Slave-Holders Knew Secession Was Doomed To Failure

[Piedone]

Perhaps more to the point is the history of the 1st South Carolina (Colored) infantry regiment. It was the first officially recognized black unit of the Union Army. It predated the Emancipation Proclamation. It was made up of self-liberated individuals from the S. Carolina & Florida coast that were formed up on Hilton Head Island in 1862. Every once & awhile I have run into someone who blithely claims that there were no Union regiments from SC. Like your quote from Mr. Bell, the conscious or unwitting attempt to erase the contribution of self-liberating people in the fight for their own freedom is ongoing.

This may be - and it's obviously an outrage as nobody can deny that the Union raised a lot of coloured troops and that this troops fought well.
But we talked about a decisive breakdown of rice production because of the activities of Union troops (coloured or not) in Carolina - and it's that particular point which is just hard to assess - and even more to find proof for it.

 

[Rhea Cole]

This may be - and it's obviously an outrage as nobody can deny that the Union raised a lot of coloured troops and that this troops fought well.
But we talked about a decisive breakdown of rice production because of the activities of Union troops (coloured or not) in Carolina - and it's that particular point which is just hard to assess - and even more to find proof for it.

Where do you think the men in the USCT units came from? The entire population of some plantations packed up & went to Union controlled islands. Work on the rice farms was brutally hard. When the white overseers fled, the work came to an end.

 

[Piedone]

Where do you think the men in the USCT units came from? The entire population of some plantations packed up & went to Union controlled islands. Work on the rice farms was brutally hard. When the white overseers fled, the work came to an end.

Well...but Ball tells a quite different story in his book.

 

[Rhea Cole]

Well...but Ball tells a quite different story in his book.

I think you will find that the slave-holder’s version of events & that of the people they owned is a very different story. A reference to the “Weeping Time” sale of Butler slaves in 1858 is worth doing.

 

[Piedone]

Are you familiar with Ball´s book?

 

[Andersonh1]

Some people from the North tried operating some of those coastal plantations for a short time early in the war, I believe. They could not turn a profit, and the former slaves disliked conditions just as much as they had under the plantation owners.

 

[Lubliner]

Some people from the North tried operating some of those coastal plantations for a short time early in the war, I believe. They could not turn a profit, and the former slaves disliked conditions just as much as they had under the plantation owners.

Well then, how did Charleston have such a backlog accumulation of rice when it was evacuated on Feb. 17, 1865? I cannot doubt the report in the official records, and the inventory was submitted a full month after. There was time for it be accounted for. This supply surely wasn't held back for 4 years sitting in a warehouse at the harbor.
Lubliner.

 

[Rhea Cole]

Well then, how did Charleston have such a backlog accumulation of rice when it was evacuated on Feb. 17, 1865? I cannot doubt the report in the official records, and the inventory was submitted a full month after. There was time for it be accounted for. This supply surely wasn't held back for 4 years sitting in a warehouse at the harbor.
Lubliner.

Lee’s army was starving, Bragg’s army starved,.,

 

[Andersonh1]

Well then, how did Charleston have such a backlog accumulation of rice when it was evacuated on Feb. 17, 1865? I cannot doubt the report in the official records, and the inventory was submitted a full month after. There was time for it be accounted for. This supply surely wasn't held back for 4 years sitting in a warehouse at the harbor.
Lubliner.

There were inland rice plantations. I worked at a summer camp once at Bonnie Doone Plantation in Walterboro, SC, right on the Ashepoo river. It's no longer a working plantation, but all the marshland surrounding it used to be the fields for a rice plantation. I'd have to do the research, but I'm betting it wasn't the only one in operation, and I would be surprised if all rice production stopped entirely during the war.

 

[Lubliner]

There were inland rice plantations. I worked at a summer camp once at Bonnie Doone Plantation in Walterboro, SC, right on the Ashepoo river. It's no longer a working plantation, but all the marshland surrounding it used to be the fields for a rice plantation. I'd have to do the research, but I'm betting it wasn't the only one in operation, and I would be surprised if all rice production stopped entirely during the war.

I have read some plantations in Louisiana were harvesting rice. Not sure how long they were controlled by the confederacy, but someone could possibly find either quartermaster accounts or soldier accounts of rice distribution during the war. I do not believe Charleston Harbor would sit on 150,000 barrels of rough rice, and 150,000 pounds of clean rice. It was either waiting to be smuggled out, or shipped to the armies when Charleston evacuated. Or maybe it was smuggled in?
Lubliner.

 

[19thGeorgia]

No doubt slaves wanted to be free, but let's not create new myths...

Col. Thomas Wentworth Higginson: "The Southern colored regiments with which the Massachusetts troops were brigaded were hardly a fair specimen of their kind, having been raised chiefly by drafting, and, for this and other causes, being afflicted with perpetual discontent and desertion." -Army Life in a Black Regiment, p.303

Higginson commanded the 1st South Carolina "Volunteers."

 

[Dead Parrott]

No doubt slaves wanted to be free, but let's not create new myths...

Col. Thomas Wentworth Higginson: "The Southern colored regiments with which the Massachusetts troops were brigaded were hardly a fair specimen of their kind, having been raised chiefly by drafting, and, for this and other causes, being afflicted with perpetual discontent and desertion." -Army Life in a Black Regiment, p.303

Higginson commanded the 1st South Carolina "Volunteers."

All human beings react in multiple ways when first encountering military regimen and discipline. I can only imagine how newly freed slaves would react to it!