Annie De Pue, 11 Year Old Tennessee Drummer Er, Boy

Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

JPK Huson 1863

Brev. Brig. Gen'l
Forum Host
Joined
Feb 14, 2012
Messages
18,967
Location
Central Pennsylvania
glud top.jpg

glud bottom.jpg

California newspaper, 1925. Mrs. Annie De Pue Glud emerged from the Civil War closet where so many female soldiers remained behind frock coats. ' Tommy Hunley ', 11 years old that day in 1862 trailed off to war in her father's wake. One, more drummer boy.

glud1926  Casper_Star_Tribune_Tue__May_4__1926_.jpg

Veterans did not tend to tolerate frauds. That Annie Glud belonged to the GAR means Tommy Hunley saw war.


With thanks to @John Hartwell ( again ) for the ' referral '. A huge amount of ' female soldier ' accounts are dismissed as apocryphal or women looking for attention or heck, plain old made up. Like they were Bigfoot sightings. Number of reasons women did not come forward post war- being called a liar was high on that list.

May 4th, 1926, Casper Star Tribune.
glud pic Casper_Star_Tribune_Tue__May_4__1926_.jpg



WELL. Poking around in the story of 11 year old Tennessee drummer Tommy, the girl who followed her father to war, did not expect to find much. Found a LOT. First indication her story held water was she belonged to her local GAR. That's awfully significant. Ever read the wonderful, post-war running arguments carried on week after week in newspapers? Veterans yanked down pants and petticoats in a big hurry when it came to veracity. Century Magazine compiled quite a few into " Hearts Of Fire ", best, ever source for war stories. You slipped not, one artillery placement by the vets. Annie Glud may have been wealthy ( a gold mine discovering real estate agent by 1910 ), but you couldn't buy your way into acceptance by veterans.

Annie De Pue, not quite 10 as war split her state, watched brothers enlist in both armies. Transpires her father stayed with the Union, enlisted and took his daughter with him when marching off to war. Some babysitter huh? I can't find the family in Tennessee in 1860 but that could easily be due to ' De Pue ' being mangled on census records. It's certainly ' De Pue ' on her marriage record. She married Paul Glud, a Danish shipping mogul. May have met rubbing elbows with others in our select club of uber wealthy- she's attached to a gold discovery somewhere around 1897.

Like a lot of veterans, her self-told war story is devoid of frills.


glud news 1.jpg

Must discover why the Grant reference- could be a term of phrase only, could have been added as enticement - like the story of an 11 year girl drummer required embellishment. Only part which seems doubtful, cannot imagine Grant accepting a little girl's presence as drummer. Still looking for a longer version of Annie's time spent as Tommy.

glud news 2.jpg


Who knows why Annie's father took his daughter to war? Maybe her mother died and it seemed safer, bullets notwithstanding under his eye than it was exposed to 2 armies swarming their state. Still looking!

20yr75CL.jpg
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

John Hartwell

Major
Forum Host
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
8,218
Location
Central Massachusetts
I do not wish to disparage Mrs. Glud's claims, however, here is a woman writer for Oakland Magazine who in recent years wrote an article voicing skepticism about Annie Glud's war service:

http://www.oaklandmagazine.com/Oakland-Magazine/July-August-2012/The-Little-Drummer-Boy/
I have to agree with this. While I believe there are far more genuine stories of female soldiers than many would suspect, in the case of this particular lady there are just too many "red flags." The "nobody knows but papa and Genl. Grant" story is only the start of it. Also too many contradictions to her accounts of her family coming from her relatives.

I'm sure the guys at the G.A.R. enjoyed her stories, her spirit, ... and her drumming, whether they completely believed her or not. She certainly enjoyed the attention and the publicity -- there are lots of pictures of Annie Glud and her drum.

Bet she had the people of Oakland checking out every post-hole in town.
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
6,712
Location
Kingsport, Tennessee
View attachment 214053
View attachment 214050
California newspaper, 1925. Mrs. Annie De Pue Glud emerged from the Civil War closet where so many female soldiers remained behind frock coats. ' Tommy Hunley ', 11 years old that day in 1862 trailed off to war in her father's wake. One, more drummer boy.

View attachment 214054
Veterans did not tend to tolerate frauds. That Annie Glud belonged to the GAR means Tommy Hunley saw war.


With thanks to @John Hartwell ( again ) for the ' referral '. A huge amount of ' female soldier ' accounts are dismissed as apocryphal or women looking for attention or heck, plain old made up. Like they were Bigfoot sightings. Number of reasons women did not come forward post war- being called a liar was high on that list.

May 4th, 1926, Casper Star Tribune.
View attachment 214058


WELL. Poking around in the story of 11 year old Tennessee drummer Tommy, the girl who followed her father to war, did not expect to find much. Found a LOT. First indication her story held water was she belonged to her local GAR. That's awfully significant. Ever read the wonderful, post-war running arguments carried on week after week in newspapers? Veterans yanked down pants and petticoats in a big hurry when it came to veracity. Century Magazine compiled quite a few into " Hearts Of Fire ", best, ever source for war stories. You slipped not, one artillery placement by the vets. Annie Glud may have been wealthy ( a gold mine discovering real estate agent by 1910 ), but you couldn't buy your way into acceptance by veterans.

Annie De Pue, not quite 10 as war split her state, watched brothers enlist in both armies. Transpires her father stayed with the Union, enlisted and took his daughter with him when marching off to war. Some babysitter huh? I can't find the family in Tennessee in 1860 but that could easily be due to ' De Pue ' being mangled on census records. It's certainly ' De Pue ' on her marriage record. She married Paul Glud, a Danish shipping mogul. May have met rubbing elbows with others in our select club of uber wealthy- she's attached to a gold discovery somewhere around 1897.

Like a lot of veterans, her self-told war story is devoid of frills.


View attachment 214051
Must discover why the Grant reference- could be a term of phrase only, could have been added as enticement - like the story of an 11 year girl drummer required embellishment. Only part which seems doubtful, cannot imagine Grant accepting a little girl's presence as drummer. Still looking for a longer version of Annie's time spent as Tommy.

View attachment 214052

Who knows why Annie's father took his daughter to war? Maybe her mother died and it seemed safer, bullets notwithstanding under his eye than it was exposed to 2 armies swarming their state. Still looking!
For what it's worth, A Thomas Hundley enlisted & mustered into Company E 2nd TN Infantry (Union) on 10/1/1861, (probably in Kentucky). In the same Company & Regiment was a 25 year-old Rodney Hundley.

This was a east Tennessee unit. Several Depugh, Depue, & Depew, surnames in upper east Tennessee. To my knowledge, no Union Tennessee units served in the AOP and would have been at Gettysburg. All served in the western theater.

https://civilwartalk.com/threads/lilburn-depew-fought-on-both-sides.118149/
 

JPK Huson 1863

Brev. Brig. Gen'l
Forum Host
Joined
Feb 14, 2012
Messages
18,967
Location
Central Pennsylvania
For what it's worth, A Thomas Hundley enlisted & mustered into Company E 2nd TN Infantry (Union) on 10/1/1861, (probably in Kentucky). In the same Company & Regiment was a 25 year-old Rodney Hundley.

It's something, thanks very much! Who knows what embellishments were added later, perhaps she couldn't differentiate by the time her story made headlines.

I'm sure the guys at the G.A.R. enjoyed her stories, her spirit, ... and her drumming, whether they completely believed her or not. She certainly enjoyed the attention and the publicity -- there are lots of pictures of Annie Glud and her drum.

Do you think so? I don't know. This is just from having gotten a kick out of vets mailing replies to newspapers, arguing with each other but got the impression they were happy to not only disparage each other's faulty memories ( it's really, really entertaining ) but also show the door to anyone with questionable claims. Those guys were brutal, insisting on accuracy. You could see why- this was their war, their experiences, their club of men who had lived through something so awful it was blasphemy to get it wrong. Have an idea it wasn't just a bunch of old guys swapping stories, it was a kind of fierce pride in themselves and those who didn't come home.

I do not wish to disparage Mrs. Glud's claims, however, here is a woman writer for Oakland Magazine who in recent years wrote an article voicing skepticism about Annie Glud's war service:

Thanks for this! You can't kick dirt over facts, hoping no one will notice the ground has been disturbed, certainly. Who does know how unwieldy her story became through the years, like a Christmas tree you think is finished but keep adding ornaments at the top anyway until the whole thing falls over. It's very clear Annie had the odd kick in her gallop- eccentric may be a good term. The thing is, can that aspect of her personality be used as a kind of weapon to kinda prove she's making up the whole thing? That war is littered with delightfully, genuinely peculiar people and those just thought peculiar because they did not conform to social norms.

Having said that, admit to a strong partiality towards those whose gallop has an extra kick. If I'd spent my childhood meandering around a war, I'd be a little weird too.
 

byron ed

2nd Lieutenant
Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
2,770
Location
Midwest
There is a middle ground here, discernible in Annie claiming her father was a "scout" for the army.

It could be that neither she or her dad were actually enlisted,* but rather he was a contracted civilian scout. That would put Annie in the category of camp follower, on campaign with her dad. Since a kid has to do something in camp, parlaying as musician/drummer would be as good as anything, enabling fellowship with those closer to her in age, at the same time feeling useful.

That she learned the role of drummer boy isn't a question, but whether she was officially a drummer boy is. (btw, I doubt her "boy" ruse would have been all that convincing to those close to her who were in command on campaign. The higher the rank the less likely they would have officially "allowed" it -- certainly not Grant). If anything, perhaps they accepted her presence in camp as a "drummer boy" in the sense of a unit mascot, a wink and a nod from the camp commander.

However that in no way is to deny her real service. She likely was present at battles. Fellow soldiers after the war wouldn't have obsessed over her official status. If she was known to be a unit's "drummer boy" in the war it behooved that she could be a GAR camp's "drummer boy" after the war. The GAR was a private organization with independent private chapters, not a Government entity (for instance some GAR camps denied black membership, some didn't).

In any event I see no mention of Annie receiving her own Government pension, which would be a clue if someone wanted to chase down her enlisted rank as musician.


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
* Being disguised as a boy would definitely be an idea her single dad would have for making his daughter less vulnerable in camp when he couldn't be with her (Albert Cashier/Jenny Hodgers grew up dressed as a boy, her father's same strategy, which then enabled a smooth transition for her to enlist in the Army as a man. She did qualify for her own Government pension after the war).
 
Last edited:
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

mofederal

Captain
Joined
Jun 27, 2017
Messages
6,729
Location
Southeast Missouri
A mystery for sure, which may never be solved with any satisfaction. Name misspellings can be a major problem, mostly the government's idea of how your name should be spelled or written. They still do that today. The answer is in the records someplace.
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

Mrs. V

First Sergeant
Joined
May 5, 2017
Messages
1,644
Interesting! I have no doubt that she served, and well. It was insanely difficult to get a pension, as a woman, unless you had documents from commanders and other men in the unit. I also have no doubt that the story grew as it aged.

Working in schools I can tell you that sometimes you really can’t tell gender, unless you are looking at clothes, especially at the age of 10/11! And Victorians would never have infringed on anothers privacy..so a gender reveal would only happen by illness/injury or by bad luck!
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!

byron ed

2nd Lieutenant
Joined
Mar 22, 2017
Messages
2,770
Location
Midwest
...It was insanely difficult to get a pension, as a woman, unless you had documents
...like an enlistment, muster-in or muster-out document. So it's not so much about difficulty then, but rather impossibility. If a woman was never successful in legitimately obtaining such documents to begin with; then of course she was never legitimately a soldier (newspaper enhancements aside).

But that's the lesser part of her story.

This is not to question the woman's service or her being deserving of a pension, it's only to be realistic in doubting her official enlistment and rank. A tiny fraction of women successfully lasted the war with the rank of soldier. Most all of them were discovered and removed within days or weeks* The point is: It is any less moving or meaningful if she was bestowed the honorary title of "drummer boy" by her compatriots? She yet deserves all admiration.



- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
*I'm sorry that this runs counter to most educational "Civil War Days" events I've seen, many of which far outplay the women soldiers component in their zest to be inclusive of female students and teachers. Invariably they let it be supposed that most lasted some meaningful amount of time in the role.
 
Last edited:

Mrs. V

First Sergeant
Joined
May 5, 2017
Messages
1,644
...like an enlistment, muster-in or muster-out document. So it's not so much about difficulty then, but rather impossibility. If a woman was never successful in legitimately obtaining such documents to begin with; then of course she was never legitimately a soldier (newspaper enhancements aside).

But that's the lesser part of her story.

This is not to question the woman's service or her being deserving of a pension, it's only to be realistic in doubting her official enlistment and rank. A tiny fraction of women successfully lasted the war with the rank of soldier. Most all of them were discovered and removed within days or weeks* The point is: It is any less moving or meaningful if she was bestowed the honorary title of "drummer boy" by her compatriots? She yet deserves all admiration.



- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
*I'm sorry that this runs counter to most educational "Civil War Days" events I've seen, many of which far outplay the women soldiers component in their zest to be inclusive of female students and teachers. Invariably they let it be supposed that most lasted some meaningful amount of time in the role.
There were documented women who served, and were pensioned. Not all were discovered. There’s a really nice book called, “I’ll pass for your Comrade” it’s in my library, and I own a copy. I tell ya what, some of those gals made mighty handsome dudes.
 
Fewer ads. Lots of American Civil War content!
JOIN NOW: REGISTER HERE!
Top