Oops, big lump of your posts....

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Kelly

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The U'S' owes it's existence to George Washington, the Continental Army, American endurance and England's lack thereof.

The Declaration was the cherry on top of the Sundae.

Again, the brutal and uncivilized code of "might makes right" The code of the Missouri slave-master who mercilessly beat his slaves.
 

Kelly

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Fine.

Then which nation at the time extend full recognition the the Confederacy based on Southern ports being closed by the Union?

And please, I know for a fact the United States didn't.

Please, it is a fact that by blockading the ports of the CSA that the USA extended de facto international recognition.
 

unionblue

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I don't think the 350,000 union dead would agree that the CSA was feeble. Nor would their widows, mothers, sisters, brothers, fathers and children of the dead.
But they all would know the Confederacy died stillborn and was tossed upon the ash heap of history as one of the worst ideas in American history.
 
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Kelly

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So, you cannot name one nation of the period who recognized Confederate nationhood based upon the closing of Southern ports.

Got it.

So, you fully agree that blockade is an act which extends international recognition. Got it.
 
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Irishtom29

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I don't think the 350,000 union dead would agree that the CSA was feeble. Nor would their widows, mothers, sisters, brothers, fathers and children of the dead.
Their agreement isn’t necessary to establish the fact that the rebellion was feeble. When was the last time this supposed Confederate “nation” rose up in arms against the United States? Poland and Ireland never gave up, being, you know, real nations.
 

Kelly

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Nope. If you can't providde proof, it's just an opinion.

Now, what were those nations again who recognized the Confederacy over the closure of Southern ports?

England declared its neutrality because of the ports. Yet another act of recognition.
 
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Kelly

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Their agreement isn’t necessary to establish the fact that the rebellion was feeble. When was the last time this supposed Confederate “nation” rose up in arms against the United States? Poland and Ireland never gave up, being, you know, real nations.
Yet the 350,000 union boys are still dead.
 

Kelly

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True.

But remembered as a great president and savior of the nation.

Davis? Not so much.

And, oh, find any nation at the time that recognized the Confederacy upon the closure of Southern ports yet?

Lincoln is remembered as a lawless and ruthless tyrant. And a white-supremacist.

PS- Oh, and show me the law requiring diplomatic recognition to achieve political independence.
 

unionblue

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England declared its neutrality because of the ports. Yet another act of recognition.


A declaration of neutrality is not recognition of a sovereign state.

All of the British consuls being ordered out of the Confederacy when England would NOT recognize the Confederacy as Sovereign? As a nation?

Edited; personal remarks
 
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CSA Today

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so you agree a little bit?
I agree that no man's an island, but I'm less than sure that analogy has something to do with a disputed separation unless it is your point that only one side in a disputed separation has the right to frame the issue. I agree that more often than not a side has to fight for that right, but I disagree with anyone claiming that an aggrieved side doesn't have the right to fight for that right if necessary.
 

Kelly

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A declaration of neutrality is not recognition of a sovereign state.

All of the British consuls being ordered out of the Confederacy when England would NOT recognize the Confederacy as Sovereign? As a nation?

There is a difference between diplomatic and de facto recognition. Lincoln tucking his tail over the Trent affair

Edited; personal remarks
 
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thomas aagaard

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On their best and worst day. Fully and completely.
Please, it is a fact that by blockading the ports of the CSA that the USA extended de facto international recognition.

What international law, rule or standard in use in 1861 prove that the US did recognize the CSA?

Things was not as black or white as you try to make them.
International laws covering this area was not that clear and much of it came down to how the European naval powers reacted to the blockade.

Both the union and the European powers got around the whole issue by accepting the CSA as belligerent, but not as an independent and sovereign state.

That is why csa soldiers was treated as POWs and not criminals and why captures csa sailors was treated as POWs and not simply hung as pirates.

So no the US did never recognized the CSA...

Edited; personal remarks.
 
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unionblue

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Lincoln is remembered as a lawless and ruthless tyrant. And a white-supremacist.

PS- Oh, and show me the law requiring diplomatic recognition to achieve political independence.
The U.S., England, France, Germany, Spain, Italy, etc., etc., (as in NO nation on the planet of consequence, of note, of worth) recognized the Confederacy, even when it came to the closure of Southern ports by the Union.

Edited; personal remarks.
 
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