M1861 Springfield 1862 dtd Lockplate

[D. Lowe]

Knowledgeable members,

I typically collect Helmets from WW1 and WW2, but as a opportunist collector, found what I think is a M1861 Springfield with a 1862 lock plate for a considerable good price. It being Winter in Massachusetts, one tends to amuse themselves with, lets take it part and really look at it.

Barrel has no date that is visible due to considerable pitting. The V P and Eagle is faint but eagle looks to be associated to Springfield. Under side of Barrell is marked with initials of L.E.H. P. I can find no reference to these.

Lock is dtd 1862 U.S. Springfield, but eagle is not present again due to pitting.

The stock has two cartouches, one horizontal the other vertical towards the rear. The horizontal one has a three letter code, with what looks like to be a A(3rd ltr,). Not sure if this is for Erskine S. Allin, as the ones I've seen the outside edge is oval vice rectangular.

Other oddity is the lower Bridle screw has been replaced with a copper rivet. Anyone ever seen this before?

Any thoughts or opinions on who is the proofer L.E.H.?

Don

 

[scooter748driver]

The rifle looks good to me, but the experts will be along soon with more information.

 

[johan_steele]

Can you post a picture of the complete weapon. It's easier to see condition that way.

 

[D. Lowe]

Let me put it back together during work tomorrow. The blessings of working from home. Again specifically looking for any info on L.E.H. who Proofed the barrel and why would anyone use a copper rivet instead of a screw for the bridle.

DL

 

[Jeff in Ohio]

Duct tape, bailing wire and copper rivets will fix lots of stuff if you don't have the proper repair parts

 

[johan_steele]

Duct tape, bailing wire and copper rivets will fix lots of stuff if you don't have the proper repair parts

Hey… don't make me send you a MRE meal in thanks for such advice.

 

[Old Soldier]

Hey… don't make me send you a MRE meal in thanks for such advice.

Is that a threat or a promise?

 

[johan_steele]

Is that a threat or a promise?

Yes, yes it is.

 

[D. Lowe]

If it wasn't for duct tape and twenty layers of paint, some of our boats would have sunk long ago.

 

[bayonet]

Hey… don't make me send you a MRE meal in thanks for such advice.

MRE? I thought you and me were still eating out of the cans back in the day. You can have the one with beans and the other with eggs.
I'll take your John Wayne chocolate bars with the crackers.

 

[bayonet]

Is that a threat or a promise?

Yes send us yours. You Brits and Canadians as I remember had Rum in your meals (MRE or C rations or whatever you called them)

 

[Old Soldier]

Yes send us yours. You Brits and Canadians as I remember had Rum in your meals (MRE or C rations or whatever you called them)

No, we didn't. Not in Compo (Ration, Composite, GS, 24hr) anyway and certainly not in the 1970s and 80s. Even the Cadbury's Chocolate had a white film all over it! 'Main Course' was dried potato, Biscuits, Brown and a can of 'something' - often what was claimed to be Steak and Kidney (Snake and Pygmy to us) Corned Beef (!!**$£&) or some such allegedly meat product. Baconburger, instant soup of some description (and taste?). It came in 4-man packs too for tankies.

 

[johan_steele]

MRE? I thought you and me were still eating out of the cans back in the day. You can have the one with beans and the other with eggs.
I'll take your John Wayne chocolate bars with the crackers.

I actually really liked the c rats corned beef and hash. But the eggs… we'd give them to civvies and the smart ones would throw them back… with hostile intent.

MRE in my day but on the Rez HS we got C Rats that were ready to expire for lunch. Cooks had real skill in turning them into palatable (mostly) meals. Govt largess at its finest.

As a note Van Kamps has been making pork n beans to the same recipe since 1865.

 

[johan_steele]

If it wasn't for duct tape and twenty layers of paint, some of our boats would have sunk long ago.

Heh, I know of an F-16 that crossed the Atlantic with the wingtip sidewinders secured with F4 tape. Crew chief said if he'd tried to fire the missiles all that would have happened would have been some acceleration and a lot of cussing.

 

[D. Lowe]

Any one have photos of Stock Cartouche's. Found past post showing the various VP Eagle Proofs. Was wondering if anyone has done the same for the stock proof initials.

 

[Old Soldier]

Any one have photos of Stock Cartouche's. Found past post showing the various VP Eagle Proofs. Was wondering if anyone has done the same for the stock proof initials.

Well Done!!! Back on line again!

 

[bayonet]

No, we didn't. Not in Compo (Ration, Composite, GS, 24hr) anyway and certainly not in the 1970s and 80s. Even the Cadbury's Chocolate had a white film all over it! 'Main Course' was dried potato, Biscuits, Brown and a can of 'something' - often what was claimed to be Steak and Kidney (Snake and Pygmy to us) Corned Beef (!!**$£&) or some such allegedly meat product. Baconburger, instant soup of some description (and taste?). It came in 4-man packs too for tankies.

ahhh must of been them Canadians then

 

[UCVRelics]

Any one have photos of Stock Cartouche's. Found past post showing the various VP Eagle Proofs. Was wondering if anyone has done the same for the stock proof initials.

Here you go. There are several different inspectors. I believe the Springfield CW musket book has them all listed.

 

[D. Lowe]

Thanks, still doing the Forensics, and pretty much know this is a parts gun. Barrel was proofed by L.E.H. In a reference Bulletin from the American Society of Arms Collectors, the author notes that Barrels for Wm Mason Guns were supplied by either the Providence Tool Co. RI or by Washburn in Worchester, MA. The Eagle proof for Prov does not match the Proof on this barrel. I do not have a reference of Proofs that Washburn used, so could be from them, or simply proofed at Mason in Taunton, MA. From the same reference this is the the Stock Flat Cartouche on a Mason Contract M1861. From evidence in this Forum and others, the cartouches are typically both horizontal unlike this and my example. Going to try to use Photoshop to do a overlay of the stamps like I saw in a different post.