Video: Clemens On "Why McClellan Wasn't An Idiot"

I don’t know of this “poor burn” conspiracy theory, but assuming that it’s related to the 9:00 order to Burnside, we know that McClellan sent the order at 9:00 because all the evidence points to 9:00, including the written order itself.

All the evidence, except the majority that says there was an 0800. There does appear to be a later order, carried by Sackett. Burnside told Sackett it was the third or fourth order to attack.

The Poor Burn theory is exactly what your purporting.
 
It was well within McClellan’s purview to have Burnside command his own corps. McClellan chose to leave Burnside as a useless middle man, while an inexperienced Hooker directly commanded 5+ divisions, during the most important battle of the war.


First of all, that story came out 30 years after the battle, when McClellan and Burnside were both dead. Second, and more importantly, common sense should tell you that McClellan isn’t going to relieve Burnside of command in the middle of a huge battle simply because he’s having trouble crossing the bridge. McClellan never even went to that part of the battlefield to figure out what Burnside’s problem was. Is McClellan really going to remove Burnside without knowing what’s taking him so long? McClellan obviously never considered relieving Burnside of command of the 9th Corps.
Burnside chose to make himself the useless middleman. He could have been at the head of the Ninth Corps.

Why not relieve Burnside if he thought he had reason. It didn't happen frequently, but:
Meade relieved Doubleday from command of the First Corps in the middle of the Battle of Gettysburg.​
Sheridan relieved Warren at Five Forks.​
Grant relieved Rosecrans from command of the Army of the Cumberland at Chattanooga while hemmed in by Bragg's army.​
Jefferson Davis replaced G. W. Smith with Robert E. Lee as soon as the shooting stopped at Seven Pines.​
 
Burnside chose to make himself the useless middleman. He could have been at the head of the Ninth Corps.

Why not relieve Burnside if he thought he had reason. It didn't happen frequently, but:
Meade relieved Doubleday from command of the First Corps in the middle of the Battle of Gettysburg.​
Sheridan relieved Warren at Five Forks.​
Grant relieved Rosecrans from command of the Army of the Cumberland at Chattanooga while hemmed in by Bragg's army.​
Jefferson Davis replaced G. W. Smith with Robert E. Lee as soon as the shooting stopped at Seven Pines.​

Did McClellan have that authority? Meade and Sheridan had that authority specified by their superiors (Lincoln and Grant, respectively) and I'm not familiar enough with Grant at Chattanooga to say one way or the other.

Ryan
 
Burnside chose to make himself the useless middleman. He could have been at the head of the Ninth Corps.
We can argue whose fault it was until the cows come home, but the fact is that there were two men commanding the 9th Corps, and McClellan knew about it but did nothing. If you want to make the excuse for McClellan that “that’s just how things were done back then”, then I suppose you can do that. In my opinion, that’s not a legitimate excuse here.

Why not relieve Burnside if he thought he had reason. It didn't happen frequently, but:
Meade relieved Doubleday from command of the First Corps in the middle of the Battle of Gettysburg.Sheridan relieved Warren at Five Forks.Grant relieved Rosecrans from command of the Army of the Cumberland at Chattanooga while hemmed in by Bragg's army.Jefferson Davis replaced G. W. Smith with Robert E. Lee as soon as the shooting stopped at Seven Pines.
Why would he think he had reason? He never even rode the one mile to the Burnside Bridge to find out what the hold up was. Evidently, pointing the way to the Upper Bridge and watching the Sunken Road through a telescope were more important to McClellan than getting the 9th corps across the creek.

Are any of those situations comparable? Did Meade or Sheridan blindly relieve Doubleday and Warren? Rosecrans almost got his army destroyed at Chickamauga, so I don’t know why you’re mentioning it here. GW Smith was relieved after the shooting stopped, so again I don’t know why you bring this up. These are realistic scenarios. The Burnside scenario isn’t realistic at all.
 
Did Meade or Sheridan blindly relieve Doubleday and Warren?

Strictly speaking, Meade pretty much did. He relied on reports from General Howard (which blamed Doubleday for the collapse of the Union line on July 1) and his own animosity towards Doubleday and chose to relieve Doubleday of command of the First Corps, giving the corps to a junior officer (John Newton of the Sixth Corps). This led to Doubleday resigning his command just after the battle.

Ironically, July 1 was probably Abner Doubleday's finest performance of the war.

Ryan
 
Please
We can argue whose fault it was until the cows come home, but the fact is that there were two men commanding the 9th Corps, and McClellan knew about it but did nothing. If you want to make the excuse for McClellan that “that’s just how things were done back then”, then I suppose you can do that. In my opinion, that’s not a legitimate excuse here.
I've not read anything that indicates McClellan knew how Burnside was administering his command. Please give me some sources.

Are any of those situations comparable? Did Meade or Sheridan blindly relieve Doubleday and Warren? Rosecrans almost got his army destroyed at Chickamauga, so I don’t know why you’re mentioning it here. GW Smith was relieved after the shooting stopped, so again I don’t know why you bring this up. These are realistic scenarios. The Burnside scenario isn’t realistic at all.
Why would he have had reason? No movement after repeated orders comes to mind. McClellan had an entire army to watch, not just the Ninth Corps.

See @rpkennedy post above. Sheridan removing Warren was political as well. Warren had just broken Pickett's lines and was driving the defeated Confederates when relieved. At Seven Pines the armies were still within rifle shot of each other. Did Davis know fighting would not breakout within minutes.
 
Strictly speaking, Meade pretty much did. He relied on reports from General Howard (which blamed Doubleday for the collapse of the Union line on July 1) and his own animosity towards Doubleday and chose to relieve Doubleday of command of the First Corps, giving the corps to a junior officer (John Newton of the Sixth Corps). This led to Doubleday resigning his command just after the battle.
If he was receiving information from Howard about Doubleday’s failures, then I wouldn’t consider that “blind”. As far as I’m aware, McClellan wasn’t getting information about what was going on at the bridge from anyone who was actually observing the goings-on at the bridge.
 
I've not read anything that indicates McClellan knew how Burnside was administering his command. Please give me some sources.
So you’re saying that McClellan didn’t know that Burnside was on the eastern side of the creek while someone else was commanding his corps in the Final Attack against Sharpsburg? I didn’t consider that level of ignorance and alienation to be possible. And yet afterward no complaints, public or private, from McClellan about the setup.

Why would he have had reason? No movement after repeated orders comes to mind. McClellan had an entire army to watch, not just the Ninth Corps.
“No movement”? Burnside made three attempts to take the bridge.

See @rpkennedy post above. Sheridan removing Warren was political as well. Warren had just broken Pickett's lines and was driving the defeated Confederates when relieved. At Seven Pines the armies were still within rifle shot of each other. Did Davis know fighting would not breakout within minutes.
Well, if McClellan really did almost relieve Burnside without finding out the problem, then he’s an even bigger idiot than I thought.
 
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If he was receiving information from Howard about Doubleday’s failures, then I wouldn’t consider that “blind”. As far as I’m aware, McClellan wasn’t getting information about what was going on at the bridge from anyone who was actually observing the goings-on at the bridge.

We'll have to agree to disagree then. Howard did not see what happened with the First Corps either but reported that the corps broke against orders, leading to the collapse of the Eleventh Corps. Meade hated Doubleday and used this information to take the corps command away from him, using the authority given him by Lincoln.

Ryan
 
We'll have to agree to disagree then. Howard did not see what happened with the First Corps either but reported that the corps broke against orders, leading to the collapse of the Eleventh Corps. Meade hated Doubleday and used this information to take the corps command away from him, using the authority given him by Lincoln.

Ryan
Well, like I said to Ernie, if he really did almost relieve Burnside, then he’s an even bigger idiot than I thought. I gave him too much credit.
 
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