecdotally, most of the relievos I've seen have been southern photographers but in a vacuum that doesn't mean much

Regardless of his affiliation he's got a great "look". Hope you enjoy.

Any thoughts on this jacket? Thanks in advance!

View attachment 482177

It looks like a non-regulation jacket (maybe even a frock coat?) that the soldier's tailor might have made. But I think that was done mainly by officers; your soldier here isn't displaying any rank insignia. He does seem like a natty dresser, though, who might have a tailor-made jacket or coat.

 

[CyleKostello]

It looks like a non-regulation jacket (maybe even a frock coat?) that the soldier's tailor might have made. But I think that was done mainly by officers; your soldier here isn't displaying any rank insignia. He does seem like a natty dresser, though, who might have a tailor-made jacket or coat.

Yeah, I'm starting to think this was a one-off/homemade jacket rather than an unrecognized state jacket pattern. Between tailored/homemade I'd come down on the homemade side. The tailored jackets i've seen usually have little cosmetic touches like cuff buttons, cuff facings, trim or what have you. This jacket is super plain by contrast.

 

[Palmetto1862]

Yeah, I'm starting to think this was a one-off/homemade jacket rather than an unrecognized state jacket pattern. Between tailored/homemade I'd come down on the homemade side. The tailored jackets i've seen usually have little cosmetic touches like cuff buttons, cuff facings, trim or what have you. This jacket is super plain by contrast.

Yep, you're probably right—I didn't consider a homemade jacket. A tailored one would probably have a neater fit, too; this one fits him very loosely, more like a sack coat.

 

[CyleKostello]

Yep, you're probably right—I didn't consider a homemade jacket. A tailored one would probably have a neater fit, too; this one fits him very loosely, more like a sack coat.

Yeah it's full of contradictions. The loose sleeves and few buttons would suggest a sack coat. But the non functional shoulder tabs are a purely cosmetic addition that's seldom seen on more utilitarian clothes like sack coats.

 

[CyleKostello]

Found this ambrotype on Pinterest while researching. Its labeled as a Confederate in a 4 button sack coat. The desc says the top button is a GA state state but the quality is too poor to verify. It's not a 1:1 match but the jacket pictured below is definitely similar. With the shoulder tabs, number of buttons, material looks similar as well.

Not saying my guy is wearing the same jacket but this the closest match I've found so far

 

[GMSorrel]

Found this ambrotype on Pinterest while researching. Its labeled as a Confederate in a 4 button sack coat. The desc says the top button is a GA state state but the quality is too poor to verify. It's not a 1:1 match but the jacket pictured below is definitely similar. With the shoulder tabs, number of buttons, material looks similar as well.

Not saying my guy is wearing the same jacket but this the closest match I've found so far

View attachment 483467

I own this image. Unfortunately the top button is NOT a GA button. It's an eagle of some type.

 

[CyleKostello]

I own this image. Unfortunately the top button is NOT a GA button. It's an eagle of some type.

Good to know! Do you have a higher quality scan of it on hand?

 

[Package4]

Hi all, recently picked up this 9th plate relievo ambrotype.

He sports a shell jacket with cloth shoulder tabs and a shell jacket with likely no more than 6 buttons. Based on the spacing of the visible three buttons.

My first thought was maybe early Michigan Engineers but he lacks the slash pocket and lemon trim. Shoulder tabs rule out early war Wisco as well. Not enough buttons for NY/Midwestern state jackets. No buttons on the cuffs either. No visible detail on his buttons. Anecdotally, most of the relievos I've seen have been southern photographers but in a vacuum that doesn't mean much

Regardless of his affiliation he's got a great "look". Hope you enjoy.

Any thoughts on this jacket? Thanks in advance!

View attachment 482177

I believe you have a commutation jacket trying to mimic a type one/two, this is a very heavy, what appears to be wool, jacket with non functional cuffs. The epaulettes appear to be an afterthought and are too short with cuff buttons. Most likely a five button.

Very nice acquisition!

 

[CyleKostello]

I believe you have a commutation jacket trying to mimic a type one/two, this is a very heavy, what appears to be wool, jacket with non functional cuffs. The epaulettes appear to be an afterthought and are too short with cuff buttons. Most likely a five button.

Very nice acquisition!

Thank you! Commutation/other homemade jacket was one of my first thoughts. But the sheer variety of federal state jackets and early war uniforms made me hesitate.