Longstreet Longstreet was right.

I tend toward this view. An army in enemy territory living off of the land will strip the country bare in a day. As already mentioned, Harrisburg had many rail and road networks, by the time the CSA got there, the stores would have been evacuated, gone. (We do know the citizens and city government were already engaged in this activity upon Ewell’s approach) the idea that Lee could concentrate and wait doesn’t conform with reality. An army deep in enemy territory with an extended supply line must keep moving a la Sherman to be able to live off of the land. Lee attacks on the 2nd & 3rd because his army is concentrated and his two options are attack or retreat. Waiting just isn’t in the cards.

Given the circumstances retreat was the better option.
Moscow in 1812 was a much bigger city than Harrisburg in 1863. But when Napoleon's enormous army made it there at the end of summer, the Russian peasantry would no longer deliver forage and grain to the city, and Napoleon had to retreat even though the Russian army had been beaten and was reorganizing.
The Confederates could not stay in Pennsylvania without a big fight, and the US army was surrounded by its loyal railroad network. Evacuating the wounded and resupplying the army was going to be vastly easier for the US. And by the 8th or 9th of July, Grant and some of his divisions could circulate up river to St. Louis and Louisville and ride the railroads east, while Sherman occupied Mississippi.
Harrisburg was a trap, which General Lee avoided.
 
I tend toward this view. An army in enemy territory living off of the land will strip the country bare in a day. As already mentioned, Harrisburg had many rail and road networks, by the time the CSA got there, the stores would have been evacuated, gone. (We do know the citizens and city government were already engaged in this activity upon Ewell’s approach) the idea that Lee could concentrate and wait doesn’t conform with reality. An army deep in enemy territory with an extended supply line must keep moving a la Sherman to be able to live off of the land. Lee attacks on the 2nd & 3rd because his army is concentrated and his two options are attack or retreat. Waiting just isn’t in the cards.

Given the circumstances retreat was the better option.
"a la Sherman" oh so what are you saying Sherman can pull it off but Lee could not? If not Harrisburg than Lee could of moved around living off the bountiful land until Meade attacked (which would of been not long in coming) on ground of Lee's choosing. "retreat was the better option"? Wait what? One of the main reasons to go North was to defeat the Union on Northern soil not to retreat, then the whole exercise would of been a waste of time and accomplished nothing.
 
And how would Lee force Meade to attack him? Meade was very prudent during the campaign.
Here is a message written to General Halleck:

"if not attacked, and I can get any positive information of the enemy which will justify me in doing so, I will attack. If I find it hazardous to do so, and am satisfied that the enemy is endeavoring to move to my rear and interpose between me and Washington, I shall fall back on my supplies at Westminster."

- General George Meade
 
"a la Sherman" oh so what are you saying Sherman can pull it off but Lee could not? If not Harrisburg than Lee could of moved around living off the bountiful land until Meade attacked (which would of been not long in coming) on ground of Lee's choosing. "retreat was the better option"? Wait what? One of the main reasons to go North was to defeat the Union on Northern soil not to retreat, then the whole exercise would of been a waste of time and accomplished nothing.
No, I’m saying Sherman continually moved and thus was able to do it. They didn’t stop until they got to the sea and thus supply, Lee had nowhere to concentrate and stop where he could draw adequate supply. Sherman’s Army was also about half the size of Lee’s which made it easier to move, concentrate, and feed in enemy territory. You had mentioned Lee being able to concentrate, sit, & wait for days to be attacked. I’m saying that wasn’t possible.

Retreat was the better option on July 3rd for sure and arguably July 2nd. I apologize if you misunderstood what I wrote but I made neither point you are attempting to take issue with...😂
 
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No, I’m saying Sherman continually moved and thus was able to do it. They didn’t stop until they got to the sea and thus supply, Lee had nowhere to concentrate and stop where he could draw adequate supply. Sherman’s Army was also about half the size of Lee’s which made it easier to move, concentrate, and feed in enemy territory. You had mentioned Lee being able to concentrate, sit, & wait for days to be attacked. I’m saying that wasn’t possible.

Retreat was the better option on July 3rd for sure and arguably July 2nd. I apologize if you misunderstood what I wrote but I made neither point you are attempting to take issue with...😂
Ok enough of beating a dead horse. Retreat was not an option without a battle taking place. What you think Lee wanted to take a nice hike up into the Pennsylvania hills and bring his Army because the weather was much cooler in July than down South? Oh and your information is wrong there oh young one. Sherman Marched to the Sea with 62,000 Union Troops, that's not half of what Lee had in Pennsylvania! Maybe if Lee did what Sherman did The North might of offered a peace settlement, who knows.
 
Ok enough of beating a dead horse. Retreat was not an option without a battle taking place. What you think Lee wanted to take a nice hike up into the Pennsylvania hills and bring his Army because the weather was much cooler in July than down South? Oh and your information is wrong there oh young one. Sherman Marched to the Sea with 62,000 Union Troops, that's not half of what Lee had in Pennsylvania! Maybe if Lee did what Sherman did The North might of offered a peace settlement, who knows.
Lee couldn’t do what Sherman did. All Lee did was get himself in a pickle then blunder into a fruitless and needless attack, nice hike or not. “Young one”? 😂 I’m sorry you are so upset. The Saint Robert stuff may make some feel better about the outcome of the war but it doesn’t conform with reality.

Back to the topic of the thread, in hindsight Longstreet was right.
 
Ok enough of beating a dead horse. Retreat was not an option without a battle taking place. What you think Lee wanted to take a nice hike up into the Pennsylvania hills and bring his Army because the weather was much cooler in July than down South? Oh and your information is wrong there oh young one. Sherman Marched to the Sea with 62,000 Union Troops, that's not half of what Lee had in Pennsylvania! Maybe if Lee did what Sherman did The North might of offered a peace settlement, who knows.
Lee did not want to bring on an engagement unless it was on ground of his choosing and this is what upset Longstreet.

After day 1 Lee could have extracted his army with relative ease the Union was sitting on the high ground and I doubt Meade would have given up that advantage the only sticking point here is that Lee was still without his cavalry to screen his army.

And the difference between Sherman and Lee was that Lee could not afford to burn supplies or forage Sherman could.
 
Must we engage in silliness. General Sherman was marching towards a coast that was patrolled by his nation's navy. In order to make contact with the navy his army had to take Fort McAllister. The force necessary to take the fort was about 1 brigade, if my memory is correct.
 
Ok enough of beating a dead horse. Retreat was not an option without a battle taking place. What you think Lee wanted to take a nice hike up into the Pennsylvania hills and bring his Army because the weather was much cooler in July than down South? Oh and your information is wrong there oh young one. Sherman Marched to the Sea with 62,000 Union Troops, that's not half of what Lee had in Pennsylvania! Maybe if Lee did what Sherman did The North might of offered a peace settlement, who knows.

Do you digest and consider responses to your posts?

Lee had over 120,000 troops in Pennsylvania?
 
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Lee couldn’t do what Sherman did. All Lee did was get himself in a pickle then blunder into a fruitless and needless attack, nice hike or not. “Young one”? 😂 I’m sorry you are so upset. The Saint Robert stuff may make some feel better about the outcome of the war but it doesn’t conform with reality.

Back to the topic of the thread, in hindsight Longstreet was right.
Not upset at all, just enjoying the goof. Needed these days. Always said Longstreet was right too. Lee, Longstreet, etc. were Southern Gentlemen, one can only wonder the outcome if they behaved like Sherman and razed Pennsylvania.
 
Do you digest and consider responses to your posts?

Lee had over 120,000 troops in Pennsylvania?
Lee had how many troops in Pennsylvania? He had about 75,000 at Gettysburg. Where was he hiding the other 45,000 in Pennsylvania? With those numbers you say he would of rolled right over the Union and walked into Washington DC.:smile coffee:
 
Lee had how many troops in Pennsylvania? He had about 75,000 at Gettysburg. Where was he hiding the other 45,000 in Pennsylvania? With those numbers you say he would of rolled right over the Union and walked into Washington DC.:smile coffee:

Note I'm not making such an assertion but questioning an assertion made by you yesterday.
 
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Lee had how many troops in Pennsylvania? He had about 75,000 at Gettysburg. Where was he hiding the other 45,000 in Pennsylvania? With those numbers you say he would of rolled right over the Union and walked into Washington DC.:smile coffee:
He had 75,000 effectives. He had many more slaves driving wagons, cooks, etc... confederates never counted those (until now on certain threads, lol- yet they still don’t count them as army strength). This isn’t counting the free Pennsylvania African Americans that Lee’s Army captured to consign to slavery. That’s a lot of mouths to feed.
 
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Longstreet’s right arm was essentially useless, and he was barely able to speak after his wounding. Upon his return to service in Oct. 1864, Lee restored Longstreet to command of the First Corps at Petersburg. Considering their closeness from this period through Appomattox, this contradicts the theory Lee did not want Longstreet back; especially with limited favorable replacement corps commanders Lee had available.
Agreed. Everything I've read regarding Lee and Longstreet after his being wounded at the Wilderness, is that Lee missed him very much. They corresponded frequently. Longstreet offered to take less of a command position when he returned in October of 1864, but Lee refused and gave him his full duties as corps commander.
 
Agreed. Everything I've read regarding Lee and Longstreet after his being wounded at the Wilderness, is that Lee missed him very much. They corresponded frequently. Longstreet offered to take less of a command position when he returned in October of 1864, but Lee refused and gave him his full duties as corps commander.
Lee's loneliness had to be intense.
 
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