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my new possible springfield from the 18 (60's) maybe

Discussion in 'Civil War Weapons and Ammunition' started by gad195, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. gad195

    gad195 Cadet

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    IMG_1838.JPG
    springfield a.JPG

    Think of using an etank to remove the rust and treating the stock with linseed oil, coating metal with gun oil, firing mechanism works but percussion channel is rusted through. also if there are any reputable dealers to get the barrel bands that are missing. At this point not wishing to sell. But when I starting finding the information about it I got excited realizing I may have found a true piece of history .
     

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    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 14, 2017
    James N., WJC, ucvrelics.com and 5 others like this.

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  3. originalrebelyell

    originalrebelyell Corporal

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    Definitely Civil War made by Providence Tool Co.
     
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  4. mofederal

    mofederal 2nd Lieutenant Member of the Month

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    Your rifle is a piece of history, I hope you can find the barrel bands and other parts you need. Your rifle is looking very good. good luck on any other cleaning efforts.
     
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  5. 1867crete

    1867crete Private

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    Yes looks nice! Great piece
     
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  6. Jobe Holiday

    Jobe Holiday First Sergeant

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    The barrel bands aren't hard to find.....they're just expensive! And you need a rear sight, too, also not cheap.
    J.
     
  7. gad195

    gad195 Cadet

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    It does have the simple v rear sight. No front sight. I was hoping to find a dealer to possibly purchase the bands from. being as ignorant about the weapon as I am I don't wish for someone to scam me and I but something close but not right. I do not think I would upgrade the sights and I would keep them as they now are. I have also noted that some the earlier models from the 1850's do not appear to have the front sight. Makes me wonder if the barrel might be an 1850 model that was upgraded from flintlock to percussion. which according to Wiki Was done back then
     
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  8. ucvrelics.com

    ucvrelics.com 2nd Lieutenant Forum Host

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    The Model 1861 was the primary musket at the start of the Civil War. Musket was designed as a single shot .58 cal. rifled muzzleloader featuring iron buttplate, "C" shaped hammer, bolster with clean out screw, two leaf sight, iron trigger guard, three flat barrel bands held in place with springs, two strap hooks on middle band and trigger guard, tulip head ramrod with bulged shank and threaded end, iron nose cap. Springfield Armory supervised the manufacturing and distribution of the Model 1861 musket. In order to fulfill shortages, production was sub-contracted to a number of private manufacturers, Providence Tool Co, Providence Rhode Island produced 70,000 muskets under the subcontract. Lock is marked "1864" behind the hammer, with eagle over "U" graphic of eagle "S" and "PROVIDENCE TOOL CO / PROVIDENCE R H" in front. Barrel is marked "VP" over eagle head and (date), additional inspector stamping, "W". Buttplate is marked "US". Three bands each marked "U". Two cartouches in wood on left side opposite the lock indicate government inspection.
     
  9. captaindrew

    captaindrew First Sergeant

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    Great piece, I think it looks great they way it is. I'd be careful trying to do to much with it and damage any of the markings. Maybe just some oil to stabilize it and take some of the surface rust off but don't go crazy. Then again I'm not a relics expert, I'm sure some of you guys know just what to do with it. Great find!
     
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  10. FrankN

    FrankN Private

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    Hello gad195,

    Nice find!

    For CW weapons and parts this website has been recommended by other very knowledgeable forum members. http://www.lodgewood.com/

    Also, many of the CW dealers found on this directory have various weapons parts. http://www.civilwardealers.com/
    There are some very good and reputable dealers. http://www.shilohrelics.com/ and others on this directory are very good.

    IMHO I think I would find parts, barrel bands, ramrod, etc., that come as close as possible to the nice brown patina of your musket and keep it as is. Just a very light, careful cleaning I think most collectors would prefer it that way.

    I’m sure you’ll get better advice from the more knowledgeable members.

    Frank
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
  11. originalrebelyell

    originalrebelyell Corporal

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    I agree oil it and clean the active rust off, but don't get carried away go easy and slow.
     
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  12. originalrebelyell

    originalrebelyell Corporal

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    Doesn't it use the same bands as the Springfield.
     
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  13. Jobe Holiday

    Jobe Holiday First Sergeant

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    Yes, the exact same bands as a Model 1861 Springfield....not hard to find....all you need is $$$$. An original middle band with sling swivel will probably cost $100.
    J.
     
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  14. Package4

    Package4 First Sergeant Trivia Game Winner

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    What is the date on the lockplate? Also, the remaining band does not appear to be original to the piece, see if you can remove the band and the barrel, then tell us what you find. I am intrigued by the amount of (wood) burnout near the bolster, this is often seen in southern used weapons due to the amount of sulpheric acid in the nitric to make fulminate. The increase of fulminate due to the scarcity of mercury made the Confederate caps much more corrosive than their Northern counterpart. The burnout of the wood surrounding the bolster of many arms was the result, in addition to severe pitting around the metal of the bolster. What does the bore look like, is there still evidence of rifling? The fixed sights make me think of a captured and reworked gun, or a gun taken home after the war and used for hunting.

    Answers to these questions will help determine which or both.
     
  15. ucvrelics.com

    ucvrelics.com 2nd Lieutenant Forum Host

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    I believe that all the Providence were 1864 dated lock plates
     
  16. WJC

    WJC 1st Lieutenant

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    Nice find! I agree with those who have suggested a minimal restoration: the less the better.
    I notice the hammer is missing a screw- perhaps others as well. Be sure and get a genuine, original replacement screw, as the threads may not match modern standards threads. As for the other missing parts, even though expensive, I recommend using genuine originals. And take your time: this should be a joyful labor of love.
     
  17. Package4

    Package4 First Sergeant Trivia Game Winner

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    Actually there were 1862 dated Providence muskets, but the lockplate was stamped a little differently and there were also 70,000 manufactured with the OP stamping and locks dated 1862-65, at least according to Flayderman.
     
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  18. ewmail15

    ewmail15 Private

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    Pick up a magnifying glass with 30/40x. You'll be happy you did. I've been able to see so much better the areas of rust hidden behind the smallest areas of raised black on my 1859 Sharps carbine. I've used a sewing needle for soft scraping/picking, plus light taps from my small ballpeen (sp?) hammer on the larger sections. Just about every stinking black spot had hidden rust that if left unchecked would have pitted more and more over time. I also did spray 4-5 cans of pb blaster into a vase wide enough and tall enough to let half of the barrel/receiver soak plenty.
     
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  19. ucvrelics.com

    ucvrelics.com 2nd Lieutenant Forum Host

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    You are correct. The one in the photo he posted should have a 64 date on the back end of the lock plate
     
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  20. gad195

    gad195 Cadet

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    just returned from a dealer. He verified it as a contract musket from 1864 by the year on the lock plate. He saidy the current condition for the weapon was not good. classified it as poor. Did say the stock was in good shape. said just get repro parts for things that were missing. I will try and get original parts if I can but was grateful for the verification and information
     
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  21. Craig L Barry

    Craig L Barry Sergeant Major

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    It really depends on what you are planning to do with it. If it is a wallhanger that you want to look better than it does now, using reproduction parts would probably be okay. If you plan to restore it though, then stick with original parts when possible.
     

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