Where would Robert E. Lee have prefered to Engage The Union Army?

War Horse

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Lee intended to fight at Dillsburg in the northwestern part of the county. Officers told locals that was the plan -- take Harrisburg and then fight it out with the Yankees between York and Carlisle. Note that two of Ewell's divisions followed today's Route 11 through Carlisle toward Harrisburg while Early headed out Route 30 through Gettysburg to York (their respective destinations were the only two sets of bridges from Harrisburg south to Maryland). PA Route 74 through Dillsburg connected the two wings of Ewell's corps, with Dillsburg's Yellow Breeches Creek being a Pipe Creek-type defensive position, with hills and a creek with steep banks. JEB Stuart took the route to Dillsburg and camped there briefly while trying to find the infantry before he received word of the fighting at Gettysburg

Totally stolen from Scott Mingus. @Scott Mingus I found it to fascinating to ignore. Thank you so much for sharing!
 
Lee intended to fight at Dillsburg in the northwestern part of the county. Officers told locals that was the plan -- take Harrisburg and then fight it out with the Yankees between York and Carlisle.

Based on this passage, you do not believe that Gettysburg was the optimal choice for the battle? If not, what would make "between York and Carlisle" more optimal? I interpreted "take Harrisburg" as more of a "practicable" order, rather than one of priority.
 
Here is the thing:

Ewell told Lee that he could take Harrisburg. Lee ordered him back South, instead of telling to go for it and send reinforcements.

Recently certain scholars came to Lee's defense saying that his judgement was kinda not there because during that part of the Gettysburg campaign he had to use the chamberpot much more that usually...

My (sarcastic) answer to the question would be that Lee would prefer to engage the Union Army closest to the most number of porta-potties on the field, because he felt the urgency...

My (non-sarcastic) answer is that Lee should probably intended to fight in Lancaster or Philly...
 
Based on this passage, you do not believe that Gettysburg was the optimal choice for the battle? If not, what would make "between York and Carlisle" more optimal? I interpreted "take Harrisburg" as more of a "practicable" order, rather than one of priority.

Taking Harrisburg was way much more practicable for Ewell than taking "that hill". 20000 confederates vs 3000 militia (including some 1812 War veterans) who would not burn that bridge. That was the slum dunk of practicableness...
 
Here is the thing:

Ewell told Lee that he could take Harrisburg. Lee ordered him back South, instead of telling to go for it and send reinforcements.

Recently certain scholars came to Lee's defense saying that his judgement was kinda not there because during that part of the Gettysburg campaign he had to use the chamberpot much more that usually...

My (sarcastic) answer to the question would be that Lee would prefer to engage the Union Army closest to the most number of porta-potties on the field, because he felt the urgency...

My (non-sarcastic) answer is that Lee should probably intended to fight in Lancaster or Philly...
That is way more information than I was looking for. Lol. Think about it seriously. Lee never really intended to fight there. Otherwise why would he have had to recall Ewell He had other places in mind and took what was afforded him. Gettysburg was an accident. I believe that.
 
That is way more information than I was looking for. Lol. Think about it seriously. Lee never really intended to fight there. Otherwise why would he have had to recall Early? He had other places in mind and took what was afforded him. Gettysburg was an accident. I believe that.

Early's division (when Ewell told Lee that he could take Harrisburg with his 2 other divisions) was in York other than Gordon's Brigade that was at Wrightsville trying to fight the fires on the bridge and the town there.

From what I gather, I suspect that Lee was more of seat of his pants guy than most people want to admit (and not on the context of the seat of his pants during this campaign). Just like Jackson, but without the weirdness and the paranoid personality disorder...
 
Early's division (when Ewell told Lee that he could take Harrisburg with his 2 other divisions) was in York other than Gordon's Brigade that was at Wrightsville trying to fight the fires on the bridge and the town there.

From what I gather, I suspect that Lee was more of seat of his pants guy than most people want to admit (and not on the context of the seat of his pants during this campaign). Just like Jackson, but without the weirdness and the paranoid personality disorder...
Agreed, but why would he have had his army so scattered just prior to G-Burg. He never intended to fight there. Do you not agree with that?
 
Agreed, but why would he have had his army so scattered just prior to G-Burg. He never intended to fight there. Do you not agree with that?

Yes. Lee did not intend to fight in Gettysburg.

Also, Lee did not have a plan for a particular location to fight the "battle that would end all battles" in the Gettysburg Campaign.
 
I have not read or heard anyone saying that Lee intended to fight at Gettysburg. There is a lot of junk out there about where all the roads meet etc from the 1950s, but that does not really indicate intention.
It was happenstance. The Pipe creek line was the Unions ideal spot and the confederates wanted Dillsburg's Yellow Breeches Creek being a Pipe Creek-type defensive position. It offered the same type defensive opportunities as the Pipe Creek line. Steep banks and a formidable salient.
 
Agreed, but why would he have had his army so scattered just prior to G-Burg. He never intended to fight there. Do you not agree with that?

Just a posit: one of the main reasons for coming North was to procure supplies. JEB was out collecting what he did. Carlisle was gone through pretty thoroughly. Perhaps it was partially due to the foraging aspect of the move North.
 
Just a posit: one of the main reasons for coming North was to procure supplies. JEB was out collecting what he did. Carlisle was gone through pretty thoroughly. Perhaps it was partially due to the foraging aspect of the move North.
Nope he (Lee) had plans that did not include Gettysburg. He was opportunistic if nothing else.
 
Dillsburg is strictly conjecture on the part of some local historians based upon what little is revealed in the OR, coupled with Rebel statements to locals during the occupation. What is fact is that Ewell was up in Carlisle; Early was here in York (with Gordon's foray to the river, of course). Dillsburg was a convenient (and easy to defend) point on the State Road connecting Carlisle and York. Early's orders from Ewell were to cross South Mountain to Gettysburg, proceed to York, destroy the Columbia bridge, and then march to Carlisle through Dillsburg. Early, because the militia defending Gettysburg were "so utterly inefficient," on his own initiative decided to try to capture the bridge, cross into Lancaster County, steal as many horses as he could, mount his men, and then march on Harrisburg. Ironically, the state militia (ordered to defend the bridge) ended up burning it (fulfilling Ewell's original orders to Early.
 
Here's another version Lee told one of his officer's. The plan was to burn the bridges to the east, blocking any troops from coming in from that direction. He then planned to turn on the a.o.p., defeat it, then turn on any troops coming from the west.
I have read that after antietam Lee began mapping Gettysburg, sending stuart on a raid to gather info. Imho he planned ahead.
 
Just a posit: one of the main reasons for coming North was to procure supplies. JEB was out collecting what he did. Carlisle was gone through pretty thoroughly. Perhaps it was partially due to the foraging aspect of the move North.
JEB did gather supplies that ultimately proved very useful, however at the time he acquired them, they were very cumbersome and slowed him and his extremely valuable intelligence from making it to Lee in time for Lee to prepare for the battle that was inevitable. Imagine had Stuart have arrived just 24 hours earlier. I know another "What If" but a fascinating one.
 
JEB did gather supplies that ultimately proved very useful, however at the time he acquired them, they were very cumbersome and slowed him and his extremely valuable intelligence from making it to Lee in time for Lee to prepare for the battle that was inevitable. Imagine had Stuart have arrived just 24 hours earlier. I know another "What If" but a fascinating one.
Coddington rakes old Jeb over the coals in his book. Thank goodness for a book from today's historian for "Enough Blame to go Around". :smile coffee:
 
Not to be argumentative but just how valuable were those supplies. With supplies brought and those aquired stuart's seem unessecary. I doubt jeb knew at the time. Was he just following orders?
 
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