Restricted Debate Does abolition of Northern Slavery Absolve the North of having Slavery?

Does abolition of Northern Slavery Absolve the North of Slavery?

  • Yes, of course

    Votes: 5 23.8%
  • No way Jose

    Votes: 15 71.4%
  • Maybe, Maybe not

    Votes: 1 4.8%

  • Total voters
    21
  • Poll closed .
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matthew mckeon

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#41
Slavery was legal and Northern profits proves is the reason the responsibility lays on both sides of the line.
It cuts both ways. The dark is on both parts of the Country. Read the book if you haven't already called 'Complicity'.
In a dispute between the nonslaveowning part of the country and the slaveowning part of the country, about the future of slaveowning in the country you can say a lot of things, but both sides are the same about slaveowning isn't one of them.
 

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#44
I find the word "absolve" interesting. With all the people involved with slavery dead now, north or south, who exactly needs absolution?
IMO the only question on this is the people who still deny that slavery had anything to do with the war. They maintain a great fiction that is damaging to the country. They do indeed need absolution, but won't find it in this quarter.
 
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#46
I find the word "absolve" interesting. With all the people involved with slavery dead now, north or south, who exactly needs absolution?
All those, then and now, north and south, who do/did not repent slavery and/or white supremacy, and the violence and destruction to support them, are in need of absolution. One example would be denial of the inhumanity of chattel slavery and/or teaching the false representation that it was benevolent .
 

19thGeorgia

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#47
One example would be denial of the inhumanity of chattel slavery and/or teaching the false representation that it was benevolent .
There are also those who misrepresent slavery for the purpose of race hustling - to stoke racial hatred. Do they need repentance and absolving?...or do they get a pass?
 

19thGeorgia

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#49
I did not advocate a pass for anyone. We all are sinners. Can you give a specific example as I did ?
On another thread: "The DNA evidence is overwhelming that slave owners raped their slaves constantly."

DNA can tell us about someone's lineage, but it cannot/does not tell us that slaves were "raped constantly."
 
#50
When could they vote and if they voted, what was the procedure for doing so in the North? They buried their leather whip for another way to control. That is a long way from being 'FREE'.
I just began reading this thread so I apoligize if the following question has been asked and answered. Were White women and children considered "free" in the Northern and Southern states?
 
#51
They freed them because they did not generate money. I wish people would stop being over-dramatic about how the North freed the slaves.

The North was extremely fortunate not to find a profitable way to utilize them. I wish I could say the same for the South.
That was only true for a minority of Northern slave owners. The post-Revolutionary War period according to Peter Kolchin and his his book American Slavery (1619-1877), pg. 78, was an "era that celebrated liberty and natural rights" that led to the Northern states enacting emancipation laws. They were not forced by outside forces to emancipate their slaves. On the other hand, the Southern states fought tooth and nail against any interference in the peculiar institution and eventually seceded, forming a de facto nation whose founding was based on the enslavement and expansion of the Black race.
 
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#52
On another thread: "The DNA evidence is overwhelming that slave owners raped their slaves constantly."

DNA can tell us about someone's lineage, but it cannot/does not tell us that slaves were "raped constantly."
By the very definition of a master/slave relationship, a slave cannot consent. When one party is unable to give free and informed consent, there is a rape.
 
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#53
On another thread: "The DNA evidence is overwhelming that slave owners raped their slaves constantly."

DNA can tell us about someone's lineage, but it cannot/does not tell us that slaves were "raped constantly."
That masters had relations with slaves is evident and cannot be disguised. Slaves were property and were subject to the masters intentions, desires, and lust. Are you suggesting that slaves welcomed their masters overtures ? And isn’t that just another way to incite racial hatred. If slaves did submit could you blame them ? What was the alternative ? Has not the helpless always suffered the immoral assaults , and still do, in helpless situations ? The masters had total control and only a outraged wife or gossiping neighbor could tell the tales, except for a few and here is one....

“Northerners know nothing at all about Slavery. They think it is perpetual bondage only. They have no conception of the depth of degradation involved in that word, SLAVERY; if they had, they would never cease their efforts until so horrible a system was overthrown."

A Woman of North Carolina

Preface by the Author.
When I first arrived in Philadelphia, Bishop Paine advised me to publish a sketch of my life, but I told him I was altogether incompetent to such an undertaking. Though I have improved my mind somewhat since that time, I still remain of the same opinion; but I trust my motives will excuse what might otherwise seem presumptuous. I have not written my experiences in order to attract attention to myself; on the contrary, it would have been more pleasant to me to have been silent about my own history. Neither do I care to excite sympathy for m y own sufferings. But I do earnestly desire to arouse the women of the North to a realizing sense of the condition of two millions of women at the South, still in bondage, suffering what I suffered, and most of them far worse. I want to add my testimony to that of abler pens to convince the people of the Free States what Slavery really is. Only by experience can 'any one realize how deep, and dark, and foul is that pit of abominations. May the blessing of God rest on this imperfect effort in behalf of my perse cuted peopleI

LINDA BRENT.

https://books.googleusercontent.com...SGrACenX6ve9JjaHIA6BVhZeRhxiKbq8g17cFmbJD--Cw

white masters with slave offspring was such a problem that it demanded a legal doctrine to release the father from any legal or financial responsibility.
Partus sequitur ventrem
 

19thGeorgia

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#54
By the very definition of a master/slave relationship, a slave cannot consent. When one party is unable to give free and informed consent, there is a rape.
I didn't say slaves were never raped.
I said- DNA...cannot/does not tell us that slaves were "raped constantly."
 
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19thGeorgia

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#55
All those, then and now, north and south, who do/did not repent slavery and/or white supremacy, and the violence and destruction to support them, are in need of absolution. One example would be denial of the inhumanity of chattel slavery and/or teaching the false representation that it was benevolent .
Well, why stop at slavery for this collective guilt? What about the English invasion of France in the Hundred Years War? Do I need to repent of the execution of Jeanne d'Arc? William Wallace? Is that too far back? What's the cutoff point? 200 years? 500 years?...or is there a cutoff point?
 
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#56
Well, why stop at slavery for this collective guilt? What about the English invasion of France in the Hundred Years War? Do I need to repent of the execution of Jeanne d'Arc? William Wallace? Is that too far back? What's the cutoff point? 200 years? 500 years?...or is there a cutoff point?
There are many figures and groups in history and today that are in need of absolution. Some do not seek it. To paraphrase Joe Shelby , repentance must precede absolution and i do not repent. Many do not. They are in need. Your question is purely argumentative and ridiculous. Atrocities span the sands of time and the south’s peculiar institution is one among many. Guilt by association , support, and conformity applies , whatever the time or place. You need only repent those.
 
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