Removal from command - most deserving?

[Rio Bravo]

Henry Hopkins Sibley. He was drinking throughout the New Mexico Campaign and lounging around while others fought the battles. After the ragged retreat back to Texas one of his officers brought charges against Sibley for drunkenness, cowardice, mistreatment of sick and wounded, etc., though he managed to work his way out of that and remained in command. He later made some screw-ups in Louisiana under Richard Taylor. Taylor had him court-martialed. Sibley was not found guilty for disobeying orders, but was censured. He was ordered back to Richmond and, thankfully, never again held a command.

After the war, Sibley went to Egypt as General of Artillery in the Khedive's Army ! I expect he took his Sibley Tent with him LOL ! Rio

 

[TFSmith121]

I always thought Burnside was a decent divisional commander. He was out of his league as a corps commander, IMHO.

I'd given him a little more credit. At the Divisional level, he was solid; at corps, he was capable, as witness Knoxville (which was a force of about ~20,000+, IIRC). Army level was poor.

Best,

 

[TFSmith121]

Yeah.
Landscape turned Red. Sears.
Gettysburg. The Second Day. Pfanz.
Hancock. His superior officer. If you didn't work out under Hancock, you were looking for a new job.

And yet, WIA three times, promoted from colonel to BG and brevet to MG, and at least one reference is that he was exonerated in a court of inquiry. Sounds like there's much more going on than a case like that of, for example, Ledlie.

Best,

 

[dlavin]

I am in agreement with whomever said Pope. Not sure he merited the promotion to Army of Virginia, but he sure got handed at 2nd Manassass.

Ledley is a worthy choice as well.

Theophilus Holmes on the CSA side

 

[Lt R. Blackwell 4th Texas]

John Floyd or Gideon Pillow - flip a coin.

Although KIA and not removed, the more I read about Leonidas Polk, the higher he rises in this ranking.

Boy, we had some real winners in the West.

 

[Lt R. Blackwell 4th Texas]

Henry Hopkins Sibley. He was drinking throughout the New Mexico Campaign and lounging around while others fought the battles. After the ragged retreat back to Texas one of his officers brought charges against Sibley for drunkenness, cowardice, mistreatment of sick and wounded, etc., though he managed to work his way out of that and remained in command. He later made some screw-ups in Louisiana under Richard Taylor. Taylor had him court-martialed. Sibley was not found guilty for disobeying orders, but was censured. He was ordered back to Richmond and, thankfully, never again held a command.

This past weekend I watched "The Good, the Bad and the Ugly" for the first time in decades. I had forgotten how much of the plot, scenes, characters, etc. are intertwined with Sibley's campaign. Plenty of Civil War for a western movie. There are references to Sibley, Canby, Glorietta Pass, and other places. Pretty amazing that an obscure campaign got so much play in a major classic movie.

 

[Yankeedave]

And yet, WIA three times, promoted from colonel to BG and brevet to MG, and at least one reference is that he was exonerated in a court of inquiry. Sounds like there's much more going on than a case like that of, for example, Ledlie.

Best,

There is something wrong with this guy. If he could fight the corps wouldn't have canned him. If he had some value some where a spot would have been made available. Like i said, there is something off about the guy.

 

[Borderruffian]

Earl Van Dorn, while might have been a capable Cavalry Officer pre war, he had nothing to recomend him to command of the Trans-Miss except his friendship with Jeff Davis and the all important West Point Education that Davis was so sure made one a great military mind and a general in waiting. Van Dorn proved his lack of understanding the basics of having commmand of a large force at Pea Ridge by over marching the troops on short rations and very limited rest, having his supply train follow far far in trace including his ammunition resupply and not keeping aware of the Ground truth during the engagment when McCulloch and McIntosh were killed, causing that wing to falter.

His performance in the Corinith-Iuka campaign was frurther lack luster and did nothing to burnish his tarnished image, but I guess if your Jeff's friend you get do-overs.

 

[Hunter]

Earl Van Dorn, while might have been a capable Cavalry Officer pre war, he had nothing to recomend him to command of the Trans-Miss except his friendship with Jeff Davis and the all important West Point Education that Davis was so sure made one a great military mind and a general in waiting. Van Dorn proved his lack of understanding the basics of having commmand of a large force at Pea Ridge by over marching the troops on short rations and very limited rest, having his supply train follow far far in trace including his ammunition resupply and not keeping aware of the Ground truth during the engagment when McCulloch and McIntosh were killed, causing that wing to falter.

His performance in the Corinith-Iuka campaign was frurther lack luster and did nothing to burnish his tarnished image, but I guess if your Jeff's friend you get do-overs.

I believe Van Dorn was "removed from command" when the husband of his paramour shot him.

 

[Borderruffian]

I believe Van Dorn was "removed from command" when the husband of his paramour shot him.

Well yeah, in Tennessee after he he'd had his share of epic fumbles in Ark La Miss and was greatly reduced in command goes to show ya can't dally with another fellas wife and not have some holes knocked in yer carcas , Guess lover boy Earl found that out the hard way.

 

[TFSmith121]

There is something wrong with this guy. If he could fight the corps wouldn't have canned him. If he had some value some where a spot would have been made available. Like i said, there is something off about the guy.

Have to see who else was in the pool in 1864, however.

Best,

 

[damYankee]

Colonel Rodney Mason, hands down the least competent man to ever recieve a command.

 

[novushomus]

I am in agreement with whomever said Pope. Not sure he merited the promotion to Army of Virginia, but he sure got handed at 2nd Manassass.

Ledley is a worthy choice as well.

Theophilus Holmes on the CSA side

I agree that Holmes deserves to be removed from command, especially for the disaster that was the Battle of Helena. However, Holmes wasn't removed from command. After the defeat at Helena, the stress triggered an illness that forced Holmes to relinquish command of the District of Arkansas. He missed the Little Rock Campaign, and after although he resumed command again for the winter of 1863-64, he resigned before the Red River and Camden Expeditions began. He was in the words of his superior, E. Kirby Smith, "a true patriot, faithful, and devoted; time, his troubles, and responsibilities have preyed upon him, his memory is failing, he has no confidence in hiself, and is without fixity of purpose. I love him for his virtues, but a younger man should command the District of Arkansas, where boldness, energy, and activity, with prudence, are essential to success."1


1. O.R. Series 1, Vol. 34 (2), 870.

 

[rpkennedy]

There is something wrong with this guy. If he could fight the corps wouldn't have canned him. If he had some value some where a spot would have been made available. Like i said, there is something off about the guy.

Caldwell kind of got the shaft. He had had his ups and downs but Sykes called into question Caldwell's actions at Gettysburg (unjustly and in a defense of some of the questionable actions of his own troops and commanders) which really put the kibosh on Caldwell's career. When the Second and Third Corps were consolidated, Caldwell became the last man out. He was a fairly solid commander who probably would have done about as well as Francis Barlow, who took command of his division.

R

 

[BrianB]

Don't forget Col. Jesse Appler! He certain needs at least a (dis)honorable mention here.

 

[Yankeedave]

He did ok at lower levels. In the 2nd Corps if you didnt or couldnt fight you went somewhere else. I cant think of another officer where the cadre voted you out.

 

[damYankee]

The case against Rodney Mason

Although Rodney Mason had had a poor showing that July at the Union's "devastating defeat" at Bull Run, Stewart said Mason was not alone: "Everybody's actions were questioned that day."

So when the son of the Springfield lawyer and longtime Republican politician Samson Mason (Stewart wrongly identifies him as Samuel Mason) expressed his desire to lead the 71st, he seemed a logical choice.

New Carlisle-born attorney Elihu Stephen Williams, 26, helped Capt. James Carlin with recruiting in Miami County. Recruiting spots in Springfield included George Spence's law office, the J. Petticrew carriage shop and Ransom & Rogers Bookstore, where Solomon J. Houck, a 31-year-old gas works agent, led the efforts.

The unit assembled in Troy that fall, and the Springfield Daily News reported that after partaking in a "grand dinner" given by the citizens of Piqua, the 71st "returned to camp sober — to a man."

After a parade in Cincinnati, the 71st traveled to Paducah, Ky., where they saw the first Southern sympathizers they would live among for years and the first Union wounded from the battle of Fort Donelson.

"They are an awful sight to see," wrote one soldier, "some with part of an arm off, some a leg, some shot in the face. They are cut up in every way."

A faltering start

The 71st's first action came as it guarded the Lick Creek crossing on the Hamburg Road near the Tennessee River.

"Even after 150 years, it is not possible to determine exactly what happened to the 71st OVI at Shiloh on Sunday, April 6, 1862," Stewart writes.

The Confederate attack came Sunday morning as Union soldiers were preparing their breakfasts. And although Lt. Barton Kyle was mortally wounded, one of 57 killed and 51 listed as missing — too many for a unit that was accused of running en masse toward safety — "the men of the 55th Illinois certainly felt that they had been abandoned by the 71st," Stewart writes.

In the Northern press, Stewart notes, the 71st, and other Ohio units "were accused of cowardice."

Returning to New Carlisle, Lt. Elihu Williams wrote that although "quite unwell," he would be more than willing to travel to Troy to counter the "slanderous reports" with "a plain, unvarnished tale" of what happened.

But in his memoirs, Gen. Ulysses Grant recalls Col. Mason being "mortified at his action," coming "with tears in his eyes" and begging "to be allowed another trial."

Mason's failure at that next trial sealed his reputation and, for a time, sullied that of the 71st.

Sad surrender

At Clarksville, Tenn., on Aug. 18, 1862, Mason thought himself facing a superior force commanded by Col. Adam Rankin "Stovepipe" Johnson. At first rejecting his advice to surrender, Mason gave up his force of 125-200 men to a force of 200-300 Confederates without a shot.

The Western Standard of Celina, a largely Democratic paper, replied with withering editorial fire.

"The cowardly Colonel of the 71st regiment ... went into the service not from motives of patriotism, but to win a name and fame that would carry him into the Halls of Congress, and his record is made."

Four days later, by order of the president, Mason was cashiered "for repeated acts of cowardice in the face of the enemy."

An Ohio Congressional delegation appealed to Secretary of War Edwin Stanton, who told them reinstating cashiered officers would demoralize the army.

Of the junior officers, only Clark County's Solomon Houck was "quickly reinstated," Stewart reports, although he does not explain why.

The remainder of the 71st soldiered on.

Rebels, runaways

In July of 1863, the unit was assigned to Gallatin, Tenn., where General John Hunt Morgan and his raiders were harassing the union in a battle for control of the Louisville and Nashville Railroad.

With the Emancipation Proclamation in effect, "hundreds of runaway slaves were living at makeshift camps in Gallatin," Stewart writes.

In a letter to the Bryan (Ohio) Union Press, Capt. W.A. Hunter said recently emancipated slaves were slaving away at army work, having been given "just as much right to do the drudgery of war as the white."

Gallatin was also a place where the 14th United States Colored Infantry was formed. Giving way to practicality, Stewart writes, "the families ... were allowed to stay in the contraband camp."

Private John M. Piles of the 71st's Company E wrote: "I say arm every Negro to kill every Rebel."

At Gallatin, Springfield's Capt. Sol Houck was provost marshal, heading the police force. Dealing with many Tennessee natives at the time, Houck befriended a couple of them and sent their thoroughbred horses temporarily to his Ohio farm "when these valuable horses were going to be pressed into service." Houck returned them after the war.

With Ohio's Clement Vallandingham and former Union General George McClellan campaigning for peace with the South, politics continued to impose itself on the unit.

Celina's Western Standard complained that "had any abolitionist accomplished one half" of what Capt. Elihu Williams had accomplished, "official military honors would have been heaped upon him; but, being a Democrat, the captain must be content with ... having well and truly performed his duty."

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/n...lunteer-infantry-had-checkered-reputat/nNnDf/

 

[UCVRelics]

I going with Gen Burnside at Fredericksburg. After reading reports before and after the battle and the march across the field, it remindeded me of the Cheech & Chong album ( yes I said album) of the Japanese kamikaze pilot, " you want me to do what"

 

[frontrank2]

I going with Gen Burnside at Fredericksburg. After reading reports before and after the battle and the march across the field, it remindeded me of the Cheech & Chong album ( yes I said album) of the Japanese kamikaze pilot, " you want me to do what"

OMG! I had forgotten all about that, must be over 30 years since I last heard that.

 

[Aussie Billy Sherman]

I still think Pope was a capable officer but not worthy of leading an army in the Virginian theater