Muzzleldrs P53 Enfield questions

Jeff in Ohio

Sergeant
Joined
Oct 17, 2015
I guess whatever marks were there were sanded to the point where they can't be deciphered.
I agree there may be a crown or two there, but no other marks I can mark out.
 

Jeff in Ohio

Sergeant
Joined
Oct 17, 2015
I think the logical explanation is wear and tear and some cleaning aka polishing over the years, but not intentional defacement. The Japanese rifles surrendered in WWII had the large, distinct chrysanthemum symbols on the top of the receiver ground off by request of the Japanese authorities. These were prominent symbols of Imperial ownership, and so they were removed or defaced.
But no one would think a small stamp behind the trigger guard on an enfield musket was a sign of anything except modern collectors!
 

Lee Craig

Cadet
Joined
Jul 29, 2017
Only the metal stamps and the R Heath stamp inside the trigger mortise are sharp.
As a matter of fact the Tipping & Lawden mark on the inside of the lock I first mistook for some strange error or grinding mark until I got a super close shot of it.
 

tac

Cadet
Joined
Apr 15, 2021
Good evening. Over here in UK Peter Dyson has a large amount of Enfield spares, including hammers/cocks. This one is £25 plus shipping and will need fettling to fit, and that includes making the square hole...


1618512756577.png




However, as already noted, the hammer on your rifle is a modern replication, and the real thing might not fit. Also as noted, your rifle is a Tower version, and as you know, the Tower [of London] was not the manufacturer, but the assembler of the rifle, using a collection of parts from literally hundreds of jobbing component makers in both London and Birmingham. Not until you being to see 'Enfield' on the lock plate were the unified mass production methods pioneered by Eli Whitney employed in the newly-established Royal Small Arms Factory at Enfield Lock. I have a number of sources over here in UK that I can try for the genuine thing if you want to pursue that route. Please let me know.
 
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Lee Craig

Cadet
Joined
Jul 29, 2017
I would love to find an original hammer. That would make me completely happy. Should I share my email address?
 

Craig L Barry

Sergeant Major
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Location
Murfreesboro, TN
Yes..."making the square hole" for the arbor shaft is quite a job even for a gunsmith. Also the hammer appears to have the flames but will need to be double line engraved around the perimeter. You could easily have more invested in this cast replacement part than the cost of an original hammer and then it won't look like the rest of the Enfield in terms of age.
 
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bayonet

Corporal
Joined
Nov 7, 2012
That does not look like the Sinclair Hamilton mark (next to the brass) I have on my Enfield which was discussed in this forum about a month or two ago. What it does look like as a Rev War collector is a Ordnance Storekeepers mark or a crown mark (that's what yours looks like) common on Brown Bess's. Placed on the right side of the buttstock (same side as lock) and underneath behind the trigger guard (which it looks where your mark is). Since they were stamped in wood it is almost always hard to make them out.
 

bayonet

Corporal
Joined
Nov 7, 2012
Were stamps intentionally destroyed when guns with them were captured?
Oh yeah, can't speak for CW but in Rev War they did. I have an "Americanized" Brown Bess. When captured the American Colonist would try to file or scrape off the Crown and Tower mark on the lock plate, plus anywhere else a crown might be. On the rear of the trigger guard the guy also punched out the 2 crown and Ordnance markings. They would even try to remove the Crown/Royal markings on the barrel. Plus many stamped, punched, or carved their initials into the butt stock ( a big no no for any British Soldier to do that with Crown property).
 

Jeff in Ohio

Sergeant
Joined
Oct 17, 2015
That does not look like the Sinclair Hamilton mark (next to the brass) I have on my Enfield which was discussed in this forum about a month or two ago. What it does look like as a Rev War collector is a Ordnance Storekeepers mark or a crown mark (that's what yours looks like) common on Brown Bess's. Placed on the right side of the buttstock (same side as lock) and underneath behind the trigger guard (which it looks where your mark is). Since they were stamped in wood it is almost always hard to make them out.

Here's a clear photos of a Sinclair Hamilton mark. There are several types, most all with crowns over S over HC or crown over SH over C, and often with an arrow under the letters.

1618588676457.png


But you will also find plenty of other marks with a crown over some letters such as the crown over BSAT mark, a crown over B, a crown over FP, etc.
 

Lee Craig

Cadet
Joined
Jul 29, 2017
I can’t make out the second grouping further away from the trigger guard at all.
But the closest one is definitely a crown over something. Thanks for the information.
That helps a lot.
 

Lee Craig

Cadet
Joined
Jul 29, 2017
I can’t make out the second grouping further away from the trigger guard at all.
But the closest one is definitely a crown over something. The uppermost might be a crown over some X shape?
 

bayonet

Corporal
Joined
Nov 7, 2012
Interesting. Seems quite odd to purposely deface makers marks.
If you were a Colonist fighting against the oppression of the King and Crown you'd might want to remove any Crown markings that remind you of the King your fighting in the first place.
 
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