Restricted Forrest's Grave spray painted.

Allie

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That was under the state's jurisdiction. Does not this new issue fall within the city/county jurisdiction?
I don't know, just seeking information.
At this point nothing having to do with monuments or park names falls under the city/county jurisdiction - the state passed a law to that effect some time ago, in hopes of blocking the renaming of the parks, but the city council basically had an emergency secret midnight meeting to rename the parks before it passed. None of this has been tested legally and it will be interesting to see how it shakes down.
 
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E_just_E

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That was under the state's jurisdiction. Does not this new issue fall within the city/county jurisdiction?
I don't know, just seeking information.

What 7th MS said, but that particular monument has additional restrictions because of the graves that cannot be moved without next of kin permission. So, even if the commission gives the ok for the statue to go, the graves will stay, unless the relatives give the ok.
 

E_just_E

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At this point nothing having to do with monuments or park names falls under the city/county jurisdiction - the state passed a law to that effect some time ago, in hopes of blocking the renaming of the parks, but the city council basically had an emergency secret midnight meeting to rename the parks before it passed. None of this has been tested legally and it will be interesting to see how it shakes down.

This is not that different than the federal regulations about removing places and monuments in the National Register of Historic Places (to do so, they will have to get the approval from the State Commission, plus the NPS.) That held up the removal of several monument so far. Not sure whether the Forrest monument is part of the Register, but that law sure has precedence.

Speaking of the secret midnight meeting and the renaming of the park, here is their half-whatever job (photo last July) :

19406143989_21737ab09f_z.jpg


If they cannot afford a new sign, methinks they have bigger fish to fry that this one...
 

diane

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This is not that different than the federal regulations about removing places and monuments in the National Register of Historic Places (to do so, they will have to get the approval from the State Commission, plus the NPS.) That held up the removal of several monument so far. Not sure whether the Forrest monument is part of the Register, but that law sure has precedence.

Speaking of the secret midnight meeting and the renaming of the park, here is their half-whatever job (photo last July) :

19406143989_21737ab09f_z.jpg


If they cannot afford a new sign, methinks they have bigger fish to fry that this one...

Considering the whole monument with all that Tennessee marble I do wonder if they have considered the cost of this undertaking and if it's really worth it after all. Several years ago when this subject erupted the city of Hernando offered to take the statue and all the city of Memphis had to do was pay the freight. They decided no, $5000 was too much. I think their current project will be far more than that!
 
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This is not that different than the federal regulations about removing places and monuments in the National Register of Historic Places (to do so, they will have to get the approval from the State Commission, plus the NPS.) That held up the removal of several monument so far. Not sure whether the Forrest monument is part of the Register, but that law sure has precedence.

Speaking of the secret midnight meeting and the renaming of the park, here is their half-whatever job (photo last July) :

19406143989_21737ab09f_z.jpg


If they cannot afford a new sign, methinks they have bigger fish to fry that this one...
There's that sign again. :bounce:

I laugh every time I see the attempted paint over of the words "Forrest Park".
Geez . . . surely the City of Memphis could at least afford a new metal sign.
 

JerseyBart

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The topic is spray painting forrest's grave. Please stick to that. Future off topic posts will be edited or deleted.
Posted as moderator.
 

E_just_E

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Considering the whole monument with all that Tennessee marble I do wonder if they have considered the cost of this undertaking and if it's really worth it after all. Several years ago when this subject erupted the city of Hernando offered to take the statue and all the city of Memphis had to do was pay the freight. They decided no, $5000 was too much. I think their current project will be far more than that!

Here is the kicker: I am pretty sure that they want the Forrest kin or whoever takes the statue to pay for it all, or send the bill to the State because the State (as in U of TN) is the caretaker of the Park. They are just posturing without putting any $ where their mouths are. I am sure that they have budgeted zero dollars for this.
 

Desert Kid

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Here is the kicker: I am pretty sure that they want the Forrest kin or whoever takes the statue to pay for it all, or send the bill to the State because the State (as in U of TN) is the caretaker of the Park. They are just posturing without putting any $ where their mouths are. I am sure that they have budgeted zero dollars for this.

Yeah, nothing'll happen.
 

diane

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Yeah, nothing'll happen.

I don't know if nothing will happen, but it does seem like a much more difficult task than just let's get rid of it. My problem is the deliberate neglect and clear disdain for this site. I understand the problems many people would have with this general but I, too, have to see and walk by statues of people who did no good for me or mine. Everybody who has damaged the site seems to have done so with an eye to gaining press space and political points, and the disdain seems directed not at Forrest but at his supporters. Ah, me. The more things change the more they stay the same... :unsure:
 

Desert Kid

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I don't know if nothing will happen, but it does seem like a much more difficult task than just let's get rid of it. My problem is the deliberate neglect and clear disdain for this site. I understand the problems many people would have with this general but I, too, have to see and walk by statues of people who did no good for me or mine. Everybody who has damaged the site seems to have done so with an eye to gaining press space and political points, and the disdain seems directed not at Forrest but at his supporters. Ah, me. The more things change the more they stay the same... :unsure:

Well why not? All we are is a bunch of dumb racist rednecks who don't know better.
 

diane

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Well why not? All we are is a bunch of dumb racist rednecks who don't know better.

Well, I think it's way more complex than that! (Racism isn't a one-way street, either...) I'm not going to go to New York and spray paint Red Lives Matter on Sherman's statue. I would like, however, to be able to present my side of that history in another area. He can have his space! Some way there needs to be a recognition of a shared history but that doesn't mean all the statues of the old era need to be erased. A little room. The fact that these symbols and statues of a defeated rebellion were allowed in the first place shows that Americans have always been a little different!
 

diane

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So when is the removal hullabaloo supposed to go to the Tennessee State Historical Commission?

I don't think they've weighed in on it yet, or even if they've actually gotten involved. Maybe somebody else knows about that. I do know that what is unique - and therefore precedent-setting - is that if Memphis gets its way, this will be the first time a Confederate general, or any other Confederate figure, has been disinterred. (Although I do think they ought to get A P Hill out of the middle of the road!)
 

Allie

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I don't think they've weighed in on it yet, or even if they've actually gotten involved. Maybe somebody else knows about that. I do know that what is unique - and therefore precedent-setting - is that if Memphis gets its way, this will be the first time a Confederate general, or any other Confederate figure, has been disinterred. (Although I do think they ought to get A P Hill out of the middle of the road!)
Technically he was disinterred when they moved him from Elmwood in the first place.
 

diane

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Technically he was disinterred when they moved him from Elmwood in the first place.

Yes, that's so. But that was with family permission and co-operation. This is something they're trying to do without that, or they don't seem to be considering it as important. Some of the generals and prominent people have been moved - some of them a lot! - but it was with family involvement. This seems to be very different in that these folks don't seem to care if there's input from the family or not.
 

Allie

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Yes, that's so. But that was with family permission and co-operation. This is something they're trying to do without that, or they don't seem to be considering it as important. Some of the generals and prominent people have been moved - some of them a lot! - but it was with family involvement. This seems to be very different in that these folks don't seem to care if there's input from the family or not.
I believe you are correct that they don't care, although news articles have mostly pointed out that they are going to have to care, according to the law, whether they want to or not. None of those news articles have said anything about who that family might be.
 
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