The predicted outcome of resupplying Ft. Sumter

It's perfectly obvious which side was responsible for escalating the situation into a shooting war.


It most certainly is clear, very clear....................Ask Lincoln's cabinet.................


United States Secretary of State, William H. Seward:
“I reply, no. I would not initiate war to regain a useless and unnecessary position on the soil of the seceding States. I would not provoke war in any way now.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 192-201, Nicolay and Hay

United States Attorney General, Edward Bates:
“I am unwilling, "under all the circumstances," at this moment to do any act which may have the semblance before the world of beginning a civil war.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 217-220, Nicolay and Hay

United States Secretary of the Interior, Caleb B. Smith:
The commencement of a civil war would be a calamity greatly to be deplored and should be avoided if the just authority of the government may be maintained without it.” “it would not be wise under all the circumstances to attempt to provision Fort Sumter.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 210-214, Nicolay and Hay

United States Secretary of the Navy, Gideon Welles:
“By sending or attempting to send provisions into Sumter, will not war be precipitated?” “I am not prepared to advise a course that would provoke hostilities.” “I do not, therefore, under all the circumstances, think it wise to attempt to provision Fort Sumter.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 208-210, Nicolay and Hay

United States Secretary of War, Simon Cameron:
“The proposition presented by Mr. Fox, so sincerely entertained and ably advocated, would be entitled to my favorable consideration if, with all the lights before me, and in the face of so many distinguished military authorities on the other side, I did not believe the attempt to carry it into effect would initiate a bloody and protracted conflict.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 202-207, Nicolay and Hay

5 out of 7 of Lincoln’s own cabinet believed to attempt to resupply Fort Sumter would provoke a war.

BUT....................

I do understand your position and why you have to defend it.................

Respectfully,
William
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It most certainly is clear, very clear....................Ask Lincoln's cabinet.................


United States Secretary of State, William H. Seward:
“I reply, no. I would not initiate war to regain a useless and unnecessary position on the soil of the seceding States. I would not provoke war in any way now.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 192-201, Nicolay and Hay

United States Attorney General, Edward Bates:
“I am unwilling, "under all the circumstances," at this moment to do any act which may have the semblance before the world of beginning a civil war.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 217-220, Nicolay and Hay

United States Secretary of the Interior, Caleb B. Smith:
The commencement of a civil war would be a calamity greatly to be deplored and should be avoided if the just authority of the government may be maintained without it.” “it would not be wise under all the circumstances to attempt to provision Fort Sumter.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 210-214, Nicolay and Hay

United States Secretary of the Navy, Gideon Welles:
“By sending or attempting to send provisions into Sumter, will not war be precipitated?” “I am not prepared to advise a course that would provoke hostilities.” “I do not, therefore, under all the circumstances, think it wise to attempt to provision Fort Sumter.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 208-210, Nicolay and Hay

United States Secretary of War, Simon Cameron:
“The proposition presented by Mr. Fox, so sincerely entertained and ably advocated, would be entitled to my favorable consideration if, with all the lights before me, and in the face of so many distinguished military authorities on the other side, I did not believe the attempt to carry it into effect would initiate a bloody and protracted conflict.”
Source: Complete Works of Abraham Lincoln, Vol. 6, pp. 202-207, Nicolay and Hay

5 out of 7 of Lincoln’s own cabinet believed to attempt to resupply Fort Sumter would provoke a war.

BUT....................

I do understand your position and why you have to defend it.................

Respectfully,
William
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i get it, you believe lincoln should have listened to 'the voice of reason' - how about jeff davis?
 
I don't personally think anyone by this point believed a shooting war was avoidable. Both sides had staked their positions and were immovable on them. It was a matter of when, where, and how.
Fort Pickens almost became a flashpoint. If Fort Pickens had been given up then Maryland would have been plunged into a conflict between the Unionists and rebels in order to isolate DC or Missouri or KY or ......
 
Fort Pickens almost became a flashpoint. If Fort Pickens had been given up then Maryland would have been plunged into a conflict between the Unionists and rebels in order to isolate DC or Missouri or KY or ......
I think to your point, Lincoln certainly maneuvered Davis into shooting first, if for no other reason than he had to.
 
Link

In making up his mind, Lincoln had to consider, among other things, his own principles and ideals, the demands of his party and constituents, the situation in the upper South, the strength of the secessionist movement in the deep South, and the likely consequences of any decision on the future course of events.​
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By backing the Crittenden Compromise, Lincoln could help assure its adoption. Those who urged this course believed that Lincoln would thereby hearten unionist forces throughout the country, hold the loyalty of the upper South, and return the seceding states to the Union.​
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During a visit to Lincoln in Springfield, Illinois, in December 1860, and in editorials in his newspaper, Weed urged that Republicans offer concessions in light of the seriousness of the secession crisis and the increased likelihood of war.​
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To Chase, Lincoln's victory was a triumph for the Republican Party's principles, particularly that of restricting slavery within its present state limits. Not only were these principles morally correct, but their triumph in the presidential election wa s secured by "a fair and unquestionable majority." To abandon the party's platform would violate the ideal of majority rule and would be denounced by the people as a subversion of the electoral process. To make concessions, furthermore, would threaten, and perhaps even destroy the party as an institut ion. The party would also appear weak and vacillating to the South. This could even encourage further militancy and disunionist activity in that section​
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Greeley repudiated the idea of compromising with the South. The Crittenden plan, he argued, would only encourage the South to seek further extensions of slavery and would not save the Union. Instead, he recommended a slow, complicated process of peaceful separation, including for example, the calling of a constitutional convention. During this period, the South would cool off and realize the drawbacks of separation. In the meantime, it was essential for the North to avoid concessions or inflammatory actions. "They will be glad enough to come back very soon," he promised.​
 
I think to your point, Lincoln certainly maneuvered Davis into shooting first, if for no other reason than he had to.
I prefer to think that Lincoln gave the initiative to Davis simply because the one that starts the war is at a disadvantage, which history confirms as correct. Lincoln may have also pressured Davis to decide, but the decision was Davis'. Davis imaged himself as a war leader and IMHO that plus Davis' temperament made him see war as the only tool in his toolbox. As the war progressed, Davis' obsession with his self-image as a war leader doomed the CSA.
 
IMHO forts without a war to associate with are not much of an attraction.
Fort Jefferson is kinda' cool - massive coral reef just offshore and amazing bird life including two species of Boobies (that's right goodguy, boobies) and sooty terns and, as if that weren't enough, Dr Mudds's cell and a great little campground. All in a tropical setting.
 
OTOH we would be having a different conversation if the North had turned Lincoln accusing him of fumbling the ball and unnecessarily bringing on a war.

Both North and South could have maybe made better decisions but they did what they thought best at the time. Many times in history you play the hand you are dealt---they did and we are currently doing the same. If they had an idea of how bad it would get things could have been different. Only Sherman stated the truth and they called him mad.
 
Fort Jefferson is kinda' cool - massive coral reef just offshore and amazing bird life including two species of Boobies (that's right goodguy, boobies) and sooty terns and, as if that weren't enough, Dr Mudds's cell and a great little campground. All in a tropical setting.
I know of Bobbie birds, please be consistent with capitalization, however.
MaskedBoobyHospitalKey.jpg
 
I prefer to think that Lincoln gave the initiative to Davis simply because the one that starts the war is at a disadvantage, which history confirms as correct. Lincoln may have also pressured Davis to decide, but the decision was Davis'. Davis imaged himself as a war leader and IMHO that plus Davis' temperament made him see war as the only tool in his toolbox. As the war progressed, Davis' obsession with his self-image as a war leader doomed the CSA.
My thinking was and sorry for the hypothetical, if Lincoln orders the navy into the harbor to shell the shore batteries he received world condemnation for being a tyrant bringing a peaceful people under heel, probably loses the border states and risks instant recognition of the confederate government by London, and Paris. Maybe even northerners condemn over reaction.
 
The South did try peace. They were ignored by the Lincolnistas.

Funny way of showing such a desire, what with all those thefts and such prior to firing "peacefully" on Ft. Sumter.

But let's forget about all those actions (theft of money, payrolls, mints, ships, guns, arsenals, forts, etc.). Way too hard to explain away.
 
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