Michigan city seeks expert to discuss future of Custer site

Leigh Cole

Private
Joined
Nov 9, 2016
Location
Monroe, MI
Indeed. Never mind: Most people do not appreciate duty, sacrifice, and the necessity of self-discipline and External discipline (to a certain degree) to achieve anything meaningful.
Well, he was a very polarizing figure and he remains so. You know, he’s the kind you’d be really proud to serve under but if you were in another command, you and all those red ties and all the media attention...you just can sense the jealousy too. I am now reading Paul D. Walker’s book, “The Cavalry Battle that Saved the Union.” The premise is like Carhart’s book. But it’s amazing how so many historians seem to go out of their way to avoid mentioning Custer. It’s as if he was never at East Cavalry Field, the Shenandoah, Sailor’s Creek, etc. It’s annoying but not shocking.
 

Jomini

Private
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
Well, he was a very polarizing figure and he remains so. You know, he’s the kind you’d be really proud to serve under but if you were in another command, you and all those red ties and all the media attention...you just can sense the jealousy too. I am now reading Paul D. Walker’s book, “The Cavalry Battle that Saved the Union.” The premise is like Carhart’s book. But it’s amazing how so many historians seem to go out of their way to avoid mentioning Custer. It’s as if he was never at East Cavalry Field, the Shenandoah, Sailor’s Creek, etc. It’s annoying but not shocking.
A Sign of the times........................
 

Scott1967

First Sergeant
Joined
Jul 11, 2016
Location
England
Well, he was a very polarizing figure and he remains so. You know, he’s the kind you’d be really proud to serve under but if you were in another command, you and all those red ties and all the media attention...you just can sense the jealousy too. I am now reading Paul D. Walker’s book, “The Cavalry Battle that Saved the Union.” The premise is like Carhart’s book. But it’s amazing how so many historians seem to go out of their way to avoid mentioning Custer. It’s as if he was never at East Cavalry Field, the Shenandoah, Sailor’s Creek, etc. It’s annoying but not shocking.
I certainly would have not liked to serve under Custer your confusing the common soldier's pure instinct to survive with a man trying to forge a name for himself with his reckless demeanour.

But things were different in those days normally a CO would know a few names of the men under his command and would be more approachable , I spent 9 years in the British Army with 3 units , 206 Air-mobile , 3ADSR , and 2nd Infantry Division in all that time I maybe saw my CO 3 or 4 times normally on RSM parades briefly and never spoke to them ever.

The Civil War was also a personal war for many and I suppose many men knew Custer who served under him.
 

Leigh Cole

Private
Joined
Nov 9, 2016
Location
Monroe, MI
I certainly would have not liked to serve under Custer your confusing the common soldier's pure instinct to survive with a man trying to forge a name for himself with his reckless demeanour.

But things were different in those days normally a CO would know a few names of the men under his command and would be more approachable , I spent 9 years in the British Army with 3 units , 206 Air-mobile , 3ADSR , and 2nd Infantry Division in all that time I maybe saw my CO 3 or 4 times normally on RSM parades briefly and never spoke to them ever.

The Civil War was also a personal war for many and I suppose many men knew Custer who served under him.
I don’t think I am confusing much, Scott. I’m a retired Marine combat vet and as I posted, in Storm I served under a similar officer. Lt. Col. Mattis.
However, let’s look at his guys. They were all cutting up their red Union suits to make red ties. Esprit de Corps is not something to be taken lightly. It’s a very real thing and Custer’s “red tie boys” were obviously proud of their Commander, their command and themselves. It’s a great thing to tell people you’re serving under a known commander. It also raises the unit combat efficiency. You don’t want to let down the unit. Hence I say let us not underestimate the morale value of serving under an officer like Custer.
 

Jomini

Private
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
I certainly would have not liked to serve under Custer your confusing the common soldier's pure instinct to survive with a man trying to forge a name for himself with his reckless demeanour.

But things were different in those days normally a CO would know a few names of the men under his command and would be more approachable , I spent 9 years in the British Army with 3 units , 206 Air-mobile , 3ADSR , and 2nd Infantry Division in all that time I maybe saw my CO 3 or 4 times normally on RSM parades briefly and never spoke to them ever.

The Civil War was also a personal war for many and I suppose many men knew Custer who served under him.
One Wins Battles and Wars by being reckless.
 

Scott1967

First Sergeant
Joined
Jul 11, 2016
Location
England
I don’t think I am confusing much, Scott. I’m a retired Marine combat vet and as I posted, in Storm I served under a similar officer. Lt. Col. Mattis.
However, let’s look at his guys. They were all cutting up their red Union suits to make red ties. Esprit de Corps is not something to be taken lightly. It’s a very real thing and Custer’s “red tie boys” were obviously proud of their Commander, their command and themselves. It’s a great thing to tell people you’re serving under a known commander. It also raises the unit combat efficiency. You don’t want to let down the unit. Hence I say let us not underestimate the morale value of serving under an officer like Custer.
I don't dispute that at all Leigh your right in the case of Custer it was the nature of the Civil war to lead from the front and Custer wasn't on his own their.

Men are inspired by the leaders they serve under but its a lot different now in general than it was then but its still a soldiers job to do his duty and survive.

The amount of times Custer put his men in danger seems extraordinary high I was referring to myself not liking to server under him.

Although I do agree he was an inspirational leader.
 

Jomini

Private
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
I don't dispute that at all Leigh your right in the case of Custer it was the nature of the Civil war to lead from the front and Custer wasn't on his own their.

Men are inspired by the leaders they serve under but its a lot different now in general than it was then but its still a soldiers job to do his duty and survive.

The amount of times Custer put his men in danger seems extraordinary high I was referring to myself not liking to server under him.

Although I do agree he was an inspirational leader.
Getting men into danger..........It is the nature of war and in most cases, danger is where potential victory is found
 

Kurt G

Sergeant Major
Joined
May 23, 2018
Well, he was a very polarizing figure and he remains so. You know, he’s the kind you’d be really proud to serve under but if you were in another command, you and all those red ties and all the media attention...you just can sense the jealousy too. I am now reading Paul D. Walker’s book, “The Cavalry Battle that Saved the Union.” The premise is like Carhart’s book. But it’s amazing how so many historians seem to go out of their way to avoid mentioning Custer. It’s as if he was never at East Cavalry Field, the Shenandoah, Sailor’s Creek, etc. It’s annoying but not shocking.
Leigh , I would highly recommend that you read Eric Wittenberg's book "Protecting the Flank at Gettysburg; The Battles for Brinkerhoff Ridge and the East Cavalry Field." It is an excellent account of the action . There still is no solid evidence that Stuart was given orders to attack the Union rear . Eric isn't a big fan of Custer , but his research is first rate . That being said I think Custer's leadership at the battle was outstanding . Perhaps a general shouldn't personally lead his men in a charge , but the charge of the heavily out-numbered 1st Michigan with Custer leading the way is one of those things I would have liked to have witnessed . Ken Burns called it a "reckless charge."That still irritates me after all these years . Of course he also claimed the 20th Maine saved the Union and the battle started over shoes .
It became popular to attack Custer's reputation in the 1960s and 70s. If James N. is reading this he knows how I feel about the awful movie "Little Big Man." He feels the same . I am a fan of Custer during the Civil War , but I don't think he was the same man fighting the Indians . As an aside , in Vine DeLoria's book "Custer Died for Your Sins" , he stated that calling some one an Indian was an insult . Recent studies have shown that currently Native Americans prefer the term "Indian." Things change .
 

Kurt G

Sergeant Major
Joined
May 23, 2018
For those who think Custer had no redeeming qualities , lelliot19 has posted some stories about Custer's compassion for defeated Confederates .
 
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