Artillery going into action

@Belfoured I have never seen that before. Thank you very much for sending it to me and the highlighting you did! I will get into it this evening when I am home for the night.

I am looking forward to anything you have to say about the artillery manuals for the 18th. and early 19th. centuries. Should be fascinating stuff!

Thanks again, John
Will do. Among other things, you'll wonder how the Royal Artillery was able to operate during the AWI and the Napoleonic wars/War of 1812 when much of what would amount to a 'manual" was a collection of lecture notes and "cheat sheets" kept at the academy at Woolrich. 😎
 
I think it's interesting that they're on the rear slope. Can they even see where they're aiming? Did they have a spotter? From what I've been reading that may have been normal placement.
 
I think it's interesting that they're on the rear slope. Can they even see where they're aiming? Did they have a spotter? From what I've been reading that may have been normal placement.
In the CW the ideal location on a slope would be just down a ways from the crest. That allows the battery to defend themselves from an attack from the front but also prevents them from becoming easily seen silhouettes against the sky as would be the case if on top of the crest. Artillery fire was a line-of-sight proposition and there were no forward spotters (and no way to effectively communicate with such).
 
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I think it's interesting that they're on the rear slope. Can they even see where they're aiming? Did they have a spotter? From what I've been reading that may have been normal placement.
A few things. First, I'm not sure that the "slope" isn't the result of a little distortion. In addition, this has always been identified as "Battery D of the 5th US" and as being taken "at Fredericksburg" (Battery B was not assigned to the Army of the Potomac in June 1863). The photo was taken by Timothy O'Sullivan but was later published by Alexander Gardner, who appears to have furnished the description "in action". My guess has always been that it was "in the presence of the enemy" but that this was staged and not "in action". I cannot imagine any battery commander whose outfit was truly "in action" having everybody hold still for the length of time required to get a negative without blurring - we have seen several images where persons in the background of the subject moved and it's extremely blurred. (O'Sullivan made another great photo of a Union battery (which I have yet to identify) at a stream crossing on the way to Cedar Mountain on August 9, 1862 but - because they apparently had halted to water the horses - there is no blurring.)

So I wouldn't put much effort into trying to figure out exactly what tactics they were using - it's one of the best images we have of how a 6-gun battery would have appeared in "action front".
 
Can anyone tell me what kind of guns those are?
You ask a very interesting question. My recollection is that at Gettysburg Battery D - if the records are correct that this is Battery D - had 6 10 lb Parrott rifles. But the first two in the photo certainly appear to be M1857 12 lb Napoleons to me. The remaining four are harder - and could be Parrotts without having the image enlarged. At Antietam Battery D had 2 Napoleons and 4 Parrotts. I'd have to look at a few things to determine when the Napoleons were replaced.
 
I think it's interesting that they're on the rear slope. Can they even see where they're aiming? Did they have a spotter? From what I've been reading that may have been normal placement.

In the CW the ideal location on a slope would be just down a ways from the crest. That allows the battery to defend themselves from an attack from the front but also prevents them from becoming easily seen silhouettes against the sky as would be the case if on top of the crest. Artillery fire was a line-of-sight proposition and there were no forward spotters (and now way to effectively communicate with such).
Agree. The closest to a "spotter" in the ACW/direct fire era was Hunt's requirement that a member of the battery with good visual acuity be detailed to stand apart from the crew, observe the effects of the shot, and indicate corrections. After 10 minutes or so on a black powder battlefield, this probably became an exercise in futility.
 
Off topic but I love the video of the Japanese Navy spotter-officer with the sword pointing at oncoming US aircraft. I bet the regular guys were making jokes about what a great help he was. Haha
 
Gardner in his Photographic Sketch Book identifies this group as Battery D of the 2nd U.S. Artillery. A print of this image in the National Archives (NARA - 533305) also confirms this.

service-pnp-ppmsca-12800-12834-00069v2.jpg
 
Agree. The closest to a "spotter" in the ACW/direct fire era was Hunt's requirement that a member of the battery with good visual acuity be detailed to stand apart from the crew, observe the effects of the shot, and indicate corrections. After 10 minutes or so on a black powder battlefield, this probably became an exercise in futility.
Seems like I have read of having spotters in trees, but not sure in what connection. Maybe I'm confused about what part of the slope they're on. What I'm reading of Chickamauga, it sounded like they were just over the crest from the enemy, unseen, but still functioning.
 
Gardner in his Photographic Sketch Book identifies this group as Battery D of the 2nd U.S. Artillery. A print of this image in the National Archives (NARA - 533305) also confirms this.

View attachment 402730
Thanks. I have always seen it labeled as Battery D 5th US. So we now have another question.

Battery D 2nd US had 4 - not 6 - M1857 Napoleons at Gettysburg. It's possible they turned in two of their guns between June 3 and July 1 but hardly likely and that would make no sense. The notion that the battery is actually "in action" also makes little sense, for the reasons I stated (as opposed to being "in the presence of the enemy"). Bottom line - I think the ball may have ended up "on the turf" in the "hand off" between O'Sullivan and Gardner.
 
Gardner in his Photographic Sketch Book identifies this group as Battery D of the 2nd U.S. Artillery. A print of this image in the National Archives (NARA - 533305) also confirms this.

View attachment 402730

I read that at Cedar Creek, Battery B was armed with 3" ordnance rifles. The guns in the photo seem larger than ordnance rifles.
https://civilwarintheeast.com/us-re...gulars/5th-united-states-artillery-battery-b/
If you read the above, the consensus is that it's not Battery B. And you're correct - those are not Ordnance Rifles.
 
Seems like I have read of having spotters in trees, but not sure in what connection. Maybe I'm confused about what part of the slope they're on. What I'm reading of Chickamauga, it sounded like they were just over the crest from the enemy, unseen, but still functioning.
There's a difference between the "military crest" and the "actual/topographical crest". But firing from "behind" a crest was not "indirect fire". The target could still be seen by the crew and range, etc estimated visually. The "forward spotter" concept is "indirect fire" - the gun crew cannot see the target. It's a concept that evolved over the latter part of the 19th century and the US was pretty late to the game. There wasn't much "indirect fire" in the ACW. The relatively few incidents were usually noted and the results were not that great - pretty much guesswork and usually fired at a stationary location (post/fort).
 
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