1. Welcome to the CivilWarTalk, a forum for questions and discussions about the American Civil War! Become a member today for full access to all of our resources, it's fast, simple, and absolutely free!
Dismiss Notice
Join and Become a Patron at CivilWarTalk!
Support this site with a monthly or yearly subscription! Active Patrons get to browse the site Ad free!
START BY JOINING NOW!

Dr. Lydia, Her Bloomers And A Small Shovel, 1863

Discussion in 'The Ladies Tea' started by JPK Huson 1863, Sep 26, 2017.

  1. JPK Huson 1863

    JPK Huson 1863 Colonel Forum Host

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2012
    Messages:
    13,907
    Location:
    Central Pennsylvania

    sooths serpant.jpg
    Romanticized images of women adopting peacekeeping, placating roles permeated our society, as evinced by this fairy tale illustration. From Serpent Kings to Ugly Trolls to Three Annoyed Bears to Seven Short Men, the role was scripted. Sweet and er, soothe.

    Mrs
    . Dr. Lydia Sayer Hasbrouck was not, like her more crank-tankerous era contempory and friend Dr. Mary Walker, a devotee of battering against men in particular. Married, mother of three, Dr. Lydia's physician husband seems to have shared her immovable stance. Stances. If men were involved, well, move.

    Dr. Mary's contributions to the war's wounded is wildly overlooked, History for some reason choosing to concentrate on her eccentricities. Both Walker and Hausbrouck promoted- strongly- the ' Dress Reform ' movement. Why?
    crim con dem pad.JPG
    Work in that, be careful about standing to close to the fireplace in each home or walk through a door not-sideways or care for children or exercise or eat, for that matter. Oh. Or think about a WC. It was all wrapped up in very early women's rights. Once did a thread on the Dress Reform Movement and think it was zero views, zero replies. It was kinda ugly.

    Dr. Hausbrouck's ' Bloomer ' clothing ' evoked widespread protest, if misplaced. Yet another, earlier Dress Reform movement had been devoted to ' Bloomers ' but was really a kind of Bad Fashion, quelled nearly at birth.

    dress reform dr cox.jpg
    Mrs. M.E. Cox, MD., so a professional.

    More on Mrs. Dr. Lydia here, far too long to get into without it being a huge, long thread. One of the points here, beyond an entertaining article, is gratitude. Women worked awfully long and awfully hard- so no serpent placating for us these days. Mostly.
    http://www.orangecountyhistoricalsociety.org/OCHS/v2014/J-1985_Lydia_Sayer_Hasbrouck.html

    MUST, please enjoy this article, really the reason for the thread. Bumped into it in an era paper, looked her up and could not stand not sharing this little scene.

    1863, an entire war elsewhere- meanwhile, back at the ranch......
    women tax 1863 1.jpg

    You know she was to pay a good chunk in taxes, being a doc.

    women tax 1863 2.jpg

    *snorkel*

    women tax 1863 3.jpg
     

  2. (Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)
  3. John Hartwell

    John Hartwell Captain Forum Host

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    6,425
    Location:
    Central Massachusetts
    Good for Dr. Lydia!
    Of course, I haven't read "the rest of the story" yet.

    One thing about the dress reform movement: it was always an "upper class" movement.

    Lower class women had always had reasonably work-worthy clothes -- without all the hoops and fripperies. An "up-scale" more decorous adaptation of a poor woman's or farm wife's plain dress was always available for more a fashion-minded working woman. But sponsors of dress reform seemed to prefer a more ostentatious, radical display. I think the "practicality" of the dress was less important than the social statement.
     
  4. JPK Huson 1863

    JPK Huson 1863 Colonel Forum Host

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2012
    Messages:
    13,907
    Location:
    Central Pennsylvania
    Makes sense? You do notice a lack of sheer time amongst working class women- hence ' work ', making ends meet- who gets out for the meetings? ( that was a little joke based on 12 hour work days- guessing there was not a lot of mixing, anyway ) Those meager paychecks were taxed, too.

    And ah. So the ugly part was intentional. You can see where the originator of the first movement went out of her way to separate hers from this, then. Same idea but ' pretty '. Her idea was not to be hampered tripping over one's hems and carrying pounds and pounds of fabric. And rats. Been walking uphill on that playing field for years so this is dreadful to say but tend to prefer the prettier interpretation.

    Yes, good for Dr. Lydia! Loved this story, with several male frustrations bursting just below its surface. Your observation on class could have come into play here? This woman, from this family and place in society could get away with a protest? Unsure someone less protected through social status could have gotten away with it.

    Interesting, on women voting. Article from Leslie's, I think 1861, on women legally voting- no idea how or when it was revoked.

    vote nj.JPG

    " Representing a custom, happily revoked.... " Oh dear.

    vote nj2a.jpg
    vote nj2b.jpg
    vote nj3a.jpg vote nj3b.jpg
     
  5. John Hartwell

    John Hartwell Captain Forum Host

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    6,425
    Location:
    Central Massachusetts
    Well, I don't think I'd say the ugly was intentional. But these ladies would have been very resistant, indeed, to anything that made them look déclassé. They were struggling with new concepts while still largely under the influence of older ones. Maintaining a visible distinction between social classes was still considered important. Change would come slowly, but it would come.


    [PS: I remember in the 1960s, my mother (then in her 50s) felt so adventurous in getting her first pair of pants. Social distinction was no part of her reasoning, but the innovation was still a bit of a shock 100 years after the "uglies"..]
     
    mofederal and NH Civil War Gal like this.
  6. NH Civil War Gal

    NH Civil War Gal Sergeant

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2017
    Messages:
    872
    I LOVE all your articles! And I had, a few months ago, read about the water cure and the clothes at these places! So I was excited to see your article. The women loved wearing these clothes at the water cure places, but it would have had to be an upper class woman to even go, because I was amazed at how they could go for months at a time. It seems like it was usually a father or husband paying for the stays - and they went a lot.

    Your first picture of Dr. Cox has written in the bottom, NH. I *think* it says Chester which is east of Manchester, the largest city in NH. OR.... it might say Concord which is the capital and is about 12 miles north of Manchester. I've never heard of her.

    My mother was a high-school business teacher. I can remember her always dressing up and having to wear a girdle, etc. As a 12-year-old, I hated even looking at those girdles. I remember the day when the schools loosened up a bit in their codes for clothes. She got a pantsuit and honestly, never looked back. But I remember the first day she wore a pantsuit to teach and it was seen as "very daring." Good times!
     
    mofederal and John Hartwell like this.
  7. NH Civil War Gal

    NH Civil War Gal Sergeant

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2017
    Messages:
    872
    mofederal likes this.
  8. John Hartwell

    John Hartwell Captain Forum Host

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    6,425
    Location:
    Central Massachusetts
    That's shocking. I'm sure I saw that in a used book store a ear or so ago for under $10!
    Just checked Abebooks (sometimes better prices than Amazon), they have several copies ranging from $89 to $224!!! -- paperback!
     
    NH Civil War Gal likes this.
  9. NH Civil War Gal

    NH Civil War Gal Sergeant

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2017
    Messages:
    872
    The hardcover on Amazon is $189.00!
     
    mofederal likes this.
  10. mofederal

    mofederal 2nd Lieutenant

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2017
    Messages:
    3,032
    Location:
    Southeast Missouri
    As a big reader, I have run into some very expensive paperbacks. One of my favorites was like $50. to $150. There are books that for whatever reason are just plain expensive. The problem with some of them is that were mass market paperbacks when new. Just no good used books stores here. Only one, but they don't carry older books unless they were bestsellers.
     
    NH Civil War Gal likes this.
  11. JPK Huson 1863

    JPK Huson 1863 Colonel Forum Host

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2012
    Messages:
    13,907
    Location:
    Central Pennsylvania

    " I have got to die before people will know who I am and what I have done. It is a shame that people who lead reforms in this world are not appreciated until after they are dead; then the world pays its tributes”

    So this was such a sad, prophetic quote, since you're a Mary Walker fan- she was amazing, wasn't she? I've never been able to do her justice in a thread. Have one in a file- but it's tough. She was so peculiar, frequently on purpose ( love that ), her very real dedication to wounded is ignored. Gettysburg, for instance, is such a well researched topic- Walker was there. One of the aid workers remarks of her- it's the only mention I can find.

    Did not know this statue existed- hence the post here! Very cool. Will get to a thread soon but whew- it's a difficult topic, someone as uncompromising as Walker.
    walker.jpg
     
    NH Civil War Gal likes this.

(Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)

Share This Page


(Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)