Uniforms What about this Uniform?

lelliott19

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Can any of our uniform experts weigh in on the uniform this officer is wearing please? It's a tintype.
Anything in this image to identify his State of origin?
1610846546680.png
 
Its not turned down, thats how they were made.
 
Is the collar maybe just turned down?

There were two versions, the standard version like so:

Shiloh Civil War Relics Catalog (shilohrelics.com)

And another version that's become known as the "Volunteer" version with a shorter collar that was rarer and I have no idea how it got that name, and it makes no sense to me as volunteers wore both versions, this style a rarity in comparison to the standard:

Identified Mounted Infantry Shell Jacket | Civil War Artifacts - For Sale in Gettysburg (uniondb.com)

Both of them came with red or yellow trim, depending on their branch of service. The picture you got looks to be a cavalryman, but with photography of the time both colors really look the same. I suspect its the "Volunteer" version as I see the glimmer of one button on each side of the collar instead of two on each side by the looks of it, but I could easily be wrong.
 
Can any of our uniform experts weigh in on the uniform this officer is wearing please? It's a tintype.
Anything in this image to identify his State of origin?
View attachment 387940
As others have stated this is a state issued enlisted jacket, that resembled the Federal spec. Main giveaway are the large coat buttons as opposed to the 11 or 12 cuff/vest buttons that adorned the Federal jacket. Cuffs were both functional and non, while the collar was generally lower, but once in the field many Federal jackets were modified by company “tailors”.

The specimen appears to be early war, mainly because of the Type I forage cap with the smaller disk and the fact that these jackets were long gone after Federal issues became prevalent.

I have one running around here somewhere, but the state was not apparent.

Most Federal shell jackets extant today are Bannerman surplus and tailoring is not evident. Jackets that actually saw use have lowered collars, such as the Union Drummer Boy jacket. I have examined that jacket extensively, both before restoration and after. The jacket was in extremely poor shape when consigned for sale, resembling cheese cloth.

Great picture!
 
As others have stated this is a state issued enlisted jacket, that resembled the Federal spec. Main giveaway are the large coat buttons as opposed to the 11 or 12 cuff/vest buttons that adorned the Federal jacket. Cuffs were both functional and non, while the collar was generally lower, but once in the field many Federal jackets were modified by company “tailors”.

The specimen appears to be early war, mainly because of the Type I forage cap with the smaller disk and the fact that these jackets were long gone after Federal issues became prevalent.

I have one running around here somewhere, but the state was not apparent.

Most Federal shell jackets extant today are Bannerman surplus and tailoring is not evident. Jackets that actually saw use have lowered collars, such as the Union Drummer Boy jacket. I have examined that jacket extensively, both before restoration and after. The jacket was in extremely poor shape when consigned for sale, resembling cheese cloth.

Great picture!

I really need to get my head out of studying Confederate uniforms and do some reading on Federal stuff.
 
this is a state issued enlisted jacket, that resembled the Federal spec. Main giveaway are the large coat buttons as opposed to the 11 or 12 cuff/vest buttons that adorned the Federal jacket. Cuffs were both functional and non, while the collar was generally lower, but once in the field many Federal jackets were modified by company “tailors”.
Is this one also early war state enlisted jacket resembling Federal spec? I tried to blow up the belt plate, but I cant tell anything about it. Can you?
1611431571917.png

1611431632036.png

1611431475579.png
 
Is this one also early war state enlisted jacket resembling Federal spec? I tried to blow up the belt plate, but I cant tell anything about it. Can you?
View attachment 388780
View attachment 388782
View attachment 388779
No, that is a regulation 9 button frock coat and what appears to be an 1839 US enlisted buckle. High collar on the frock tells me he will soon have it lowered or seldom wear it again, also that he most likely just enlisted And rushed out to have his image taken for the folks.
 
Here's an ancestor known to have been a union cavalry man. In this photo, which I take to be after he was mustered out, his collar really is turned down. I think his jacket is essentially identical to the one in the original post.
View attachment 388826
No, as you can see his buttons are all the same size (cuff buttons) and allowing for the unbuttoned top and possibly 2-3 buttons hidden by his hands would fall within Federal spec and not necessarily a state jacket.

What is great is having a photo of an ancestor, you are very lucky!
 
I do believe his is a cavalryman; and a Federal one; and I also do not believe he is an officer, but enlisted. The presence of riding sabre, forage cap and trousers together seem to testify to that. His jacket is peculiar; with standard larger button size, it's appearance is very much like a frock coat with the lower half removed. His standing collar has small buttons on it, which tells us the collar is not intended to be worn down. Like a frock coat or shell jacket, the cuffs also have (a) the classic chevron piping, and (b) the smaller buttons like the collar.
Since this jacket is more unusual and unique the longer we look at it, I have a theory. This jacket could be custom made. There is a misconception that, with burgeoning industrial might, the North went to war in perfectly standardized uniforms, while the ill-equipped Southern armies wore a patchwork quilt of homespun, factory made, imported, and "hand-sewn-by-loved-ones" uniforms. But uniform distribution early on in the war was much like Covid vaccines now; there were shortages in some areas, while other locales enjoyed massive stockpiles; different companies produced different quality goods, and such quality could sometimes be seen at a glance; and in reality, not every Northern soldier had a cookie-cutter look. Even General Custer, also a Cavalryman, had a custom-made jacket, which was shortened for riding--much like the one we see here.
Even if this theory was to be pursued, there are questions we do not know. Is this really a custom jacket, commissioned out of personal taste, or did he improvise out of a distribution shortage in his area around the time this photograph was taken?

Anyway, cool photo! (You know, if he showed up to a re-enactment, everyone would tell him "those buttons? they're inaccurate..." :wink: )
 
I do believe his is a cavalryman; and a Federal one; and I also do not believe he is an officer, but enlisted. The presence of riding sabre, forage cap and trousers together seem to testify to that. His jacket is peculiar; with standard larger button size, it's appearance is very much like a frock coat with the lower half removed. His standing collar has small buttons on it, which tells us the collar is not intended to be worn down. Like a frock coat or shell jacket, the cuffs also have (a) the classic chevron piping, and (b) the smaller buttons like the collar.
Since this jacket is more unusual and unique the longer we look at it, I have a theory. This jacket could be custom made. There is a misconception that, with burgeoning industrial might, the North went to war in perfectly standardized uniforms, while the ill-equipped Southern armies wore a patchwork quilt of homespun, factory made, imported, and "hand-sewn-by-loved-ones" uniforms. But uniform distribution early on in the war was much like Covid vaccines now; there were shortages in some areas, while other locales enjoyed massive stockpiles; different companies produced different quality goods, and such quality could sometimes be seen at a glance; and in reality, not every Northern soldier had a cookie-cutter look. Even General Custer, also a Cavalryman, had a custom-made jacket, which was shortened for riding--much like the one we see here.
Even if this theory was to be pursued, there are questions we do not know. Is this really a custom jacket, commissioned out of personal taste, or did he improvise out of a distribution shortage in his area around the time this photograph was taken?

Anyway, cool photo! (You know, if he showed up to a re-enactment, everyone would tell him "those buttons? they're inaccurate..." :wink: )
As previously stated, these were early war state issued jackets, which emulated the Federal spec to some degree, it is impossible to tell which state. Jackets similar to this were also manufactured by the National Arsenal in Philadelphia (Schuylkill), albeit generally without the piping.

I have one of these jackets somewhere, Rush Lancers, I believe also had a similar jacket at one juncture, quite possibly made at Schuylkill

The jacket style, high collar and type of forage cap are indicative of an early war cavalryman.
 
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