2nd Maine

[MikeyB]

Did the Killer Angels and Gettysburg accurately represent what happened to the 2nd Maine w/r/t their papers and "mutiny" (i thought that was a word for the Navy), or was it more nuanced?

Does anyone have the stats for % casualties for those who opted to fight? And what happened to the 3 or 4 holdouts? Hard labor? Pardoned? Shot? Guard house and dishonorable discharge?

Mike

 

[iron bender]

Re -reading this book for the umpteenth time. A very enjoyable, easy read. I was wondering the same thing you're asking Mikey

 

[rpkennedy]

More or less. There was a tremendous amount of turnover in the Army of the Potomac as spring turned into summer in 1863. All of the 2-year regiments that were raised in 1861 were getting ready to muster out and many of them had small numbers of men who had either enlisted later under 3-year terms (by far, the most common reason) or who had preemptively reenlisted as their terms ran out. In addition, the 9-month regiments that were raised in the autumn of 1862 were coming to the end of their enlistments as well (almost none of these men stuck around but one of the New Jersey regiments did agree to extend their enlistment for a few weeks and joined in the defense of Pennsylvania during Lee's invasion).

The difference seems to have been the sheer number of men remaining with the 2nd Maine versus many of the other regiments. For example, the 12th New York (in the Third Brigade, First Division, Fifth Corps) mustered out at the end of May 1863 but had enough men to form a 2-company battalion that served as the Fifth's Corps provost guard (the 2 companies mustered less than 50 3-year men).

As for the 2nd Maine, the main issue seems to have been twofold. First, the odd muster in likely caused some confusion. Originally, the regiment was organized as a 3-month unit in Bangor but as companies arrived in New York, they were federalized under 2-year and 3-year contracts with little rhyme or reason (and that's not accounting for the replacements who came later). By May 1863, about a quarter of the 2nd Maine was remaining in the army and the men seem to have felt that that was enough for them to maintain their organization but the army disagreed and ordered them to consolidate with the 20th Maine. The men up and said that they wouldn't fight except as the 2nd Maine and the rest pretty much happened as depicted in the film and book (although all of this took place in May rather than late June as shown in the movie).

One of the more interesting aspects of the whole thing was how astute Chamberlain was about consolidating the men into the 20th Maine. Instead of letting them form into their own companies as was done by many of the remaining men did, he had them spread around the regiment so that he had more eyes on these potentially disaffected soldiers. In addition, he gave the national colors to Sergeant Andrew Tozier, a 2nd Maine veteran, in order to fully bring the new Maine men into the family, so to speak.

Ryan

 

[rpkennedy]

Here are the 2nd Maine casualties at Gettysburg:

George W. Leach, Company B: captured (died 12/1 in prison)
George W. Stone, Company B: missing (probably temporarily separated from the regiment)
Joseph L. Surry, Company B: wounded
Sergeant Charles A. Knapp, Company C: wounded (later killed at Spotsylvania)
Corporal Vincent W. Pinhorn, Company C: wounded (later killed at Peeble's Farm)
John O. O'Connell, Company C: wounded
James H. Erskine, Company G: wounded (died of disease 2/8/64)

 

[MikeyB]

Here are the 2nd Maine casualties at Gettysburg:

George W. Leach, Company B: captured (died 12/1 in prison)
George W. Stone, Company B: missing (probably temporarily separated from the regiment)
Joseph L. Surry, Company B: wounded
Sergeant Charles A. Knapp, Company C: wounded (later killed at Spotsylvania)
Corporal Vincent W. Pinhorn, Company C: wounded (later killed at Peeble's Farm)
John O. O'Connell, Company C: wounded
James H. Erskine, Company G: wounded (died of disease 2/8/64)

Great info. Casualties a lot lighter than I would have expected. Do you know what happened to the holdouts who didnt pickup the rifle ?

 

[gary]

Chamberlain was correct in distributing the men of the 2nd Maine among his companies. It makes it more difficult for them to promote discontent among themselves. I read of a Soviet officer who always paired up different nationalities (Uzbek with Kazak, Belorussian with Georgian, Tartar with Siberian) so there was a reduced possiblity of them conspiring to desert.

The 2nd Maine men's misunderstanding of military terms of enlistment was not exclusive to them. Once you take the oath (or as the British used to say, "take the King's shilling...."), you're not a free man until discharged.

 

[rpkennedy]

Great info. Casualties a lot lighter than I would have expected. Do you know what happened to the holdouts who didnt pickup the rifle ?

IIRC, only a single member of the 2nd Maine, not 3 as shown in the film, refused to take up arms at Gettysburg. He was sentenced to military prison but had his punishment commuted by President Lincoln.

Ryan

 

[rpkennedy]

Chamberlain was correct in distributing the men of the 2nd Maine among his companies. It makes it more difficult for them to promote discontent among themselves. I read of a Soviet officer who always paired up different nationalities (Uzbek with Kazak, Belorussian with Georgian, Tartar with Siberian) so there was a reduced possiblity of them conspiring to desert.

The 2nd Maine men's misunderstanding of military terms of enlistment was not exclusive to them. Once you take the oath (or as the British used to say, "take the King's shilling...."), you're not a free man until discharged.

It also didn't help that the 2nd Maine's enlistment was so odd and haphazard. I can understand why the men weren't happy with how it all turned out.

Ryan