Josey Wales Based On Bill Wilson?---was M. Jerome Clark Also Known As Sue Mundy?

Silverfox

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Probably the only one here who did not know that Josey Wales was based on Bill Wilson noted Guerilla fighter----At the end of the movie the town residents covered Wales by calling him Mr. Wilson when he walked into the saloon---did not catch it until now.

Jerome Clark was also known as Sue Mundy---dressed as woman and deemed himself to be Sue Mundy---and was called that from then on. Some say he was a fictional character made up by a Louisville Editor to deplore the neighbors killing each other. Do not know for sure--anyone know?
 
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Probably the only one here who did not know that Josey Wales was based on Bill Wilson noted Guerilla fighter----At the end of the movie the town residents covered Wales by calling him Mr. Wilson when he walked into the saloon---did not catch it until now.

Jerome Clark was also known as Sue Mundy---dressed as woman and deemed himself to be Sue Mundy---and was called that from then on. Some say he was a fictional character made up by a Louisville Editor to deplore the neighbors killing each other. Do not know for sure--anyone know?

https://civilwartalk.com/threads/my...-in-hodgenville-larue-county-kentucky.152430/

https://civilwartalk.com/threads/un...n-powell-co-d-37th-ky-mounted-infantry.84834/
 

Silverfox

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Interesting family history----I never really knew about those parts of the country ---and having such war. It seemed very personal as everyone seemed to know each other. Border areas seemed to be more involved in this sort of war than other areas.
 

James N.

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Probably the only one here who did not know that Josey Wales was based on Bill Wilson noted Guerilla fighter----At the end of the movie the town residents covered Wales by calling him Mr. Wilson when he walked into the saloon---did not catch it until now.

Jerome Clark was also known as Sue Mundy---dressed as woman and deemed himself to be Sue Mundy---and was called that from then on. Some say he was a fictional character made up by a Louisville Editor to deplore the neighbors killing each other. Do not know for sure--anyone know?
I don't know about Wilson, but Marcellus Jerome Clarke was known as Sue Mundy, supposedly named after a notorious black St. Louis prostitute of that name! Although neither beautiful nor having stereotypical delicate features, Clarke nevertheless did wear his hair long and *might* have been able to pass as a girl if necessary, but I don't know if he ever actually did so, as accused. Considering the whimsical nature of the nickname it wouldn't be surprising if more than one claimed to be Sue Munday!

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Lusty Murfax

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Recall many years ago, late 70s/early 80s listening to a Kansas City talk radio host speak of his friendship with Clint Eastwood. Don't recall the details of how they had become acquainted. The segment was in relation to TOJW movie and it's relevance to the KC region. Reportedly, Eastwood was fascinated with Missouri WBTS/CW history and the Wales story fit in with the anti hero roles that had made him popular.
 

Patrick H

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I don't know about Wilson, but Marcellus Jerome Clarke was known as Sue Mundy, supposedly named after a notorious black St. Louis prostitute of that name! Although neither beautiful nor having stereotypical delicate features, Clarke nevertheless did wear his hair long and *might* have been able to pass as a girl if necessary, but I don't know if he ever actually did so, as accused. Considering the whimsical nature of the nickname it wouldn't be surprising if more than one claimed to be Sue Munday!

View attachment 319556View attachment 319557
I've never seen the portrait of Clark in the oval frame. That's really great! Thanks for posting it.
 
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I've never seen the portrait of Clark in the oval frame. That's really great! Thanks for posting it.
I've always wondered, it seems a remarkable coincidence that Aug 13th 1863 one of the women imprisoned during the Kansas City prison collapse was Susan Mundy, who had been imprisoned for aiding guerrillas.....a year later theres a guerrilla in KY going by the same name.

Note from what I can tell, there is no mention of a Sue Mundy in Ky until a year after the prison collapse, to indicate they are separate people.
 
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Patrick H

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I've always wondered, it seems a remarkable coincidence that Aug 13th 1863 one of the women imprisoned during the Kansas City prison collapse was Susan Mundy, who had been imprisoned for aiding guerrillas.....a year later theres a guerrilla in KY going by the same name.

Note from what I can tell, there is no mention of a Sue Mundy in Ky until a year after the prison collapse, to indicate they are separate people.
I think the name Sue Mundy (as applied to Jerome Clark) was a fabrication of a newspaper writer. Not sure where I read that--it was too many years ago. The writer might have been inspired to use the name by reading it in conjunction with the jail collapse story.
 

Booner

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I've always wondered, it seems a remarkable coincidence that Aug 13th 1863 one of the women imprisoned during the Kansas City prison collapse was Susan Mundy, who had been imprisoned for aiding guerrillas.....a year later theres a guerrilla in KY going by the same name.

Note from what I can tell, there is no mention of a Sue Mundy in Ky until a year after the prison collapse, to indicate they are separate people.
They were different people.

There was a family of Mundy's that lived south of Westport/Kansas City in what is called Little Santa Fe, (today about where the southern loop of I-435 crosses the state line). The parents of 3 Mundy girls (one named Susan), had died and these girls/women were living alone, with at least one of the woman being married to a local guerrilla who rode with Quantrill, and perhaps another who had a husband in the army.
Sometime in the early summer of '63, Bill Anderson brought his three sisters to Missouri and placed them in the home of these Mundy women. Around the same time, the Mundy women were accused of stealing cloth and making guerrilla shirts, so the militia came to their home and arrested all the women there, including Bill Anderson's sisters. The women were first placed in a prison in downtown Kansas City that was so rat-infested and full of vermin that the guards refused to enter the building. Gen. Ewing had the women removed to a another building, which later collapsed, killing five of the incarcerated women, including one of Anderson's sisters, and severely wounding the other two. The Mundy women suffered minor injuries, but IIRC, were later forced to leave the state.
 
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They were different people.

There was a family of Mundy's that lived south of Westport/Kansas City in what is called Little Santa Fe, (today about where the southern loop of I-435 crosses the state line). The parents of 3 Mundy girls (one named Susan), had died and these girls/women were living alone, with at least one of the woman being married to a local guerrilla who rode with Quantrill, and perhaps another who had a husband in the army.
Sometime in the early summer of '63, Bill Anderson brought his three sisters to Missouri and placed them in the home of these Mundy women. Around the same time, the Mundy women were accused of stealing cloth and making guerrilla shirts, so the militia came to their home and arrested all the women there, including Bill Anderson's sisters. The women were first placed in a prison in downtown Kansas City that was so rat-infested and full of vermin that the guards refused to enter the building. Gen. Ewing had the women removed to a another building, which later collapsed, killing five of the incarcerated women, including one of Anderson's sisters, and severely wounding the other two. The Mundy women suffered minor injuries, but IIRC, were later forced to leave the state.
I was aware they were forced to leave the state, but do we know where? Ky would be out of state
 

Story

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Was the book “Gone to Texas” (which the movie is supposedly based) based on Bill Wilson?

Fun facts.

Asa Earl Carter (September 4, 1925 – June 7, 1979) was a 1950s Ku Klux Klan leader, segregationist speech writer, and later western novelist. He co-wrote George Wallace's well-known pro-segregation line of 1963, "Segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever", and ran in the Democratic primary for governor of Alabama on a segregationist ticket. Years later, under the alias of supposedly-Cherokee writer Forrest Carter, he wrote The Rebel Outlaw: Josey Wales (1972), a Western novel that led to a 1976 National Film Registry film, and The Education of Little Tree (1976), a best-selling, award-winning book which was marketed as a memoir but which turned out to be fiction.
 

Story

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Probably the only one here who did not know that Josey Wales was based on Bill Wilson noted Guerilla fighter----At the end of the movie the town residents covered Wales by calling him Mr. Wilson when he walked into the saloon---did not catch it until now.

A blog posting laying out an (uncited) case for Wales being Wilson.
 

Polloco

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The part I heard on the Sue Mundy story was that the editor of the Louisville Courier, George Prentice, had a feud going with the Union commander , Stephen Burbridge. Clarke was called Sue Mundy" by the editor when he tried to embarrass the general by saying that the Army couldn't even deal with controlling a "mere woman like Sue Munday, much less Clarke." He supposedly borrowed the name from a notorious black prostitute in Louisville. And Clarke was supposedly "slight in stature." Plus the campaign against Burbridge apparantly worked as he was replaced by John Palmer.
 
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A blog posting laying out an (uncited) case for Wales being Wilson.
The case always seems week to me for a couple of reasons.

1-Bill and Wilson are common, its like jane doe...…...

2- Bill Wilson is a virtually unknown guerrilla even in Missouri, and theres no evidence I've seen Carter ever lived here.....

3-Now suppose he could have heard of him in Texas , but their theory even says "They think he was probably living around Sherman, Texas" which means theres really no evidence Bill Wilson ever lived in Texas either...…….....
 
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