A Question about Collecting Preferences?

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

Here is a question I have wrestled with for a very long time in the context of named Civil War timepieces, but the same question emerges, perhaps even more acutely, in the case of Civil War swords:

Do you prefer swords of the common regulation variety that show evidence of probable battlefield use, or do you prefer pristinely preserved, highly embellished presentation swords which likely saw little use at all? Does it affect your answer if the swords are named?

I have named watches that fall into both categories, including a couple for which there is good evidence that the owners were either KIA or mortally wounded with the watches on their persons. I have four named Union officer swords, one navy, one cavalry, and two infantry, three of which are presentations, and I can't decide how likely it is that they saw actual service.

 

[JOHN42768]

I think your excess funds might determine the direction to head you into. Personally I would chose one ideal, not to say if you happen upon a prize you can't include in your collection. I started with original Carbines and eventually branched in many directions.

 

[BartlbyAdams]

Here is a question I have wrestled with for a very long time in the context of named Civil War timepieces, but the same question emerges, perhaps even more prominently in the case of Civil War swords:

Do you prefer swords of the common regulation variety that show evidence of probable battlefield use, or do you prefer pristinely preserved, highly embellished presentation swords which likely saw little use at all? Does it affect your answer if the swords are named?

I have named watches that fall into both categories, including a couple for which there is good evidence that the owners were either KIA or mortally wounded with the watches on their persons. I have four named Union officer swords, one navy, one cavalry, and two infantry, three of which are presentations, and I can't decide how likely it is that they saw actual service.

Personally both types of collectible, pristine reproducition or survivor piece, are important to keeping the history alive. Without the relics the replicas wouldn't be as cool in my opinion.

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

I think your excess funds might determine the direction to head you into. Personally I would chose one ideal, not to say if you happen upon a prize you can't include in your collection. I started with original Carbines and eventually branched in many directions.

Well, named high-end presentation swords certainly absorb more funds, but as crude as it sounds, there is something appealing about a battered regulation sword with old blood stains on it too.

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

Personally both types of collectible, pristine reproducition or survivor piece, are important to keeping the history alive. Without the relics the replicas wouldn't be as cool in my opinion.

Hmm. Well, I wasn't really talking about "reproductions." I was contrasting high end presentation swords, which were perhaps only worn by the original owner on rare occasions with a dress uniform, to ones that were actually carried into battle.

 

[BartlbyAdams]

Hmm. Well, I wasn't really talking about "reproductions." I was contrasting high end presentation swords, which were perhaps only worn by the original owner on rare occasions with a dress uniform, to ones that were actually carried into battle.

I should have left my ignorance out of it completely instead of being humbled haha. Thank you.

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

I should have left my ignorance out of it completely instead of being humbled haha. Thank you.

Don't feel bad. You weren't the first person, nor will you be the last to read a question too quickly. I've done that.

 

[R. Porter]

I feel the interest in reproduction collecting would be a factor with firearms where you might be interested in shooting various types of period firearms to see what it was like and learn the types of authentic wear and tear of an actual period piece. Guns can often have non-original parts that were added during the war or later. Sometimes parts were added much later by dealers trying to add value. So there can be value in repro guns to the right collector who wants the experience without the risk of damaging their collection.

I tend to collect swords and go for the less expensive. Frequently they are damaged or modified in ways that make them undesirable to collectors. The up side is that you may find rare and unusual swords that are genuine for comparison if you ever find a pristine sword at a high price that you are tempted to acquire. You may even be able to answer questions about swords that you couldn't with just a few expensive swords in your collection. And if you ever want to build one of those Game of Thrones chairs for your den; well, you can't do that with just a few presentation swords.

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

I feel the interest in reproduction collecting would be a factor with firearms where you might be interested in shooting various types of period firearms to see what it was like and learn the types of authentic wear and tear of an actual period piece. Guns can often have non-original parts that were added during the war or later. Sometimes parts were added much later by dealers trying to add value. So there can be value in repro guns to the right collector who wants the experience without the risk of damaging their collection.

I tend to collect swords and go for the less expensive. Frequently they are damaged or modified in ways that make them undesirable to collectors. The up side is that you may find rare and unusual swords that are genuine for comparison if you ever find a pristine sword at a high price that you are tempted to acquire. You may even be able to answer questions about swords that you couldn't with just a few expensive swords in your collection. And if you ever want to build one of those Game of Thrones chairs for your den; well, you can't do that with just a few presentation swords.

I'm a big G-O-T fan, but I never considered making myself an iron throne.

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

Well, my pendulum apparently swings in both directions. The sword I just bought is a presentation piece, but it is a standard quality Ames Model 1850 Field & Staff Officers' sword with a well preserved scabbard, guard, pommel, and a professionally restored shagreen grip (it looks good), but no etching left on the blade. The Ames marking is clear on the scabbard mount, however, and the hilt is definitely Ames, so I'm not worried about authenticity. Conversely, the previous Model 1850 Field & Staff officers' sword I bought, which was presented to a captain in the 39th O.V.I. (part of Fuller's Ohio Brigade), is a humdinger with a nickel silver grip, elaborately embellished mounts and drag, and a magnificent gold-washed etched blade. I love them both.

I couldn't resist the Ames sword because it was presented to Major Joseph Colburn of the 59th MA Infantry. You see, I own a watch that was on the person of Lt. Colonel John Hodges Jr., who commanded the 59th MA when he was KIA during the Battle of the Crater on July 30, 1864. (This fact was confirmed by the piece that John's brother, who received the watch after John's death, wrote for the Harvard Memorial Biographies). On the day Hodges fell, Major Colburn assumed command of the regiment! Soon after, he was promoted to Lt. Colonel. Colburn had served with the 13th MA since July 1861, seeing action at South Mountain, Antietam, Chancellorsville, Fredericksburg, and Gettysburg, among other battles. In early 1864 he recruited a company in his home town of Roxbury for the newly formed 59th MA and was soon after promoted to Major. With the 59th, Colburn went through the Overland Campaign, the Siege of Petersburg, including the Crater, and the Appomattox Campaign. He was wounded in action twice, once when he owned the sword, and he was even from Roxbury, the birthplace of American watchmaking - another personal connection for me of sorts. An original carte-de-visite of Major Colburn accompanies the sword.

Here is the item on the Horse Soldier website, though the listed price is not what I paid. (it should say "on hold," as they know my check is in the mail.)

 

[R. Porter]

Nice sword! Are you going to try and hunt down other relics of the 59th MA?

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

Nice sword! Are you going to try and hunt down other relics of the 59th MA?

Perhaps. Depends on whether they appeal to me.

 

[rob63]

I'm more of a gun collector than a sword collector, but I do think there is an attraction to both. I love a relic that very much looks like a battle worn veteran, but also appreciate a pristine example that still looks the way it would have been issued at the time. A historic piece that is named is awesome! I think it is enough that you know who owned it, and that it was possibly carried, if not actually used in combat.

It's not an American Civil War piece, but I have a named sword owned by a British artillery officer who served in WWI in the Somme region. He was killed by a shell burst and his body was never recovered so he clearly wasn't carrying it, but I am rather fond of it anyway.

The only thing I never understand is the people that pay top dollar for something that was once a relic, but has been overly cleaned and no longer looks like either end of the spectrum.

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

Nice sword! Are you going to try and hunt down other relics of the 59th MA?

I'd like to find the bugle from the 59th, but there was only one, so that would be very tough, if it even still exists.

 

[Conquerordie]

I haven't moved into swords yet but my collection does revolve around the common infantry guy. So in swords I'd be focusing on M1850 Foot Officer models or calvary sabres. Definitely used, patina, shagreen or leather worn. Too me, that adds personality to the piece, but also a human aspect.

Heck I'd might most be happy with a relic excavated from a battlefield. Even though most of the sword probably won't be there, I can assuredly say the sword WAS there. That's priceless to me.

 

[7th Mississippi Infantry]

While I can't afford to collect watches, guns and such, I do have a few relics.

I consider myself lucky to have a little 12 lb. "Borman fuse" artillery round from Shiloh, along with many, many "dropped rounds"
on my 7th Mississippi ancestor's lines during day one of the Battle of Shiloh.

Moreover, I've wanted to start collecting buttons,
But good Lord ... such buttons are more expensive than collecting original firearms.

 

[CW Watch & Sword Guy]

I am primarily a watch collector. I have 18 watches with some connection to the Civil War, including two that belonged to men who were either killed or mortally wounded with their watches in their pockets, and two others that were presented to Medal of Honor recipients (though after the war). But those watches are only a minority of my watch collection of 58 pieces in all. Six of my provenance watches likely were carried in actual battle. I suppose the ultimate in "authenticity" is a bullet-struck watch. I have seen a couple, and read of others. Then there is Captain Dixon's watch, or what is left of it, which was recovered from the submarine CSS Hunley. But to me, there can be such a thing as too much "authenticity." As a watch lover and horologist, bullet struck and corroded watches make me cringe. I like functioning watches, even if they look like they've "been through the war." I suppose my attitude towards swords is similar.