What If Lee wins a better Fredericksburg.

John Wolf Smith

Nov 6, 2019
This is like my Lee wins Antietam thread.


Army of Northern Virginia: Gen Robert E. Lee (59,389)

First Corps: LtG James Longstreet (24,427)

McLaws' Division: MG Lafayette McLaws (3,617)
Kershaw's Brigade: BG Joseph B. Kershaw (1,236)
Barksdale's Brigade: BG William Barksdale (1,016)
Cobb's Brigade: BG Thomas R.R. Cobb (874)
Semmes' Brigade: BG Paul J. Semmes (Wounded) (491)

Anderson's Division: MG Richard H. Anderson (5,537)
Wilcox's Brigade: BG Cadmus M. Wilcox (Wounded) (1,240)
Mahone's Brigade: BG William Mahone (1,333)
Featherston's Brigade: BG Winfield S. Featherston (1,025)
Wright's Brigade: BG Ambrose R. Wright (1,195)
Perry's Brigade: BG Edward A. Perry (744)

Pickett's Division: MG George Pickett (6,997)
Garnett's Brigade: BG Richard B. Garnett (1,460)
Armistead's Brigade: BG Lewis A. Armistead (1,338)
Kemper's Brigade: BG James L. Kemper (966)
Jenkins' Brigade: BG Micah Jenkins (2,088)
Corse' s Brigade: BG Montgomery D. Corse (1,145)

Hood's Division: MG John B. Hood (5,756)
Law's Brigade: BG Evander M. Law (2,407)
Robertson' s Brigade: BG Jerome B. Robertson (1,163)
Anderson's Brigade: BG George T. Anderson (1,484)
Toombs' Brigade: Col Henry L. Benning (Wounded) (702)

Ransom's Division: BG Robert Ransom, Jr. (2,520)
Ransom's Brigade: Col Matt W. Ransom (1,216)
Cooke's Brigade: BG John R. Cooke (1,304)

Second Corps: LtG Thomas J. Jackson (20,685)

Hill's Division: MG Daniel H. Hill (5,889)
Rodes' Brigade: BG Robert E. Rodes (1,416)
Doles' Brigade: BG George Doles (1,287)
Colquitt's Brigade: BG Alfred H. Colquitt (1,196)
Iverson's Brigade: BG Alfred Iverson Jr. (862)
Ramseur's Brigade: Col Bryan Grimes (1,128)

Hill's Light Division: MG Ambrose P. Hill (6,490)
Field's Brigade: Col John M. Brockenbrough (544)
Gregg's Brigade: BG Maxcy Gregg (1,205)
Thomas' Brigade: BG Edward L. Thomas (691)
Lane's Brigade: BG James H. Lane (2,160)
Archer's Brigade: BG James J. Archer (1,115)
Pender's Brigade: BG William D. Pender (775)

Ewell's Division: BG Jubal A. Early (Wounded) (4,915)
Lawton's Brigade: Col Edmund N. Atkinson (Killed) (1,437)
Trimble's Brigade: Col Robert Hoke (1,128)
Early's Brigade: Col James A. Walker (Wounded) (1,201)
Hays' Brigade: BG Harry T. Hays (1,149)

Jackson's Division: BG William B. Taliaferro (Wounded) (3,391)
Paxton's Brigade: BG Elisha F. Paxton (1,093)
Jones’ Brigade: BG John R. Jones (805)
Taliaferro's Brigade: Col Edward T.H. Warren (683)
Starke's Brigade: Col Edmund Pendleton (810)

Cavalry: MG James E.B. Stuart (5,037)
1st Brigade: BG Wade Hampton (Wounded) (1,048)
2nd Brigade: BG Fitzhugh Lee (1,177)
3rd Brigade: BG William H.F. Lee (1,702)
4th Brigade: BG William E. Jones (1,110)


Army of the Potomac: MG Ambrose Burnside (33,462)
Chief of Staff: MG John Parke
Chief of Artillery: BG Henry J. Hunt
Inspector General: BG Delos B. Sackett

Right Grand Division: MG Edwin V. Sumner (11,812)

II Corps: MG Darius N. Couch (3,789)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) First Division: MG Winfield S. Hancock (1,485)
1st Brigade: BG John C. Caldwell (672)
2nd Brigade: BG Thomas F. Meagher (329)
3rd Brigade: Col Samuel K. Zook (484)

Second Division: MG Oliver O. Howard (1,382)
(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) 1st Brigade: BG Alfred Sully (1,099)
2nd Brigade: Col Joshua T. Owen (205)
3rd Brigade: Col Norman J. Hall (488)

Third Division: MG William H. French (922)
1st Brigade: BG Nathan Kimball (441)
2nd Brigade: Col Oliver H. Palmer (146)
3rd Brigade: Col John W. Andrews (355)

IX Corps: BG Orlando B. Willcox (8,023)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) First Division: BG William W. Burns (4,552)
1st Brigade: Col Orlando Poe (1,643)
2nd Brigade: Col Benjamin C. Christ (1,336)
3rd Brigade: Col Daniel Leasure (1,573)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) Second Division: BG Samuel D. Sturgis (2,387)
1st Brigade: BG James Nagle (1,574)
2nd Brigade: BG Edward Ferrero (813)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) Third Division: BG George W. Getty (1,084)
1st Brigade: Col Rush C. Hawkins (634)
2nd Brigade: Col Edward Harland (450)

Center Grand Division: MG Joseph Hooker (7,742)

III Corps: BG George Stoneman (4,512)

First Division: BG David B. Birney (1,780)
1st Brigade: BG John C. Robinson (585)
2nd Brigade: BG John H. H. Ward (622)
3rd Brigade: BG Hiram G. Berry (573)

Second Division: BG Daniel Sickles (1,628)
1st Brigade: BG Joseph B. Carr (581)
2nd Brigade: Col George B. Hall (537)
3rd Brigade: BG Joseph W. Revere (510)

Third Division: BG Amiel W. Whipple (952)
1st Brigade: BG Abram S. Piatt (634)
2nd Brigade: Col Samuel S. Carroll (318)

V Corps: MG Daniel Butterfield (Killed or Wounded) (3,230)

First Division: BG Charles Griffin (1,337)
1st Brigade: Col James Barnes (528)
2nd Brigade: Col Jacob B. Sweitzer (334)
3rd Brigade: Col Thomas B.W. Stockton (475)

Second Division: MG George Sykes (838)
1st Brigade: Ltc Robert C. Buchanan (200)
2nd Brigade: Maj. George L. Andrews (193)
3rd Brigade: BG Gouverneur K. Warren (445)

Third Division: BG Andrew A. Humphreys (1,055)
1st Brigade: BG Erastus B. Tyler (521)
2nd Brigade: Col Peter H. Allabach (534)

Left Grand Division: MG William B. Franklin (Captured or Killed) (8,377)

I Corps: MG John F. Reynolds (Captured or Killed) (3,921)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) First Division: BG Abner Doubleday (1,498)
1st Brigade: Col Walter Phelps, Jr. (393)
2nd Brigade: Col James Gavin (378)
3rd Brigade: Col William F. Rogers (346)
4th Brigade: BG Solomon Meredith (381)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) Second Division: BG John Gibbon (891)
1st Brigade: Col Adrian R. Root (483)
2nd Brigade: Col Peter Lyle (408)
(Whole Brigade Captured) 3rd Brigade: BG Nelson Taylor (Wounded, Captured) (467)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) Third Division: MG George Meade (1,532)
1st Brigade: Col William Sinclair (478)
2nd Brigade: Col Albert L. Magilton (547)
3rd Brigade: BG Conrad F. Jackson (507)

VI Corps: MG William F. Smith (Captured); (4,456)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) First Division: BG William T. H. Brooks (1,891)
1st Brigade: Col Alfred T.A. Torbert (643)
2nd Brigade: Col Henry L. Cake (715)
3rd Brigade: BG David A. Russell (533)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) Second Division: BG Albion P. Howe (970)
1st Brigade: BG Calvin E. Pratt (257)
2nd Brigade: Col Henry Whiting (713)
(Whole Brigade Captured) 3rd Brigade: BG Francis L. Vinton (Captured); BG Thomas H. Neill (Captured) (674)

(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) Third Division: BG John Newton (1,595)
1st Brigade: BG John Cochrane (558)
2nd Brigade: BG Charles Devens (580)
3rd Brigade: Col Thomas A. Rowley (Killed); BG Frank Wheaton (Captured) (457)

Cavalry Division: BG Alfred Pleasonton (2,064)
1st Brigade: Col John F. Farnsworth (408)
2nd Brigade: Col David M. Gregg (504)
(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) 3rd Brigade: BG William W. Averell (480)
(Trapped across the Rappahannock River) 4th Brigade: BG George D. Bayard (672)

Reserve Grand Division: MG Franz Sigel (Not in the Battle)

XI Corps: BG Julius Stahel

First Division: BG Nathaniel C. McLean
1st Brigade: Col Leopold Von Gilsa
2nd Brigade: Col John C. Lee
Cavalry Brigade: Col Luigi Palma Di Cesnola

Second Division: BG Adolph Von Steinwehr
1st Brigade: Col Adolphus Buschbeck
2nd Brigade: Col Orland Smith

Third Division: BG Carl Schurz
1st Brigade: Col Alexander Schimmelfennig
2nd Brigade: Col Włodzimierz Krzyżanowski

XII Corps: MG Henry W. Slocum

First Division: BG Alpheus S. Williams
1st Brigade: Col Joseph F. Knipe
2nd Brigade: BG Thomas L. Kane
3rd Brigade: Col John K. Murphy

Second Division: BG John W. Geary
1st Brigade: Col Charles Candy
2nd Brigade: Col Joseph M. Sudsburg
3rd Brigade: BG George S. Greene

John Wolf Smith

Nov 6, 2019
What do you mean by a better Fredericksburg? What occurs in your scenario where Burnside loses a full 3/4 of his army?

Jackson's Corps with Pickett's and Hood's Divisions flank the union forces at Marye's Heights. Jackson hits the 1st and 6th corps and drives them to the bridges near the Stafford Heights.


Forum Host
Feb 7, 2006
Midlothian, VA
That's a really unrealistic scenario. If Hood and Pickett wheel to their left, they are going to get a heck of a enfilade fire from Stafford Heights. It also opens up their flank and rear to Franklin's Grand Corps, or Franklin can drive his entire Grand Corps right in where Hood and Picket have vacated, and now what is left of Jackson's corps is cutoff from the rest of the ANV.

You have to consider of any overly aggressive generals that were in teh war, nobody in the ANV dared consider anything like that. For good reason.

Generic Username

May 12, 2019
Jackson's Corps with Pickett's and Hood's Divisions flank the union forces at Marye's Heights. Jackson hits the 1st and 6th corps and drives them to the bridges near the Stafford Heights.

Burnside wanted to keep up the frontal attacks on December 14th; not enough for the scale of casualties shown here, but definitely far worse.


1st Lieutenant
Jul 28, 2015
New York City
Jackson also wanted to counterattack the southern end of the Union line after their initial repulse from Prospect Hill and Hamilton's Crossing. But he held off because of the threat of federal artillery on Stafford Heights and the start of nightfall.