Discussion Who caused the most problems, Unionist in the South or Confederate supporters in the North?

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leftyhunter

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The problem in the North wasn't really people who were pro-Confederate. Instead, it was those who were anti-war or very apathetic about the conflict. They didn't want to fight, much less get drafted.
True but unlike Unionists they didn't express their dissent by picking up a rifle.
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leftyhunter

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The problem in the North wasn't really people who were pro-Confederate. Instead, it was those who were anti-war or very apathetic about the conflict. They didn't want to fight, much less get drafted.
Also true but between recruiting Confederate defectors,African -Americans and foreigners either in or outside the US the Union Army and Navy was able to get enough manpower to win vs the Confederate Army not so much.
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CCMDCSA

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I would say the Union had to use a lot of soldiers to keep Maryland, Kentucky and Missouri in the Union. This manpower could have been used in the field. Maryland had twice as many serve in the Union Army but many were in Home Brigades and were not trusted by the military. JMHO
Maryland had it's far share of immigrants in northern ranks as well has several thousand slaves and free blacks serving in colored regiments for the state
 

CCMDCSA

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In the Book "bushwackers the civil war in the western north carolina mountains " unionists in the area were definitely a huge nuisance to Confederate forces they were better armed and supplied than the home guards and in some cases the regular forces they made operations for confederate forces extremely difficult
 

John S. Carter

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Confederaye supports in the North were a real issue, but so were Unionists in the South. From a miltary point of view both were a real issue and both were security risks.
Were there any counties that succeeded from the Union as there were in the Confederacy?These counties required that the Confederate government send divisions into those areas to either suppress their actions.The Union did have Copperheads but they were of political stand.The only area of serious problem would have been South Il/Cairo but they moved more towards Union position in the latter part of the war/Question / did army divisions move into this area to control the actions of the people ?
 

John S. Carter

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Maryland had it's far share of immigrants in northern ranks as well has several thousand slaves and free blacks serving in colored regiments for the state
These states were border states provided troops to both sides.If not for the rapid movement by Lincoln these states may have moved into the CSA By the way the first thing he did was to remove hapis corpus and then moved troops into these states His fear was to have the Capital surrounded by succeeded states,That would surely been interesting for that to happen.
 

CCMDCSA

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These states were border states provided troops to both sides.If not for the rapid movement by Lincoln these states may have moved into the CSA By the way the first thing he did was to remove hapis corpus and then moved troops into these states His fear was to have the Capital surrounded by succeeded states,That would surely been interesting for that to happen.
You are correct
 

leftyhunter

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Were there any counties that succeeded from the Union as there were in the Confederacy?These counties required that the Confederate government send divisions into those areas to either suppress their actions.The Union did have Copperheads but they were of political stand.The only area of serious problem would have been South Il/Cairo but they moved more towards Union position in the latter part of the war/Question / did army divisions move into this area to control the actions of the people ?
Not per Dyer's Compendium. I also saw no evidence per Dyer's Compendium of any Union regiments being diverted ti counterinsurgency duties in Maryland. Perhaps @MarylandLine can provide some examples .
Yes absolutely regular Union regiments mostly Cavalry were diverted into counterinsurgency in Missouri,Kentucky and West Virginia but most did not serve full time in counterinsurgency. The 4th Missouri Cavalry Union would certainly be one notable exception.
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MarylandLine

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Not per Dyer's Compendium. I also saw no evidence per Dyer's Compendium of any Union regiments being diverted ti counterinsurgency duties in Maryland. Perhaps @MarylandLine can provide some examples .
Yes absolutely regular Union regiments mostly Cavalry were diverted into counterinsurgency in Missouri,Kentucky and West Virginia but most did not serve full time in counterinsurgency. The 4th Missouri Cavalry Union would certainly be one notable exception.
Leftyhunter
Check out General Robert Schenck and the Middle Department. Numerous notable Citizens of Maryland and Delaware were arrested and imprisoned till they took the oath. A circuit judge in the town I grew up Richard Bennett Carmichael (family friend Of Roger Brooke Taney) was pistol whipped and dragged from the courtroom and imprisoned in Ft McHenry. I have a book published in 1862 by the State if Delaware about how Union Tripp’s interfered with Delaware elections by chasing known secessionists and leading Democrats from the polls. I could go for a while and bore you to tears.
 

leftyhunter

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Check out General Robert Schenck and the Middle Department. Numerous notable Citizens of Maryland and Delaware were arrested and imprisoned till they took the oath. A circuit judge in the town I grew up Richard Bennett Carmichael (family friend Of Roger Brooke Taney) was pistol whipped and dragged from the courtroom and imprisoned in Ft McHenry. I have a book published in 1862 by the State if Delaware about how Union Tripp’s interfered with Delaware elections by chasing known secessionists and leading Democrats from the polls. I could go for a while and bore you to tears.
Civilians on both side were arrested and sometimes beaten if they were deemed disloyal. Nonetheless I have found no sourced information that Maryland had any Confederate insurgency . Other then South Carolina and Virginia other Southern states certainly had Unionist guerrilla activity. In my thread "Unionist vs CSA guerrillas I have plenty of sourced information.
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jackt62

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Not really. Did had least 110 k Northeners enlist in the Confederate Army? Certainly a few did but interestingly enough so far no one has cited a book similar to "Lincoln's Loyalists Union Soldiers from the Confederacy" that addresses the issue of how many Northeners joined the Confederate .
Did 159k plus people of color in the Northern states join the Confederate Army? Was there widespread Confederate guerrilla warfare out side the border states of Missouri,Kentucky and West Virginia?
Were there large deserter gangs in all Northern states?
Yes there were Copperheads but the war was successfully prosecuted anyways.
Leftyhunter
I'm sticking with my main point in that there was greater political opposition in the North to carrying on the war, then there was in the South. That's what the Confederacy was counting on to achieve its independence. Of course, that didn't happen but it was a real possibility at various times.
 

leftyhunter

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I'm sticking with my main point in that there was greater political opposition in the North to carrying on the war, then there was in the South. That's what the Confederacy was counting on to achieve its independence. Of course, that didn't happen but it was a real possibility at various times.
Not so sure about that.Its highly unlikely that the forty percent of the population of the Confederacy that was either enslaved or racially discriminated against was in favor of an independent Confederacy.
Approximately 260 Southern born men black and white enlisted in the Union Army. So far no figures have been provided of how many Northeners enlisted in the Confederate Army . Since the Confederacy had a smaller population it would of required at least well over half a million Northern men to enlist in the Confederate Army to offset the loss of Confederate manpower to the Union.
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Nathanb1

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As a descendant of someone who was the 4th known family (of mine) "invitee" to the Great Hanging in Gainesville, Texas in 1862....do a quick search on that here and Google. Dr. Richard McCaslin, head of the University of North Texas just published a new book with two original accounts included, and he also wrote THE book on it, Tainted Breeze.

Here's the short story. https://tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/jig01

My great-grandfather, Samuel Houston Powers, narrowly escaped because he was in Grayson County and they couldn't find him :mstickle:. His brother in law, James Powers, was hanged by the mob. His uncle, Moses Powers, was arrested and held, but the family history suggests he utilized the Masonic sign of distress and was freed. And a brother in law, Obediah Atkinson, was sought, but escaped out the back door into a cornfield using a mattress to shield himself from bullets.

James was taken from his front yard. He'd driven up with a load of lumber to enlarge his farmhouse, and his wife and small children were standing on the porch. He was basically sacrificed to the mob during the "trial" with 14 other men never actually getting to testify, etc.; they were handed over to save the other men. In all, 42 men died, mostly from hanging--a few trying to escape, unlike Obediah.

Not long after, the judge was assassinated--and my GGrandfather's older brother, Nathaniel, was possibly partly responsible--the story is that they (he and another victim's son) sneaked back from Confederate Service in Arkansas, killed the guy, and hurried back. I'll just say he deserted from Confederate service and became a galvanized Yankee afterwards, serving out in Arizona Territory for the rest of the war. He also married (while still married to his first wife, who was in Comanche Co., Texas--with the surviving family) and had a lot more kids.

Obediah and family moved back to Missouri (from where they'd emigrated in the 1850's with the rest of the family). Our family suffered mightily from that exodus.
 
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