Solid silver star

[Jonl51]

Greetings CW buffs,
Can anyone identify this silver star? The Bullock Texas State Museum believes it is a hat star, most likely Texas but possibly Mississippi. I wonder due to the 3 prongs on the back versus a pin type fastener. Also please look closely at the backside as there is a stippling type pattern which might be related to what it was made from. The photos make it look brass colored but it is silver. As you can see it looks like there was a horizontal silver bar forward of the star but sadly missing. Any idea if that has significance? The 5 pointed star is imperfect in its symmetry so probably hand made.
Thank you! Jonl51

 

[Pollaco]

How thick is it? Like filed from a coin like a Peso maybe?

 

[Jonl51]

How thick is it? Like filed from a coin like a Peso maybe?

Thicker than a modern quarter. I wondered about the peso idea too especially the way the back looks.
Thanks!

 

[JOHN42768]

Looks to be a 1873 Winchester firearm. Unrelated to Civil War. Maybe Western cowboy. Just a guess

 

[Pollaco]

Today's Pesos are about 60% silver, I don't know what they were back then. But that probably would have been the more common coins in Texas. The Medals given to Lt. Dowling men at Sabine Pass were made from Mexican coins as were Texas Ranger's badges.

 

[Borderruffian]

I know Terry's Texas Rangers AKA 8th Texas Cavalry wore sliver star hat badges.

 

[Story]

Looks to be a 1873 Winchester firearm. Unrelated to Civil War. Maybe Western cowboy. Just a guess

As shown on CWT countless times before, the spirit lived on long after the war was over.

A letter on that rifle might show where and possibly who it was shipped to.

Winchester

Cody Firearms Records Office provides manufacturing dates and configuration data on specified Winchester firearms using orginal factory records.

centerofthewest.org

 

[Pollaco]

 

[Pollaco]

The article called them tin stars

 

[Jonl51]

Looks to be a 1873 Winchester firearm. Unrelated to Civil War. Maybe Western cowboy. Just a guess

Yes of course the rifle is a Winchester M1873, this gun was made between 1879 and 1882. The question was not about the rifle but the star and missing bar. Thanks

 

[Jonl51]

As shown on CWT countless times before, the spirit lived on long after the war was over.

A letter on that rifle might show where and possibly who it was shipped to.

Winchester

Cody Firearms Records Office provides manufacturing dates and configuration data on specified Winchester firearms using orginal factory records.

centerofthewest.org

Yes a Winchester letter would be great unfortunately someone "cleaned" the area where the serial number should be. I may try to temporarily recover it with a mild acid solution. Because this is a Model 2 version ( screw anchoring the dust cover rail) we know the production run for Model 2s was from serial number 31,000 to 90,000,
which corresponds to the 1879-1882 time frame. Thanks!

 

[R. Porter]

Just to muddy the waters a little, back in 2019 I bid on an antique firearm at auction. It was made by Andrew Joy of Pittsburg. The auction page is still accessible:

Andrew Joy Pittsburg Halfstock Percussion Rifle

Andrew Joy of Pittsburg Pennsylvania made. (1838-1858.) About 50 cal with a 41" octagonal barrel. Relief silver star on

www.liveauctioneers.com

The description says:

Andrew Joy of Pittsburg Pennsylvania made. (1838-1858.) About 50 cal with a 41" octagonal barrel. Relief silver star on cheek rest with brass fittings. Etched marked "A.S. Joy" at top of barrel.

If you look at the image of the reverse side of the gun, on the stock you will find a silver star:

Somewhere on the Internet I found a little bit of info on Joy that said he made firearms for those going to Texas or to some other location which I can't remember off hand. The two motifs that appeared above the cheek rest were a star or an eagle. I presume the star was for those going to Texas. Sorry, I don't have access to this gun at this time so I can't give you better photos or measure the size of the star. So, from this we can postulate that stars were popular decorations on firearms for those going to or living in Texas or maybe, someone who had a star on a gun might remove it if the gun was damaged or sold and place it on the stock of the replacement gun (an excuse to have a Civil War period star on an 1870's or later lever action rifle.) In the case of the Joy firearm the gun was made in Pittsburg so the star was probably not from a peso and was unlikely to have been thicker than thin sheet silver like other silver designs that showed up on full stock and half stock Pennsylvania/Kentucky and plains rifles.

 

[Jonl51]

Just to muddy the waters a little, back in 2019 I bid on an antique firearm at auction. It was made by Andrew Joy of Pittsburg. The auction page is still accessible:

Andrew Joy Pittsburg Halfstock Percussion Rifle

Andrew Joy of Pittsburg Pennsylvania made. (1838-1858.) About 50 cal with a 41" octagonal barrel. Relief silver star on

www.liveauctioneers.com

The description says:

Andrew Joy of Pittsburg Pennsylvania made. (1838-1858.) About 50 cal with a 41" octagonal barrel. Relief silver star on cheek rest with brass fittings. Etched marked "A.S. Joy" at top of barrel.

If you look at the image of the reverse side of the gun, on the stock you will find a silver star:

View attachment 516518

Somewhere on the Internet I found a little bit of info on Joy that said he made firearms for those going to Texas or to some other location which I can't remember off hand. The two motifs that appeared above the cheek rest were a star or an eagle. I presume the star was for those going to Texas. Sorry, I don't have access to this gun at this time so I can't give you better photos or measure the size of the star. So, from this we can postulate that stars were popular decorations on firearms for those going to or living in Texas or maybe, someone who had a star on a gun might remove it if the gun was damaged or sold and place it on the stock of the replacement gun (an excuse to have a Civil War period star on an 1870's or later lever action rifle.) In the case of the Joy firearm the gun was made in Pittsburg so the star was probably not from a peso and was unlikely to have been thicker than thin sheet silver like other silver designs that showed up on full stock and half stock Pennsylvania/Kentucky and plains rifles.

Wow that star is very similar looking in size. I do think my Winchester is a Texas gun and I have two ideas about the significance of the missing horizontal ( Assumed silver) bar. Idea #1, the bar and star together represent the Texas flag. Idea #2, perhaps the bar and star are a "brand" symbol, such as the Bar- Star Ranch. I lean toward Idea #1, Texas flag, especially when you consider the location of the bar ( white bar on the flag) relative to the star. Just a wild guess. See picture.
In the morning I will remove the star from the stock and get a better idea of it's thickness. Thanks for you very interesting and enlightening post.

 

[Jonl51]

Wow that star is very similar looking in size. I do think my Winchester is a Texas gun and I have two ideas about the significance of the missing horizontal ( Assumed silver) bar. Idea #1, the bar and star together represent the Texas flag. Idea #2, perhaps the bar and star are a "brand" symbol, such as the Bar- Star Ranch. I lean toward Idea #1, Texas flag, especially when you consider the location of the bar ( white bar on the flag) relative to the star. Just a wild guess. See picture.
In the morning I will remove the star from the stock and get a better idea of it's thickness. Thanks for you very interesting and enlightening post.

View attachment 516519

View attachment 516520

 

[Jonl51]

View attachment 516521

Ok here are a couple of pictures to help show the star's thickness. Just slightly thicker than a modern quarter. Thanks! Jonl51

 

[Jonl51]

Just to muddy the waters a little, back in 2019 I bid on an antique firearm at auction. It was made by Andrew Joy of Pittsburg. The auction page is still accessible:

Andrew Joy Pittsburg Halfstock Percussion Rifle

Andrew Joy of Pittsburg Pennsylvania made. (1838-1858.) About 50 cal with a 41" octagonal barrel. Relief silver star on

www.liveauctioneers.com

The description says:

Andrew Joy of Pittsburg Pennsylvania made. (1838-1858.) About 50 cal with a 41" octagonal barrel. Relief silver star on cheek rest with brass fittings. Etched marked "A.S. Joy" at top of barrel.

If you look at the image of the reverse side of the gun, on the stock you will find a silver star:

View attachment 516518

Somewhere on the Internet I found a little bit of info on Joy that said he made firearms for those going to Texas or to some other location which I can't remember off hand. The two motifs that appeared above the cheek rest were a star or an eagle. I presume the star was for those going to Texas. Sorry, I don't have access to this gun at this time so I can't give you better photos or measure the size of the star. So, from this we can postulate that stars were popular decorations on firearms for those going to or living in Texas or maybe, someone who had a star on a gun might remove it if the gun was damaged or sold and place it on the stock of the replacement gun (an excuse to have a Civil War period star on an 1870's or later lever action rifle.) In the case of the Joy firearm the gun was made in Pittsburg so the star was probably not from a peso and was unlikely to have been thicker than thin sheet silver like other silver designs that showed up on full stock and half stock Pennsylvania/Kentucky and plains rifles.

This Mexican Silver 8 Reales coin may be what the star was made from. See pictures. Also see an actual Bar-Star brand. Still hoping to hear from other CW experts here on this silver star and if it's a modified hat pin or something else. Regards.

 

[Pollaco]

 

[Pollaco]

Another view. Experimenting with the "copy and paste" feature.I'm guessing very few US coins found their way to Texas.

 

[Package4]

This Mexican Silver 8 Reales coin may be what the star was made from. See pictures. Also see an actual Bar-Star brand. Still hoping to hear from other CW experts here on this silver star and if it's a modified hat pin or something else. Regards.

View attachment 516613

View attachment 516614

View attachment 516615

Certainly not a hat pin, too heavy for the period and the prongs too thick. Stars were also not emblematic of a particular state per se but were very popular with pre and war date militia.

I would suspect your star has nothing to do with the war, but a more contemporary connection to the period of the weapon. Just my HO

 

[Story]

@Jonl51

Let's look at a circa 1892 Mexican 8 Reales, nominal .7859 oz of pure Silver.

https://www.apmex.com/product/73751/mexico-silver-8-reales-cap-rays-chopmark-asw-7859-oz

There's a bunch of tests for determining if it's *real* silver (my no-brainer is the ice cube trick)

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=test+for+real+silver

You might be on to something with the (five pointed) Star - Bar ranch notion, as there are quite a few that come up with a quick search. Yours might have been property of a ranch long since dissolved.

I'd suggest checking with western historians - I knew there was at least one website that tracked Texas ranches.

Also, FWIW, this looks like a lost sand wax casting