5 Most Underrated Perfomances (Gettysburg)

[major bill]

I picked up The Civil War Monitor "Gettysburg Special Commemorative Issue" today Among the other articles is 5 Most Underrated Performances by Brian Matthew Jordan. I could not help but wonder about his choices.

1. The XI Corps on Blocher's Knoll and East Cemetery Hill
2. The 17th Maine Infantry in the Wheatfield
3. Charles Coster's brigade in Kuhn's Brickyard
4. George L. Willard's brigade on July 2
5. The 137th New York Infantry on Culp's Hill

After reading Jordan's article I had to wonder why he felt these performances are underrated by authors. The article only gives a short description of the action but nothing about why it made the top 5 or why Jordan believes they are underrated.

I will not even attempt to justify Allen C. Guelzo's 5 Worse Decision at Gettysburg article found in the same The Civil War Monitor "Gettysburg Special Commemorative Issue". I fear his article might cause some heated discussions.

Ditto for Allen C. Guelzo's 5 Best Decisions at Gettysburg.

 

[major bill]

Brian Matthew Jordan in 5 Most Overrated Performances has The 20th Main Infantry in 3rd place. Some may believe it should be #1, others might think it should not be on the list at all.

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

Brian Matthew Jordan in 5 Most Overrated Performances has The 20th Main Infantry in 3rd place. Some may believe it should be #1, others might think it should not be on the list at all.

Not on the list. It's been so unfortunate the 20th Maine was chosen as a heroic story by Shaara. Those men did what they did. Taken by itself, without comparing it ( seems the whole problem ), or bemoaning the fact that regiments also holding LRT were not recognized, their fight that day was as worthy of respect as any.

Does it seem cavalier there is an ' Overrated ' list? Gee whiz. No one here knows what it was like for any of them. Men died, lost friends and limbs and life, to be kinda told 150 years later " Well, it was ok but really? Not impressed ". This tendency to ' Best ' everything is silly. There's always a ' worst ', too. I don't know. In that whole bloodbath called ' Gettysburg ', do we really get to judge?

 

[Northern Light]

I agree, JPK, each action is an integral part of the whole, and to say one was over-rated or under-rated seems egregious. As much as I dislike"What Ifs", I think it is important to look at what might have happened if each action had not occurred as it did, and how it might have made an impact on the outcome of that day's fight or on the battle as a whole.
I see little value in such judgements as under- or over-rated, etc., without putting them into the context of the whole. What if the 20th Maine had not held at LRT? How might that have affected the rest of the fighting on the 2nd day? How might it have affected Lee's decisions on Day 3?
No one action is done is isolation from the other, and each piece is important to the outcome. It is also important to those who are taking part in it.

 

[redbob]

I can't really be sure, but I believe that the list was compiled by a person of Northern leanings.

 

[Northern Light]

I can't really be sure, but I believe that the list was compiled by a person of Northern leanings.

Really?

 

[redbob]

Really?

Could be.

 

[Burning Billy]

Brian Matthew Jordan in 5 Most Overrated Performances has The 20th Main Infantry in 3rd place. Some may believe it should be #1, others might think it should not be on the list at all.

Out of curiosity, which units were the other four on the list?

 

[Kurt G]

Thank you for not trying to justify Guelzo.

 

[major bill]

Out of curiosity, which units were the other four on the list?

1) John Burns
2) The 1st Minnesota Infantry
3) The 20th Maine Infantry
4) John B. Gordon's Aid of Francis C. Barlow
5) The Battle Itself

 

[major bill]

Thank you for not trying to justify Guelzo.

Some do believe that Guelzo's religious training causes him to put a religious spin on his works. I am not practically familiar with his work. Perhaps other forum members are much more knowledgeable about his writing.

 

[Kurt G]

I read The Last Invasion when it first came out . He really doesn't like Meade and I thought much of his criticism unfair . He also mentioned , I believe , something about the armies should have made better use of the bayonet charge. I am going to read it again soon and take notes . I saw a televised presentation of his several years ago where he again went after Meade in a very sarcastic way . In 2014 I attended a ranger program at the peach orchard . The ranger giving the program has since become well known . On the way back to our vehicles I asked him what he thought about Guelzo's book . He said he thought he was too hard on Meade . The ranger had actually been a student of his at Gettysburg College . Now that I've ranted a bit I would say that if you set the Meade criticism and a few other odd things aside , it was actually a decent book ! I know Meade can be a controversial subject , but I think under the circumstances he did a very good job at Gettysburg.

 

[amweiner]

1) John Burns
2) The 1st Minnesota Infantry
3) The 20th Maine Infantry
4) John B. Gordon's Aid of Francis C. Barlow
5) The Battle Itself

Although #4 is a disputed incident. I am including two articles - the first suggests the incident did occur, the second (in 3 parts - sorry) suggests it did not. Happy reading!

http://clevelandcivilwarroundtable.com/articles/biography/barlow_gordon.htm

https://npsgnmp.wordpress.com/2012/03/15/romances-of-gettysburg-the-barlow-gordon-incident/
https://npsgnmp.wordpress.com/2012/03/29/romances-of-gettysburg-the-barlow-gordon-incident-part-2/
https://npsgnmp.wordpress.com/2012/04/12/romances-of-gettysburg-the-barlow-gordon-incident-part-3/

 

[Northern Light]

1) John Burns
2) The 1st Minnesota Infantry
3) The 20th Maine Infantry
4) John B. Gordon's Aid of Francis C. Barlow
5) The Battle Itself

Yikes!

 

[Northern Light]

I have watched many of Guelzo's talks on Youtube and read " The Last Invasion". I am less than impressed with him, very condescending in his presentation and very opinionated. If he was the minister at my church I would change churches.

 

[major bill]

Yikes!

Well this is simply Brian Matthew Jordan opinion. I think he originally went to college in Gettysburg and then got a PhD from Yale. So could this impact his view?

 

[Northern Light]

Well this is simply Brian Matthew Jordan opinion. I think he originally went to college in Gettysburg and then got a PhD from Yale. So could this impact his view?

Maybe!

 

[Jimklag]

1) John Burns
2) The 1st Minnesota Infantry
3) The 20th Maine Infantry
4) John B. Gordon's Aid of Francis C. Barlow
5) The Battle Itself

The fifth item seems to tell the whole story about Mr. Jordan. Other than in comparison to the simultaneous battle at Vicksburg (and that is a matter of opinion), I don't think it is possible to overrate Gettysburg's place in the Civil War's long list of battles. Lee made that impossible by staying around and attacking on the 2nd and 3rd. The 20th Maine's feats have indeed been exaggerated thanks to Michael Shaara and Ted Turner. Don't know how the martyrdom of the 1st Minnesota is exaggerated or overrated. What they did is factual and the result of the few minutes they bought by that martyrdom are well documented. If those two things are true, by definition, their actions cannot be overrated. As for the items about John Burns and John B. Gordon, I have no opinion about their possibly being overrated.

 

[amweiner]

very opinionated

One of the hard parts about the study of history.... what chaps my hindquarters more than the opinions is the "my opinion is right and the rest of you are idiots" stance taken by some. It's true of all fields, but with history it's a tough sell given none of us were there!

 

[Jimklag]

Not on the list. It's been so unfortunate the 20th Maine was chosen as a heroic story by Shaara. Those men did what they did. Taken by itself, without comparing it ( seems the whole problem ), or bemoaning the fact that regiments also holding LRT were not recognized, their fight that day was as worthy of respect as any.

Does it seem cavalier there is an ' Overrated ' list? Gee whiz. No one here knows what it was like for any of them. Men died, lost friends and limbs and life, to be kinda told 150 years later " Well, it was ok but really? Not impressed ". This tendency to ' Best ' everything is silly. There's always a ' worst ', too. I don't know. In that whole bloodbath called ' Gettysburg ', do we really get to judge?

Two thumbs up, Annie.