Nathan Bedford Forrest Ban

covers

Private
Official Vendor
Joined
Oct 3, 2020
Location
Taos, NM
Well, as a very general guideline, I would say the CSA autograph and manuscript material is worth about 35% less now than it was ten years ago. Best autograph letters signed with a war date with good content continue to hold value much better than standard items like RE Lee cut signatures, etc.

The CSA soldier diary with Gettysburg content, if I read it correctly, sounds very good.

I am surprised an auction house would have a ban on a specific individual - maybe a house that has publicly traded stock like Sothebys.

I will say that I recently gave a CSA autograpgh and manuscript group ($10,000 or so) to Heritage auctions and was very pleased with the results. I have dealt with Sandra Palomino and Steve Ivy on many valuable consignments for the last 30+ years and have been very happy every time.

My expectation from any auction is to give a consignor an accurate pre-sale estimate and to meet or exceed the low estimate every time. I use auctions to sell material, not to hit retail price levels. And I don’t want unsolds!
 
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Rusk County Avengers

1st Lieutenant
Joined
Apr 8, 2018
Location
Coffeeville, TX
As all of you have said, Confederate items going down in value is laughable and I wish for my selfish sake this was actually the case.
I've picked up quite a few bargains on Confederate items, at different times and in different places. Heck, State issued and CS currency has been going for nothing compared to what it was a couple years ago in places.

If you watch online auctions and reputable dealers websites, prices still going strong. Gun shows, flea markets, antique shops, and so on? Value of CW and CS items has been way down in my area. I've picked up several CS guns for less than $300 apiece, and a close friend of mine has been picking up guns, buckles, and other items at scary low prices compared to what they used to be. It ain't even rare to run into those deals anymore.

Younger generations not caring about Grandpa's old junk is to blame.
 
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
Location
mo
The last 2 C.W. online auctions in Wisconsin brought crazy prices. In both auctions 1 person bought 80 % of the lots. GAR items had strong bids in both. Some auction houses will not sell *German WWII* items (Edited.) I would shop around and observe how the auction houses handle their business . Some do a poor job in the descriptions of the items. Good luck !

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That's as odd as banning Forrest, that aspect of German memorabilia often fetches the highest prices as well. Seems strange to me any auction house ignoring the actual market, as their premiums comes from those items garnering the highest interest /prices
 
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NH Civil War Gal

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This thread got me thinking about CW items in general and the collecting scene. I went back to my June 2020 ”Civil War Times” where John Banks featured the December Franklin show (because I’m an annoying researcher and mark my magazines and books on things I might need to come back to). He also interviews our own @ucvrelics, whom he describes as “gruff.” Could that be?:eek::cool:

But here’s the thing, this show started in 1986 and was much, much smaller and the owner of the show never dreamed it would get this big AND there is a competing show in Mansfield, Ohio and each vies with the other as “The Biggest Civil War Show.”

So… what has changed about collecting? @Package4 and at @Lanyard Puller can you guys weigh in here? Obviously these shows wouldn’t grow larger if collecting is falling off BUT the items collected may have changed since 2008.

This show talks about autographs and clipped autographs from Davis go for about 1K (Davis just doesn’t get any love, does he?). I can’t imagine these two shows blinking an eye over Forrest.

I certainly agree 2008 was a watershed year for almost every sort of collection imaginable (and some of that was a manufactured bubble anyhow) UNLESS you own the 1% of the 1% because those items will always retain their value.

I honestly can’t see anything political about Forrest because I can think of truly meaner, nastier people in the CW but maybe I’m overthinking it.
 

Package4

1st Lieutenant
Joined
Jul 28, 2015
This thread got me thinking about CW items in general and the collecting scene. I went back to my June 2020 ”Civil War Times” where John Banks featured the December Franklin show (because I’m an annoying researcher and mark my magazines and books on things I might need to come back to). He also interviews our own @ucvrelics, whom he describes as “gruff.” Could that be?:eek::cool:

But here’s the thing, this show started in 1986 and was much, much smaller and the owner of the show never dreamed it would get this big AND there is a competing show in Mansfield, Ohio and each vies with the other as “The Biggest Civil War Show.”

So… what has changed about collecting? @Package4 and at @Lanyard Puller can you guys weigh in here? Obviously these shows wouldn’t grow larger if collecting is falling off BUT the items collected may have changed since 2008.

This show talks about autographs and clipped autographs from Davis go for about 1K (Davis just doesn’t get any love, does he?). I can’t imagine these two shows blinking an eye over Forrest.

I certainly agree 2008 was a watershed year for almost every sort of collection imaginable (and some of that was a manufactured bubble anyhow) UNLESS you own the 1% of the 1% because those items will always retain their value.

I honestly can’t see anything political about Forrest because I can think of truly meaner, nastier people in the CW but maybe I’m overthinking it.
So here is the dirty little secret, not really a secret, but reality, these shows are labeled as Civil War shows, but look what is being sold. Militaria from ACW to WWII, thus the increase in size. One of my favorite people in the collecting universe is Cliff Sophia at CSArms, if you venture into Cliff’s shop in Uppityville, VA (Upperville), you will find 1/2 the shop devoted to WWI & II. Same with many other dealers and when they go to shows the inventory goes with them.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2020
So here is the dirty little secret, not really a secret, but reality, these shows are labeled as Civil War shows, but look what is being sold. Militaria from ACW to WWII, thus the increase in size. One of my favorite people in the collecting universe is Cliff Sophia at CSArms, if you venture into Cliff’s shop in Uppityville, VA (Upperville), you will find 1/2 the shop devoted to WWI & II. Same with many other dealers and when they go to shows the inventory goes with them.
While not being well informed about this, the CW is 160 years ago almost. Some items might be gone. It makes me sad to see the uniforms brown in showcases. Not even preservation can keep things from aging.
 

NH Civil War Gal

Captain
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Feb 5, 2017
So here is the dirty little secret, not really a secret, but reality, these shows are labeled as Civil War shows, but look what is being sold. Militaria from ACW to WWII, thus the increase in size. One of my favorite people in the collecting universe is Cliff Sophia at CSArms, if you venture into Cliff’s shop in Uppityville, VA (Upperville), you will find 1/2 the shop devoted to WWI & II. Same with many other dealers and when they go to shows the inventory goes with them.
Glad you chimed in on this. I wondered about this but didn’t want to mention it, not being an expert. WWII reenactment is a big thing up here in New England and WWI. I was positive there was other militaria being shown at the “CW Show” but as it wasn’t mentioned in the magazine, I didn’t want to mention what I didn’t have.

I have NEVER seen a Civil War show advertised in New England. If there is one, please let me know because it would only be a day’s drive for me. I’d be curious what would be there and I’d do a report on it.
 

GwilymT

Sergeant Major
Joined
Aug 20, 2018
Location
Pittsburgh
That a single auction house refuses the OP’s collection does not a political point make- as some have tried to do. The market for CW items is down but the market for CSA items is still healthy and NBF items in particular.
 

bayonet

Corporal
Joined
Nov 7, 2012
Glad you chimed in on this. I wondered about this but didn’t want to mention it, not being an expert. WWII reenactment is a big thing up here in New England and WWI. I was positive there was other militaria being shown at the “CW Show” but as it wasn’t mentioned in the magazine, I didn’t want to mention what I didn’t have.

I have NEVER seen a Civil War show advertised in New England. If there is one, please let me know because it would only be a day’s drive for me. I’d be curious what would be there and I’d do a report on it.
Every June is an Antique Weapons show in Sturbridge, Mass by the New England Antique Arms Society. Plenty of CW items there. Last time I was there I made a verbal deal with a dealer (single table, small amount of items) on his Colt 1849. I had to sell 2 or 3 items I had to dealers (which I did) and if he still had it I'd buy it off him. So I come back to make the deal but he placed the Colt in one of those old boxes/case that they are issued in. It did not even fit the Colt properly, the top lid was gone, and he jacked the price up a few hundred dollars. I wanted to be like Virgil Earp in the TOMBSTONE movie when he took the pistol away from one of the drunken Clanton Brothers (played by a great actor) in the Bar and bashed him over the head with it. But I heard jail food is lousy so not a good idea. At that point I had pity on him for I realized he was old, had not sold anything, probably won't sell anything, and was only here to get out of the house or away from his nagging wife. Other than that it's a pretty good show plus good for Rev War and CW items. Sadly I retired to Florida with plenty of Gun Shows (1/2 junk) but no Antique Arms items. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: 😭 😭 😭 😭
 

bobinwmass

Sergeant
Joined
Jul 14, 2019
Location
Western Massachusetts
Whether or not Confederate items have kept their value may depend upon the category the item falls into. I used to collect Confederate buttons from 1980 until about 1994. Prices had been steadily going up ( about 20% per year) and it got to the point that anything that I needed and found cost more than $1000 per button to be able to add anything to the collection. Sold the collection (did very well since I had got in early when so much stuff could still be found in junk bins and cigar boxes) and used the money to buy the land I then built my house on. Began collecting cheaper Massachusetts buttons. But now, except for the most rare, Confederate button prices seem to be 25 to 50% off their high prices of that time. Buttons that I had to pay over $1000 to put into my collection can now readily be found in the $600-700 range.
 

bayonet

Corporal
Joined
Nov 7, 2012
Whether or not Confederate items have kept their value may depend upon the category the item falls into. I used to collect Confederate buttons from 1980 until about 1994. Prices had been steadily going up ( about 20% per year) and it got to the point that anything that I needed and found cost more than $1000 per button to be able to add anything to the collection. Sold the collection (did very well since I had got in early when so much stuff could still be found in junk bins and cigar boxes) and used the money to buy the land I then built my house on. Began collecting cheaper Massachusetts buttons. But now, except for the most rare, Confederate button prices seem to be 25 to 50% off their high prices of that time. Buttons that I had to pay over $1000 to put into my collection can now readily be found in the $600-700 range.
Not a CW collecting story but a collecting story no less. Many years ago as an Airborne Soldier I collected Airborne Badges from Communist Countries all over the World. Hard to get them with most being snuck out of the Country they came from. So one day I just decided to sell the collection to a fellow Soldier that wanted it. No profit, sold to him what I paid to be fair to a fellow Vet. 6 months to a year later the Cold War ends (sort of) and the Berlin Wall comes down. The collecting market is saturated with this stuff now and 80 to 90% cheaper. I dodged a bullet and he just shakes his head in disgust when we discussed it. So to easy his pain I brought the Beers.
 
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