SPI Alive in 2025 AAR

[pmuskett]

Last week I got back from spending four days in Lancaster PA playing some of the games from my youth. What a great time. I drove from Gettysburg every day to play. Only about an hour and a half from Gettysburg. (That used to be my work commute and that was to no fun.)

I cannot thank Russ Gifford enough for the event. I am already looking forward to next year.

The only disappointment I had was that 16 players signed up to play Terrible Swift Sword, and we only had 6 actually play. If you played this game before you know, more players the quicker the moving and combat goes. We only got to the 3:30 or so turn on the 1st day of Gettysburg. Most of the time was just two or three playing, never all 6 at the same time. (There is just too much gaming goodness going on) I was the only steady player, as this was the only game I signed up to play.

During my down time, I played another SPI game, Chickamauga. Another one I had when I was a kid. This just made me want to buy these games, I used to have, but they are expensive now. Oh well.

Just walking through the event was amazing. The work that everyone puts in on the miniatures, terrain to play. I was blown away.

Here is the link to Russ's after-action report. My pictures are not as good as his.

SPI Wargame Resources

Then click on the read the after-action report.

I hope to see some of you there next year.

Phil

 

[Jantzen64]

Last week I got back from spending four days in Lancaster PA playing some of the games from my youth. What a great time. I drove from Gettysburg every day to play. Only about an hour and a half from Gettysburg. (That used to be my work commute and that was to no fun.)

I cannot thank Russ Gifford enough for the event. I am already looking forward to next year.

The only disappointment I had was that 16 players signed up to play Terrible Swift Sword, and we only had 6 actually play. If you played this game before you know, more players the quicker the moving and combat goes. We only got to the 3:30 or so turn on the 1st day of Gettysburg. Most of the time was just two or three playing, never all 6 at the same time. (There is just too much gaming goodness going on) I was the only steady player, as this was the only game I signed up to play.

During my down time, I played another SPI game, Chickamauga. Another one I had when I was a kid. This just made me want to buy these games, I used to have, but they are expensive now. Oh well.

Just walking through the event was amazing. The work that everyone puts in on the miniatures, terrain to play. I was blown away.

Here is the link to Russ's after-action report. My pictures are not as good as his.

SPI Wargame Resources

Then click on the read the after-action report.

I hope to see some of you there next year.

Phil

Great to hear - as an original TSS aficionado, I have to admit the TSR re-release made for a better game/simulation - but I can never forgive the deep pink color used on level 4 or was that 5?) terrain! Glad you had a good time!

 

[rpkennedy]

Last week I got back from spending four days in Lancaster PA playing some of the games from my youth. What a great time. I drove from Gettysburg every day to play. Only about an hour and a half from Gettysburg. (That used to be my work commute and that was to no fun.)

I cannot thank Russ Gifford enough for the event. I am already looking forward to next year.

The only disappointment I had was that 16 players signed up to play Terrible Swift Sword, and we only had 6 actually play. If you played this game before you know, more players the quicker the moving and combat goes. We only got to the 3:30 or so turn on the 1st day of Gettysburg. Most of the time was just two or three playing, never all 6 at the same time. (There is just too much gaming goodness going on) I was the only steady player, as this was the only game I signed up to play.

During my down time, I played another SPI game, Chickamauga. Another one I had when I was a kid. This just made me want to buy these games, I used to have, but they are expensive now. Oh well.

Just walking through the event was amazing. The work that everyone puts in on the miniatures, terrain to play. I was blown away.

Here is the link to Russ's after-action report. My pictures are not as good as his.

SPI Wargame Resources

Then click on the read the after-action report.

I hope to see some of you there next year.

Phil

Hopefully it doesn't correspond with my vacation next year. Glad to hear that it was a good time.

Ryan

 

[NH Civil War Gal]

@mkyzzzrdet did you know about this gaming thing?

 

[stu613]

Last week I got back from spending four days in Lancaster PA playing some of the games from my youth. What a great time. I drove from Gettysburg every day to play. Only about an hour and a half from Gettysburg. (That used to be my work commute and that was to no fun.)

I cannot thank Russ Gifford enough for the event. I am already looking forward to next year.

The only disappointment I had was that 16 players signed up to play Terrible Swift Sword, and we only had 6 actually play. If you played this game before you know, more players the quicker the moving and combat goes. We only got to the 3:30 or so turn on the 1st day of Gettysburg. Most of the time was just two or three playing, never all 6 at the same time. (There is just too much gaming goodness going on) I was the only steady player, as this was the only game I signed up to play.

During my down time, I played another SPI game, Chickamauga. Another one I had when I was a kid. This just made me want to buy these games, I used to have, but they are expensive now. Oh well.

Just walking through the event was amazing. The work that everyone puts in on the miniatures, terrain to play. I was blown away.

Here is the link to Russ's after-action report. My pictures are not as good as his.

SPI Wargame Resources

Then click on the read the after-action report.

I hope to see some of you there next year.

Phil

I always enjoyed Terrible Swift Sword as well, but confess my favorite was A Gleam of Bayonets (Antietam)- still have both along with others. Did not know they did one on Chickamauga- guess I missed that one. I also still have Rebel Sabres and the one on Manassass (both), Stones River, Cedar Creek and Wilsons creek. Some of those are more in magazine format instead of boxed. Great games all.

 

[rpkennedy]

How freaking big is that War in the West game? And complex?

Ryan

 

[rpkennedy]

I always enjoyed Terrible Swift Sword as well, but confess my favorite was A Gleam of Bayonets (Antietam)- still have both along with others. Did not know they did one on Chickamauga- guess I missed that one. I also still have Rebel Sabres and the one on Manassass (both), Stones River, Cedar Creek and Wilsons creek. Some of those are more in magazine format instead of boxed. Great games all.

I was the same way. I always enjoyed A Gleam of Bayonets more than Terrible Swift Sword. TSS was/is my dad's favorite though so I do have a soft spot for it as well.

I was always looking for more regimental-level boardgames when I was younger (and pre-digital gaming) as those were what I was interested in.

Ryan

 

[Belfoured]

I was the same way. I always enjoyed A Gleam of Bayonets more than Terrible Swift Sword. TSS was/is my dad's favorite though so I do have a soft spot for it as well.

I was always looking for more regimental-level boardgames when I was younger (and pre-digital gaming) as those were what I was interested in.

Ryan

It's interesting to think about how revolutionary TSS was when it was released. It's stunning to compare that to today's latest iteration of GBACW's Three Days of Gettysburg, which is on pre-order. The "Bergian" concepts are almost unrecognizable.

 

[rpkennedy]

It's interesting to think about how revolutionary TSS was when it was released. It's stunning to compare that to today's latest iteration of GBACW's Three Days of Gettysburg, which is on pre-order. The "Bergian" concepts are almost unrecognizable.

I'd replace some of my old boardgames but I'm afraid that my wife's tolerance for my wargaming addiction has it's limits. She's fine with my computer wargames but she might not be so forgiving when I set up giant maps on our table.

Ryan

 

[Jantzen64]

I always enjoyed Terrible Swift Sword as well, but confess my favorite was A Gleam of Bayonets (Antietam)- still have both along with others. Did not know they did one on Chickamauga- guess I missed that one. I also still have Rebel Sabres and the one on Manassass (both), Stones River, Cedar Creek and Wilsons creek. Some of those are more in magazine format instead of boxed. Great games all.

Did you ever try playing AGoB without the Little Mac corps commitment rules? A buddy and I played it once with the rules and then again without. The results were . . . predictable.

 

[The Ninth Ohio]

I was the same way. I always enjoyed A Gleam of Bayonets more than Terrible Swift Sword. TSS was/is my dad's favorite though so I do have a soft spot for it as well.

I was always looking for more regimental-level boardgames when I was younger (and pre-digital gaming) as those were what I was interested in.

Ryan

Ah, those two titles take me back. Used to be able to quote the reinforcement tables we played them so much.

I still have a copy of TSS I repurchased. But I mostly have migrated to the Wargame Design Studio campaign series. I'm curious if anyone has any thoughts on WDS, as they play a lot like the old GBACW games.

I do have one bone to pick though with war games. Specifically civil war games because that's mostly all I play. Considering I mostly research German regiments, maybe I'm making too much out of it, but it always bothered me in TSS that the 11th Corps had almost entirely 2s (out of 6) for morale. Now, James Pula has done a magnificent study of the Corps that shows their performance at Chancellorsville and Gettysburg to have been more a factor of poor upper command decisions and bad, indefensible ground than a lack of quality, morale or training.

So I'm curious everyone's thoughts on this. I wrote one of the designers back in the Talonsoft/Tiller days and did not receive an answer. Is this a factor of just trying to tell the mythical version of each battle? To make the game turn out closer to the original outcome? To balance the game?

Because I can tell you having played the scenario many times with different sets of troops, no one is defending north of Gettysburg.

 

[rpkennedy]

I still have a copy of TSS I repurchased. But I mostly have migrated to the Wargame Design Studio campaign series. I'm curious if anyone has any thoughts on WDS, as they play a lot like the old GBACW games.

That's mostly what I play as well. I have all of the Civil War titles and an unhealthy number of the WWI and WWII as well. My wife doesn't complain as I'm not taking up table space.

I do have one bone to pick though with war games. Specifically civil war games because that's mostly all I play. Considering I mostly research German regiments, maybe I'm making too much out of it, but it always bothered me in TSS that the 11th Corps had almost entirely 2s (out of 6) for morale. Now, James Pula has done a magnificent study of the Corps that shows their performance at Chancellorsville and Gettysburg to have been more a factor of poor upper command decisions and bad, indefensible ground than a lack of quality, morale or training.

So I'm curious everyone's thoughts on this. I wrote one of the designers back in the Talonsoft/Tiller days and did not receive an answer. Is this a factor of just trying to tell the mythical version of each battle? To make the game turn out closer to the original outcome? To balance the game?

Because I can tell you having played the scenario many times with different sets of troops, no one is defending north of Gettysburg.

I think that an argument can be made that the morale for much of the Eleventh Corps was pretty fragile in the wake of the Chancellorsville Campaign and the constant finger-pointing at the "Flying Dutchmen". Even Pula discusses this a bit in his book when he talks about Schurz writing that the blame was taking a toll on the men and that they could fight better if given the chance.

That said, even with shaky morale, the Eleventh Corps fought about as well as could be expected in the circumstances presented on July 1. And they acquitted themselves well on July 2 on Cemetery Hill and, to a more limited extent, Culp's Hill especially considering what they had suffered on the previous day.

I would have to look to see what WDS has as their morale levels (and the officers' command ratings) as I haven't played Gettysburg in a while and don't know them off the top of my head.

Ryan

 

[7thWisconsin]

I played TSS and the Chickamauga game back in the day. Wasn't Chickamauga from one of the Blue and Gray Quads? I remember reading articles in the old Wargamer's Digest about playing TSS with miniatures, and creating bases with the unit information on the back of the stand. I still use that technique sometimes, though not with that game.
I find it really hard to go back to those simulations. They take so much time to set up, and the visual appeal just doesn't give me the feel of Civil War combat. I'll still play Panzerblitz and Panzer Leader, because pushing the stacks around the map reminds me of managing intel in the TOC. (Though I question some of the research that went into creating those combat stats, too.)

 

[stu613]

The Squad Leader games were fun also

 

[pmuskett]

How freaking big is that War in the West game? And complex?

It was 4+ tables. May have been 6. Then two more for North Africa part. No idea how complex it was. But that was a monster.

 

[Belfoured]

I'd replace some of my old boardgames but I'm afraid that my wife's tolerance for my wargaming addiction has it's limits. She's fine with my computer wargames but she might not be so forgiving when I set up giant maps on our table.

Ryan

So I assume you never tested Dave Powell's 9-mapper for the CWBS Seven Days campaign scenario?

 

[Belfoured]

That's mostly what I play as well. I have all of the Civil War titles and an unhealthy number of the WWI and WWII as well. My wife doesn't complain as I'm not taking up table space.


I think that an argument can be made that the morale for much of the Eleventh Corps was pretty fragile in the wake of the Chancellorsville Campaign and the constant finger-pointing at the "Flying Dutchmen". Even Pula discusses this a bit in his book when he talks about Schurz writing that the blame was taking a toll on the men and that they could fight better if given the chance.

That said, even with shaky morale, the Eleventh Corps fought about as well as could be expected in the circumstances presented on July 1. And they acquitted themselves well on July 2 on Cemetery Hill and, to a more limited extent, Culp's Hill especially considering what they had suffered on the previous day.

I would have to look to see what WDS has as their morale levels (and the officers' command ratings) as I haven't played Gettysburg in a while and don't know them off the top of my head.

Ryan

I think it's hard for a consim designer using things like morale ratings to base those on subjective judgments of what the units could have done if they had been better led/placed in better situations. We can do that sort of plausible speculation studying units and battles but consim designers generally try not to stray too far into subjective fantasyland. They can invent hypothetical scenarios allowing each side to grab additional troops that weren't present, etc but as a rule they're working with history. It's kind of a Parcells standard: if your record is 6-10 you're a 6-10 football team. They come up with restrictions/adaptations, etc to make the game competitive, using things like awarding victory points for holding an objective longer than happened historically, causing the opponnt to suffer more casualties to take an objective, etc. Full disclosure: I've never designed one of these myself. But I may have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

 

[rpkennedy]

It was 4+ tables. May have been 6. Then two more for North Africa part. No idea how complex it was. But that was a monster.

While I appreciate the scale of that game (and I do play Gary Grigsby's War in the West and enjoy the operational level of play), who the heck has the room for a full game? The size of that is ridiculous (but probably fun as all get out).

Ryan

 

[rpkennedy]

So I assume you never tested Dave Powell's 9-mapper for the CWBS Seven Days campaign scenario?

I never did. But I have gamed out the Seven Days in WDS's Campaign Peninsula. That has a master map of almost 65,000 hexes.

Ryan

 

[rpkennedy]

I think it's hard for a consim designer using things like morale ratings to base those on subjective judgments of what the units could have done if they had been better led/placed in better situations. We can do that sort of plausible speculation studying units and battles but consim designers generally try not to stray too far into subjective fantasyland. They can invent hypothetical scenarios allowing each side to grab additional troops that weren't present, etc but as a rule they're working with history. It's kind of a Parcells standard: if your record is 6-10 you're a 6-10 football team. They come up with restrictions/adaptations, etc to make the game competitive, using things like awarding victory points for holding an objective longer than happened historically, causing the opponnt to suffer more casualties to take an objective, etc. Full disclosure: I've never designed one of these myself. But I may have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

Agreed. I tend not to second-guess the designers because that's outside of my wheelhouse. But it is fun and interesting to discuss.

Ryan