Lincoln visiting the 5th New York Cavalry in Virginia

Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

Northern Light

Lt. Colonel
Forum Host
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Messages
10,880
Something bout this photo bothers me, so I went looking for other photos of Lincoln with soldiers. In all that I could find, the soldiers are standing respectfully by Lincoln, with the one exception of the photo in the tent with McClellan, but then we know how much respect Little Mac had for the President.
In this picture, however, everyone is just lounging around like they would on any other day and don't seem to even notice that Lincoln is there, neither is he interacting with them in any way. Just seems so odd that no one seems to care that THE PRESIDENT is there!
I found this little piece whilst searching, that others might find as interesting as I did.
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/will-the-real-abraham-lincoln-please-stand-up-3431/?
 

brass napoleon

Colonel
Retired Moderator
Member of the Year
Honored Fallen Comrade
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
14,956
Location
Ohio
Something bout this photo bothers me, so I went looking for other photos of Lincoln with soldiers. In all that I could find, the soldiers are standing respectfully by Lincoln, with the one exception of the photo in the tent with McClellan, but then we know how much respect Little Mac had for the President.
In this picture, however, everyone is just lounging around like they would on any other day and don't seem to even notice that Lincoln is there, neither is he interacting with them in any way. Just seems so odd that no one seems to care that THE PRESIDENT is there!
I found this little piece whilst searching, that others might find as interesting as I did.
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/will-the-real-abraham-lincoln-please-stand-up-3431/?
Yes, that's what makes it really, really intriguing (if it's genuine). Sorry I couldn't read through the link though. (It was just taking way too long to get to the point, and my patience has been short lately. :stomp:)
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

Brendan

Corporal
Joined
Aug 11, 2008
Messages
380
Location
Colorado
I'm not sure about that unit ID too. The weapons, accoutrements, and uniforms all look like infantry (militia?) to me. Any idea of a date?
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

James N.

Lt. Colonel
Forum Host
Civil War Photo Contest
Annual Winner
Featured Book Reviewer
Joined
Feb 23, 2013
Messages
12,432
Location
East Texas
Something bout this photo bothers me, so I went looking for other photos of Lincoln with soldiers. In all that I could find, the soldiers are standing respectfully by Lincoln, with the one exception of the photo in the tent with McClellan, but then we know how much respect Little Mac had for the President.
In this picture, however, everyone is just lounging around like they would on any other day and don't seem to even notice that Lincoln is there, neither is he interacting with them in any way. Just seems so odd that no one seems to care that THE PRESIDENT is there!
I found this little piece whilst searching, that others might find as interesting as I did.
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/will-the-real-abraham-lincoln-please-stand-up-3431/?
I'm not sure about that unit ID too. The weapons, accoutrements, and uniforms all look like infantry (militia?) to me. Any idea of a date?
Photo4%20-%20Marines%20in%20the%20Navy%20Yard_1.jpg


The several shakos and white crossbelts on the sergeant at right beside the flag look like those worn by the U. S. Marines, seen here in a familiar photo said to date from 1864. The marines stationed at the Washington Navy Yard often served as guards and sentries in D. C. As for the 5th N. Y. Cavalry, I believe its members often served as Lincoln's escorts like on his morning and evening rides to the White House and back to the Soldiers' Home when he was staying at the President's Cottage in the summer months. Lincoln became very familiar to ( and with ) these various guards and sentries, making it entirely possible he could "blend in" with them in a group photo like this without causing a fuss.

308-jpg.jpg
 

Northern Light

Lt. Colonel
Forum Host
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Messages
10,880
Photo4%20-%20Marines%20in%20the%20Navy%20Yard_1.jpg


The several shakos and white crossbelts on the sergeant at right beside the flag look like those worn by the U. S. Marines, seen here in a familiar photo said to date from 1864. The marines stationed at the Washington Navy Yard often served as guards and sentries in D. C. As for the 5th N. Y. Cavalry, I believe its members often served as Lincoln's escorts like on his morning and evening rides to the White House and back to the Soldiers' Home when he was staying at the President's Cottage in the summer months. Lincoln became very familiar to ( and with ) these various guards and sentries, making it entirely possible he could "blend in" with them in a group photo like this without causing a fuss.

308-jpg.jpg
So he is just chillin' with his homies?
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

Brendan

Corporal
Joined
Aug 11, 2008
Messages
380
Location
Colorado
Photo4%20-%20Marines%20in%20the%20Navy%20Yard_1.jpg


The several shakos and white crossbelts on the sergeant at right beside the flag look like those worn by the U. S. Marines, seen here in a familiar photo said to date from 1864. The marines stationed at the Washington Navy Yard often served as guards and sentries in D. C. As for the 5th N. Y. Cavalry, I believe its members often served as Lincoln's escorts like on his morning and evening rides to the White House and back to the Soldiers' Home when he was staying at the President's Cottage in the summer months. Lincoln became very familiar to ( and with ) these various guards and sentries, making it entirely possible he could "blend in" with them in a group photo like this without causing a fuss.
I don't think those are Marines either. Marine NCOs of that period actually wore their chevrons "pointy side up" as in our modern military:
dtusm-jpg.jpg


The jackets and hat brass are different too.

In searching for info on O. Pierre Havens, I couldn't find any other wartime images. He's mostly known for his photography taken after he set up a shop in Savannah, GA in 1872. This doesn't look postwar to me though. The uniform style makes me think either NY Militia or chasseurs (note the baggy trousers).

The Edmund Blunt story is compelling, but how do we reconcile it with the conflicting visual evidence? I looked up Blunt's pension record and saw that he did previous service with the 12th and the 7th NY State Militias in 1861 and 1862, respectively. The 12th wore a chasseur uniform that included shakos and baggy trousers as part of their dress uniform. Moreover, the 12th was one of the first units to rush to D.C.'s aid after Lincoln's first call in 1861, and Lincoln walked through their camp, shaking their hands and thanking them personally. There are a number of first person narratives out there involving members of the regiment meeting the President. I even found a strange account of members of the 12th being enlisted by Mrs Lincoln to fix the plumbing in the White House kitchen in April. If this is indeed Lincoln, my theory is that this is actually from 1861 and the men he is with are from the 12th NYSM. Blunt's family (or the book author) likely saw that Blunt did most of his service in the 5th NY Cavalry and assumed this photo was from then.
 

JPK Huson 1863

Brev. Brig. Gen'l
Forum Host
Joined
Feb 14, 2012
Messages
19,735
Location
Central Pennsylvania
This discussion is worthy of a bump.Missed it first time around!

I'm not sure the poses would indicate anything? I'll look around- you do see other photos where the subjects are posed this randomly, everyone looking in another direction, some in profile, looking other directions etc.

Something I can't ref-find is a reference to a Lincoln aid ( or someone ) who was also tall, angular, bearded and top-hatted. Anyone know who he was? This image does look like Lincoln, I'm not implying it's not. Read something about another man frequently mistaken for him then immediately lost the article.
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!
Top