Confederate Sharps carbine

kansas

Corporal
Joined
May 12, 2010
Location
herington kansas
My ist post. So, you boys and girls out there that know much of civil war firearms. Has any of you looked over closely a real confederate Sharps? I have read that they are nothing like a Sharps as to the inner workings, that they were poorly made, performed poorly etc. So has anyone here really looked one over, perhaps tried the action, fired it , compared it ?? If so what did you observe? I do not want an article with 100 year old info or some field report from 1863, i want some real hands on know how if anyone has any. I dont want any repro info either. thank you.
 
Yes that is the weapon Elennsar. They were made in Richmond. They look to be a fine weapon despite some various reports, i was in hopes someone had handled one in an intimate way.
 
I've owned and live fired quite a few origional CW rifles and carbines in my time, but not a Robinson Sharps, nor do I know anyone who has...They're just too rare and expensive to shoot. The design follows Sharps pattern very well with the omission of the Lawrence pellet primer mechinism and sight. The Sharps had a few flaws in itself, (I've owned and shot several originals and a Shiloh) The weakest point being it's ammunition, which is suseptable to moisture and rough handling, (as most CW paper or linen cartridges were). The breach block depends on a "floating" face plate to make agood seal, when this gets fowled the seal leaks, and the cartridge end being cut off when loaded leaves a small amount of powder on the top of the breach which is usually shaken off and can work it's way between the fore-end and barrel resulting in a small explosion removing a section of fore-arm about "pinkey finger" size, (an origional 1859 rifle I owned had this happen and I've seen others either missing a sliver of wood along the right rear fore-arm, or a repair there). I can only imagine the Robinson Sharps suffered the same problems and possibly more, depending on how well the breach block fitted the receiver and barrel.

I have Wm. Albaugh's book, "Confederate Arms" and will check for any comments on the Robinson Sharps.
 
Here's the story out of Wm. Albaugh's book, "Confederate Arms". It seems as though the Robinson, or Richmond Sharps got a bad foot forward because of troops who never had a breach loader, no less a new one. "Give a dog a bad name, and it sticks."...Here's the short version of the story.

40 new Robinson Sharps and 1,000 rds. of ammunition were received by the 4th Va. Cav. for field testing on March 1863. The cases opened and the men instructed to fire them, (I can just imagine the "Ooohs and Ahaas" as the men looked over these brand new breach loaders). Boys being boys, they loaded their new weapons, capped them, and...nothing. They hadn't cleared the packing grease from the nipples and flash channels, the guns didn't fire. They opned the breaches, cleared the flash channels of grease, all the while being careful to have the muzzles pointed to the earth, re-capped them, mounted them to their shoulders, and...According to Lt. N.D. Morris, "nine were fired, and seven of the nine burst."

Lt. Morris, took pen in hand and wrote to the Richmond Whig newspaper who ran the story under the headline, "An Outrage!" The story inplied the arms were totally worthless and dangerous to the user, 7 of 9 burst. What burst exactly?..And why?

The story reached Gen. Lee who had his ordinance cheif, Col. Gorgas look into the matter at once. Col. Gorgas did a good and thorough job of investigating what happened. He found that no barrels burst and no breach blocks failed. What happened was, "They load their arm and snap a cap without effect. A portion of the powder falls into the gas chamber in the slide. They hold their gun muzzle down to prevent powder from spilling at the breach and draw th slide down, by that means empty the powder remaining in the gas chamber into the mortice for the crank spring in the forestock under the barrel. They get the vent clear and fire the gunafter closing the breach, and the flash from the cap communicating with the powder in the mortice explodes and bursts a part of the forestock.

Col. Gorgas continues, "This is an unavoidable fault connected with the new gas check, the same accident happens to the origional Sharps in the hands of green men. This can be remedied by going back to the old fashioned smooth slide without the gas chamber and making the vent hole fuller. We would not get so perfect a gas tight joint, but the difficulty of having a portion of the powder falling into the slide would be remdied."

Col Gorgas goes on to say that no fault can be atributed to the manufacturer, and suggests that officers take the time to properly train their men in the use of the arm.

The article can be read in it's entirety in Wm. Albaugh's book, "Confederate Arms", pages 65-73. I hope this answers the question, as I stated in my previous post, Sharps had the same problem and the "bursting" was not unique to Robinson/Richmond Sharps carbines.
 
Field reports and old info is all you're likely to get on A Robinson/Richmond Sharps, at $15,000.00-$25,000.00 there aren't many who can afford one, let alone shoot one. I've seen them on rare ocasion at some of the better antique arms dealers, but they were locked behind heavy glass cases like in a museum. I would say your best bet for someone who has handled one would be Sam Small at the Horse Soldier in Gettysburg.
 
Old Hickory. Thank you for your efforts and info, i had no access to the book confederate arms. This clears up something i have always wondered about and sheds much light on the Confederate Sharps and Sharps in general. I understand the behind locked glass as the firearms and other items in the Fort Riley museum are in pristine condition and every one of them must be viewed through locked glass. Again, many thanks.
 
I've seen and handled one. As well as several original Sharps. The Robinson is a poor copy, parts will not interchange w/ an M1859 Sharps. The one I handled was not is shooting condition but showed signs of very real hard use. The owner considered it a poor copy of the Sharps due to poor workmanship and fitting. I didn't quite agree w/ that conclusion after handling it. It seemed to feel about the same to the Sharps and he was commenting on a weapon that had seen hard use in it's almost 150 year lifetime. It was clear to me that fit and finish were not up to the Sharps standards, but as a note Soviet Era Mosin Nagant's, PPSH41 etc had very poor fit n finish but were no less lethal to the Wermacht. I think a lot of corners were cut but the overall effectiveness and efficiency was retained. IMO they were made w/ no polish in mind, pure function.
 
Confederate weapons were quite often US Army weapons due to their "former" owners. I suspect weaponry in this war must be taken as a whole with links to the manufacturers rather than the users to make much sense.
 
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