Children find Civil War relic; parents call Sheriff

Irishtom29

2nd Lieutenant
Joined
Jul 21, 2008
Location
Kent, Washington
Prudent behavior. In Europe people are still killed once in awhile by "relics" of the Great War.

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Mike Serpa

Major
Joined
Jan 24, 2013
Too bad they didn’t know to come here first! Sad to think that no one on the force could actually disarm it..history lost.
Yes, it's sad to think they didn't disarm it. Imagine yourself on the bomb disposal squad. How many opportunities would you get to blow up a Civil War cannonball? What fun to tell you family, friends and future bomb disposal squad members what you did! Your fun is more important than the discoverers fun. Reminds me of the California Department of Forestry.

The California Department of Forestry knows where the tallest redwood tree is but won't tell the public. The California Department of Forestry also knows where the oldest bristlecone pine tree is but won't tell the public. They can look at the trees and enjoy them for what they are but the public will never know.
 

Irishtom29

2nd Lieutenant
Joined
Jul 21, 2008
Location
Kent, Washington
Too bad they didn’t know to come here first! Sad to think that no one on the force could actually disarm it..history lost.

Sad? History wasn't lost, just an old shell. Dealing with a live shell is serious business and safety is more important than the opinion of a hobbyist that the thing is a "relic". I don't tell other people how to do their job.
 
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Tom Hughes

First Sergeant
Joined
May 27, 2019
Location
Mississippi
Civil War artillery shells (especially Bormann shells like the one found) are not as dangerous as one might think. The only way they would even possibly go off would be to maybe throw them into a fire. These shells don't just blow up on their own or even if you were to drop one. This shows the ignorance of the general public regarding civil war ordnance. These are not like modern shells (WWI and after). Yes, those have more sophisticated fuzes. What a shame the shell was destroyed.
 

Tom Hughes

First Sergeant
Joined
May 27, 2019
Location
Mississippi
Sad? History wasn't lost, just an old shell. Dealing with a live shell is serious business and safety is more important than the opinion of a hobbyist that the thing is a "relic". I don't tell other people how to do their job.
The first reaction of someone not familiar with civil war period shells is what you are expressing here.
 

Rusk County Avengers

1st Lieutenant
Joined
Apr 8, 2018
Location
Coffeeville, TX
Prudent behavior. In Europe people are still killed once in awhile by "relics" of the Great War.

View attachment 394010

Prudence is always best, but the situation in Europe is far different from CW shells in America. No gas shells, and fewer of them in comparison to Europe where you can't take a step without tripping over them. Plus a lot easier to disarm.

Only explosive thing I'd be scared of CW wise would be the old Confederate landmines, artillery shells ain't nothing as long as you respect them.
 

John Winn

Major
Joined
Mar 13, 2014
Location
State of Jefferson
Yes, it's sad to think they didn't disarm it. Imagine yourself on the bomb disposal squad. How many opportunities would you get to blow up a Civil War cannonball? What fun to tell you family, friends and future bomb disposal squad members what you did! Your fun is more important than the discoverers fun. Reminds me of the California Department of Forestry.

The California Department of Forestry knows where the tallest redwood tree is but won't tell the public. The California Department of Forestry also knows where the oldest bristlecone pine tree is but won't tell the public. They can look at the trees and enjoy them for what they are but the public will never know.
Don't want to get into a spat but the reason the exact location isn't made public is to protect the trees from said public (who tend to do stupid things like cut out burls, take souvenirs, carve their initials, and damage delicate root systems). I've actually visited Methuselah (the Bristlecone) but went with members of the Tucson dendrochronology lab. I was a forester working for the Department of The Interior in Nevada at the time and had been assisting the lab on some projects. And BTW, Methuselah is on federal land (USFS). I'd guess there's lots of people who know where Hyperion (the Redwood) is, too; you just have to know somebody and be a safe bet.

Most archeological sites are not made public either because if they were they'd be dug up. I think we can consider these trees to be living archeological sites. It's a bit of a tragedy of the commons thing.
 
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Tom Hughes

First Sergeant
Joined
May 27, 2019
Location
Mississippi
Don't want to get into a spat but the reason the exact location isn't made public is to protect the trees from said public (who tend to do stupid things like take souvenirs and carve their initials). I've actually visited Methusilah (the Bristlecone) but went with members of the Tuscon dendrochronology lab. I was a forester working for the Department of The Interior in Nevada at the time and had been assisting the lab on some projects. I'd guess there's lots of people who know where Hyperion (the Redwood) is, too; you just have to know somebody and be a safe bet.

Most archeological sites are not made public either because if they were they'd be dug up. I think we can consider these trees to be living archeological sites. It's a bit of a tragedy of the commons thing.
Yes, I've noticed that most sites are not made public. That certainly makes sense.
 

Mike Serpa

Major
Joined
Jan 24, 2013
Don't want to get into a spat but the reason the exact location isn't made public is to protect the trees from said public (who tend to do stupid things like cut out burls, take souvenirs, carve their initials, and damage delicate root systems). I've actually visited Methuselah (the Bristlecone) but went with members of the Tucson dendrochronology lab. I was a forester working for the Department of The Interior in Nevada at the time and had been assisting the lab on some projects. And BTW, Methuselah is on federal land (USFS). I'd guess there's lots of people who know where Hyperion (the Redwood) is, too; you just have to know somebody and be a safe bet.

Most archeological sites are not made public either because if they were they'd be dug up. I think we can consider these trees to be living archeological sites. It's a bit of a tragedy of the commons thing.
I know the reason. It's sad they have to do that. Thanks for the correction of who owns the land. If I could choose one of the two to visit I would choose Methuselah.
 

John Winn

Major
Joined
Mar 13, 2014
Location
State of Jefferson
I know the reason. It's sad they have to do that. Thanks for the correction of who owns the land. If I could choose one of the two to visit I would choose Methuselah.
Those old Bristlecone are amazing. I also visited the site on Wheeler Peak in Nevada several times (also with the dendrochronology guys on one occasion). You can definitely wander around the grove; just won't know which one is Methuselah. I could go on about Bristlecone but will spare you.
 

Rhea Cole

1st Lieutenant
Joined
Nov 2, 2019
Location
Murfreesboro, Tennessee
I asked my EOD sergeant grandson what he advises re: Civil War UXO found in the ground. On a tour in Afghanistan, he disposed of ordinance dating from the British invasion during Victoria's reign & every war since. Here in the states he has dealt with dud 16" battleship rounds down to thousands of mortar rounds scattered around a grade school play yard. It had been a Korean War era practice range. There was no way to differentiate between duds & inert practice rounds. They detonated the lot in place. His favorite was an 8" cruiser round that a family had discovered during a day at the beach. They had scooted the live, fuzed round into the back of an SUV. They stopped at the ranger station to ask permission to take it home. In that case, disposal in place was not an option.

In his considerable experience, dug relics are mostly harmless as a brick. It depends very much on how much moisture is involved. Black powder can become very volatile when soaked & dried. In his opinion, risking an encounter with the occasional volatile shell is not worth the risk. The memorial rally the EOD veterans attend every year probably colors his thinking.
 
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