Serial number help for Spencer

wyatt8591

Cadet
Joined
Jul 3, 2018
Hello everyone
New to this forum and my first post.
I have two Spencer's, a rifle and a carbine. Looking for any information about when they were manufactured and/or may have been issued. I see in old threads that serial number information is limited but also see that there may be some resources that I don't have that may shed some light on these. I have a copy of Marcot's book so do know something about their origin but no specifics.

The rifle is an 1860 Army, serial number 5040
The carbine is an 1860 Carbine, serial number 24281.

Any information would be greatly appreciated.
 
Welcome From The Heart Of Dixie. @plymouthairrifle is correct as they are not listed but we would love to see some photos of both. :rofl:
 
Welcome! I 'feel your pain'! I have had similar difficulty in tracing/verifying the history of my Spencer Carbine.
Looking forward to your perspectives in our discussions!
 
welcome-header-1-1-jpg.139872.jpg
 
Regarding the Spencer M1860 Army Rifle. As stated above, your rifle was not list in SRS, but:
SN 5036 was issued on 29 April 1863 to Company A, 72nd Indiana Infantry (Wilder's Brigade).
SN 5040 - wyatt8591's rifle.
SN 5042 was issued on 29 April 1863 to Company E, 72nd Indiana Infantry (Wilder's Brigade).

Your rifle is in "prime Wilder Brigade" serial number range. Look at the picture below of one of Wilder's mounted infantry. Look at where the ridge on the saddle rubs on the right side of the rifle stock between the receiver and the bottom barrel band. If your gun was a Wilder rifle, you should see corresponding wear on the stock. These guns were hard used and saw a lot of combat.

droppedImage.jpg
 
View attachment 195558
Remember that the arms were not issued in order so even though your rifle is VERY close it may or may not been with the 72nd IN.

Yes that is true, but I think that collectors should treat the Wilder rifles the same way that "Custer Era" US M1873 Carbines are categorized. The values of these "Custer carbines" vary considerable based on whether they are: 1) Identified (exact SN match) to records, 2) Forensically matched to cartridge casing picked up on the battlefield, 3) "Prime SN Range" and 4) Within min/max SN range of identified rifles.
 
Thanks so much for the info. I did have some information relative to Wilder's Brigade that I got when I bought the rifle and saw that it fell within the range of serial numbers but was not listed. The stock does not show any abnormal wear however but it was exciting to look for that. Nice bit of intel though! Maybe someone just bought it to shoot deer!!! I wouldn't think there were a lot of private sales going on during the war but I'm sure someone here has researched that thought.
I'll try and get some pictures downloaded in my spare time! Ha!!!
 
It is clear that Wilder initiated the private purchase of 1400 Spencer rifles. But there are different opinions on who ended up paying for them and how they were delivered. Many folks say that because the Wilder guns were privately purchased they do not have government inspection marks. The alternative view is that in the end the Spencers were paid for and delivered through government ordnance channels is expressed here: http://www.civilwarprofiles.com/john-t-wilder-and-the-spencer-repeating-rifle/

If you work at it like an intelligence analyst, you can find information on the Spencer rifle orders, order dates, payment dates, delivery dates and quantities. If you cross-correlate these data you can not only account for all of the initial 7502 Spencer rifles but you can also estimate the serial number blocks of their delivery lots. The fact that you can track all the early rifles orders and deliveries indicates to me that they were paid for by Army Ordnance and delivered through government channels.

The serial number blocks are estimates because no information that I have seen identifies how Spencer delivered these rifles with respect to serial numbers. There were probably not lined up in the delivery crates in serial number order. That said, these delivery lots are like working hypotheses that you can test against the positively identified Spencer rifles. You can also find information for each regiment of Wilder's Brigade on when they were mounted and issued Spencer rifles. It is interesting how well all this information lines up with the identified serial numbers.

Learning more about the rifles is half the fun.
 
I have my gggrandfather’s Spencer serial number 4737, Spencer Repeating Rifle Co., Boston MA. I have found it listed on his Army muster out documents dated Oct. 31, 1865. I would like to find more history on it He served as a private with in 1 Cav. Texas, Co. D, 1 Reg’t Texas Cavalry.
Does anyone have any suggestions as to where I should search? Are there any records for the Spencer’s by serial number ?

Thank you
 
A number of different units are known to have been issued M1860 Army rifles (e.g, Ohio Sharpshooters, Custer's Michigan Cavalry, Wilder's Brigade), but I have never seen the 1st Texas Cavalry among them. Since you have documentation of the SN, there must be an interesting story in there.
 
Back
Top