- Joined
- Aug 17, 2011
- Location
- Birmingham, Alabama
A rhetorical answer is that the North did not have slaves.It was a rhetorical question....
A rhetorical answer is that the North did not have slaves.It was a rhetorical question....
I understand what you were doing. I was just poking a little.
Never in my life, have I ever considered Delaware, or Maryland as "Southern", & I have some kin from Maryland. When I think of Delaware, I don't have images of Southern Belle's fixin cornbread, & grits.
I understand some folks consider them both as "Southern". I've always considered them more similar to New Jersey, or Pennsylvania.
There were some slave owners even in the South who thought quite rightly that the secessionists were stupid because they would end slavery rather then just go with the status quo. We can't prove a hypothetical we only know that by 1888 no European or Latin American nation had slavery.Abolition is the best thing that came of the civil war. Just maybe it would have occurred gradually in the border states and upper south as it slowly did in the north. Certainly sooner is better as it turned out. We will never know but the original secesh 7 may have lasted a long time.
I understand what you were doing. I was just poking a little.
Never in my life, have I ever considered Delaware, or Maryland as "Southern", & I have some kin from Maryland. When I think of Delaware, I don't have images of Southern Belle's fixin cornbread, & grits.
I understand some folks consider them both as "Southern". I've always considered them more similar to New Jersey, or Pennsylvania.
When I came to the DC/MD/VA area in the mid-70s, I was told in no uncertain terms that MD was the South, and that did seem to be the case for the MD suburbs of DC.
The state has changed a lot with the growth of the DC metro area (often called "the DMV" by locals) and also by the influx of former Washingtonians into the DC suburbs in MD/VA. But the Eastern Shore, southern MD, and western MD do have a southern nature to them, for sure.
- Alan
I hear ya. I lived in NOVA when you came to the area. I'm pretty familiar with most of that area. I have some family that live in Fairfax County, & some close to family that live in MD. Heck, I grew up an O's fanWhen I came to the DC/MD/VA area in the mid-70s, I was told in no uncertain terms that MD was the South, and that did seem to be the case for the MD suburbs of DC.
The state has changed a lot with the growth of the DC metro area (often called "the DMV" by locals) and also by the influx of former Washingtonians into the DC suburbs in MD/VA. But the Eastern Shore, southern MD, and western MD do have a southern nature to them, for sure.
- Alan
Pretty cool find Copperhead.HEAD-QUARTERS ARMY N. VA.,
Near Frederick Town, 8th September, 1862.
To the People of Maryland:
It is right that you should know the purpose that has brought the Army under my command within the limits of your State, so far as that purpose concerns yourselves.
The People of the Confederate States have long watched with the deepest sympathy the wrongs and outrages that have been inflicted upon the citizens of a Commonwealth, allied to the States of the South by the strongest social, political and commercial ties.
They have seen with profound indignation their sister State deprived of every right, and reduced to the condition of a conquered Province.
Letter in its entirety here.
https://www.encyclopediavirginia.org/_Proclamation_to_the_People_of_Maryland_by_Robert_E_Lee_1862
A rhetorical answer is that the North did not have slaves.
When I think of Delaware, I don't have images of Southern Belle's fixin cornbread, & grits.
Yet, rhetoricaly, the North drank, deeply, from slavery.
This is a great thread, @Old_Glory. The problem is there is red meat all over the place and not enough focus.
Rhetorically based on
Ordinances of Secession.
Declarations of Secession
The secessionists believed that the North and Northern were the nonslaveholding parts of the US. From the revolution on and especially after the Constitution convention slavery receded from the North.
The problem is lots of complexities and complications without evidence.
Everyone's got an agenda, Douglas had one and you have yours.
Yep. I want the facts, not a fairy tale to make people in this century comfortable with a past that was far from comfortable.
Any notion the Pure White North was fighting to free the slaves is complete BS.
OK, so you're claiming there was no complicity at the North. Remember, this thread is about sections lying to one another and themselves.
Do you want to start another thread about Northern complicity with respect to slavery? Will this somehow mess up the Narrative you would like to tell?
The North was into the whole thing, up to its hip boots. If this is painful to you, too bad and if we need a new thread I'm happy to go there with you. Cheers.
Slavery was not ended in the north until the last slave was free, and it sure wasn't decades. Given, it wasn't many after 1850. Kind of like the hunt for black Confederates, not that many, hard to find, yet there are some....and yet those states ended slavery decades before the 1850s, and of their own volition. Decades. Two additional generations of thousands of people that had to endure slavery. That's plainly more significant than just being able to point out "they did it too, see!"
Yet, at the end of that war, the slaves were freed.
At the beginning of that war, slavery was mainly in the South and not in the North.
That's not BS.
That's history.
You mean DC, as in Maryland, that US stronghold of nationalism, bristling with troops and fortifications? Surely no slavery within near 50 miles of that placeWhen did Delaware, Maryland, D.C., West Virginia, Kentucky, & Missouri join the CSA...?
Asking for a friend....
Interesting idea, when and only when we have a precise definition of a "Black Confederate". However, we have records of slave counts by county from the census records. I am in the procession of such records, and I may start a thread on them.Slavery was not ended in the north until the last slave was free, and it sure wasn't decades. Given, it wasn't many after 1850. Kind of like the hunt for black Confederates, not that many, hard to find, yet there are some.
True, Union Blue. My point is that those at the North (for the most part) really didn't care about slaves.
To say otherwise is to misrepresent history.