What if there had not been Debates?

wbull1

Sergeant
Joined
Jul 26, 2018
Messages
821
#1
In the Senate race against Stephen A. Douglas in 1858, Douglas had more money, a more experienced party structure, more name recognition and a lot more experience as a candidate. Early in the race, Lincoln had so little name recognition that he followed Douglas around speaking to smaller crowds the day after Douglas made major addresses. If Lincoln had not challenged Douglas to debate, would he have been able to gain national attention and everything that followed or would he have remained an obscure politician, unknown even within Illinois?
 

(Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)
Joined
Apr 4, 2017
Messages
7,921
Location
Denver, CO
#2
Without the debates Stephan Douglas would have been tempted to cross the party boundary and take the Senate seat as a Republican, as Lyman Trumbull had done.
The events that followed would have been significantly different than those that occurred.
 
Joined
Apr 4, 2017
Messages
7,921
Location
Denver, CO
#4
Lincoln was following Douglas around Illinois. That prevented Douglas from sliding into the Republican Party. Douglas thought he would destroy Lincoln, especially with the Black Republican tag. But Lincoln held his own and Douglas was forced into softening his pro slavery stance in order to sustain some position in Chicago and No. Illinois. 2 years later his party split and the rest is history. Douglas should have been a lot more cautious.
 

wbull1

Sergeant
Joined
Jul 26, 2018
Messages
821
#7
The truth of Lincoln's White Supremacist nature may not have come out.

Respectfully,

William

One Nation
Two countries
View attachment 296214

His nature? Really? How strange then that he supported ending slavery in Washington, DC, recognized the nation of Haiti, earned the friendship of Frederick Douglass and other blacks who interacted with him personally, pushed the 13th Amendment through Congress and supported at least some black voting rights, which was why Booth said he was determined to assassinate Lincoln.

Respectfully, please expain,
 
Joined
Jun 29, 2011
Messages
5,718
Location
Mt. Gilead, North Carolina
#8
His nature? Really? How strange then that he supported ending slavery in Washington, DC, recognized the nation of Haiti, earned the friendship of Frederick Douglass and other blacks who interacted with him personally, pushed the 13th Amendment through Congress and supported at least some black voting rights, which was why Booth said he was determined to assassinate Lincoln.

Respectfully, please expain,
I will say then, that I am not nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way, the social and political equality of the white and black races, that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of making voters of the negroes, or jurors, or qualifying them to hold office, or having them to marry with white people. I will say in addition, that there is a physical difference between the white and black races, which I suppose, will forever forbid the two races living together upon terms of social and political equality, and inasmuch, as they cannot so live, that while they do remain together, there must be the position of superior and inferior, that I as much as any other man am in favor of the superior position being assigned to the white man. I say in this connection, that I do not perceive, however, that because the white man is to have the superior position, that it requires that the negro should be denied everything.
Source: The Lincoln-Douglas Debates: The First Complete, Unexpurgated Text, p. 189, Editor Harold Holzer. Oxford University Press. Kindle Edition.

My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave, I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves, I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone, I would also do that. What I do about slavery and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. I shall try to correct errors when shown to be errors, and I shall adopt new views so fast as they shall appear to be true views.
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 8, pp. 15-16, By Nicolay & Hay

In it [this speech] you not only perceive, as a probability, that in that contest [with Douglas in 1858] I did not at any time say I was in favor of negro suffrage; but the absolute proof that twice—once substantially and once expressly—I declared against it.
Source: The Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 5, p. 145, by Nicolay & Hay

As matter of fact, the first branch of the proposition is historically true: the government was made by white men, and they were and are the superior race.
Source: Life and Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol III, p 282, Roy P. Basler

Nor is it any argument that we are superior and the negro inferior—that he has but one talent while we have ten. Let the negro possess the little he has in independence; if he has but one talent, he should be permitted to keep the little he has.
Source: Life and Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol III, p 282, Roy P. Basler

There is no reason…why the negro is not entitled to all the rights enumerated in the Declaration of Independence – the right of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.… He is as much entitled to these as the white man…[though] he is not my equal in many respects, certainly not in color – perhaps not in intellectual and moral endowments; but in the right to eat the bread without leave of anybody else which his own hand earns, he is my equal and the equal…of every other man.
Source: The Complete Lincoln-Douglas Debates of 1858, p. 117, Paul M. Angle

Respectfully,

William

One Nation
Two countries
Confed-American Flag - Thumbnail.jpg
 



(Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)
Top