Sherman "There is a class of people ... "

I find that making any reference to Sherman and his thoughts, opinions, about the Indians gets a quick brush-off as being off topic. Just another instance of the hypocritical treasury of virtue.
When one applies equal examination of Southern treatment of Indians then maybe readers would take those posts more seriously...
 
Never heard about the Confederacy exterminating Indians. Maybe you can enlighten us?
Soooo Sherman exterminated Indians now? How did the whole trail of tears work out for the South? How many thousands of Indians lost their lives and yet we have people like you constantly denying that Southeners had any hand in what happened to native Americans, and worse then that you would use the handful of native Americans that supported the South as some sort of evidence that they were treated fairly.
 
Soooo Sherman exterminated Indians now? How did the whole trail of tears work out for the South? How many thousands of Indians lost their lives and yet we have people like you constantly denying that Southeners had any hand in what happened to native Americans, and worse then that you would use the handful of native Americans that supported the South as some sort of evidence that they were treated fairly.
Quit trying to confound the issue. You say there were no black confederates. So you separate black's from the Confederacy, but now want to lump all Southerners into the same boat? Explain to me where at any time members of the Confederacy advocated the extermination, or ever actually killed off Indians.
 
Quit trying to confound the issue. You say there were no black confederates. So you separate black's from the Confederacy, but now want to lump all Southerners into the same boat? Explain to me where at any time members of the Confederacy advocated the extermination, or ever actually killed off Indians.
I think you are attributing a "treasury of virtue" to the wrong side of the argument. Do you know where the Cherokee, Seminole, or any other tribe started out? Or better still who benefitted from their forced migration aka the trail of tears.

Slaveocracy as the cavaliers; that's funny. Yeah, no "treasury of virtue" there.
 
I think you are attributing a "treasury of virtue" to the wrong side of the argument. Do you know where the Cherokee, Seminole, or any other tribe started out? Or better still who benefitted from their forced migration aka the trail of tears.

Slaveocracy as the cavaliers; that's funny. Yeah, no "treasury of virtue" there.

The discussion is about Sherman, who was wearing a Federal Uniform, talking about exterminating people.

My reference to the Cavaliers is historical. My family, who were Southern slaveholders, from middle Tennessee, by way of North Carolina, by way of Virginia, by way of England, by way of Lancashire. They were THE cavaliers. The English Yeomen class. The one's who fought Cromwell. Capiche?

When Sherman said his famous line about exterminating or banishing a certain class of people (as far South as Tennessee) he was talking about my family. He wasn't talking about the Scots-Irish.
 
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It is interesting to note that what Sherman was suggesting is exactly what we did in WWII. Tens of thousands of German, Japanese, and even allied civilians were indiscriminately killed by bombing raids. The result : VICTORY the desired end result of any war. That the same result was had for the Union in the Civil War without exposing the civilian populations to such suffering attests to good strategy, leadership, and execution of the war plan.
 
The discussion is about Sherman, who was wearing a Federal Uniform, talking about exterminating people.

My reference to the Cavaliers is historical. My family, who were Southern slaveholders, from middle Tennessee, by way of North Carolina, by way of Virginia, by way of England, by way of Lancashire. They were THE cavaliers. The English Yeomen class. The one's who fought Cromwell. Capiche?

When Sherman said his famous line about exterminating or banishing a certain class of people (as far South as Tennessee) he was talking about my family. He wasn't talking about the Scots-Irish.
By your own account and attitude displayed here Sherman was right.

Your family has lived on land taken from the Indians. Yet you bemoan that as though your family had no benefit from it.

Sherman was a soldier & he did what soldiers do. He followed orders in destroying enemies of his country. That he won is why he is despised.
 
By your own account and attitude displayed here Sherman was right.

Your family has lived on land taken from the Indians. Yet you bemoan that as though your family had no benefit from it.

Sherman was a soldier & he did what soldiers do. He followed orders in destroying enemies of his country. That he won is why he is despised.

A slight addendum: he was despised not by the people he faced but, rather, by their descendents who bought into the myth of the man. He was given almost a hero's welcome when he returned to the South after the war.

R
 
What ever your opinoin of WTS the hard truth is that he did what he needed to do to advance his cause and the eventual Union Victory.......and he did it well. the myth of Sherman burning every thing in Gawga is that a myth ,yes he did lay waste to alot but in his view and probably fact thats what was needed to win.Whatever else you say about Cump he was a fighter.
 
A slight addendum: he was despised not by the people he faced but, rather, by their descendents who bought into the myth of the man. He was given almost a hero's welcome when he returned to the South after the war.

R

Dude, you should know by now that NOTHING the real confederates said or did can be trusted.

:giggle:
 
The discussion is about Sherman, who was wearing a Federal Uniform, talking about exterminating people.

My reference to the Cavaliers is historical. My family, who were Southern slaveholders, from middle Tennessee, by way of North Carolina, by way of Virginia, by way of England, by way of Lancashire. They were THE cavaliers. The English Yeomen class. The one's who fought Cromwell. Capiche?

When Sherman said his famous line about exterminating or banishing a certain class of people (as far South as Tennessee) he was talking about my family. He wasn't talking about the Scots-Irish.
Well he must have missed some......Two out of three?
 
A slight addendum: he was despised not by the people he faced but, rather, by their descendents who bought into the myth of the man. He was given almost a hero's welcome when he returned to the South after the war.

R
Now now don't let historical events get in the way of good anti-Sherman rants...
 
It is interesting to note that what Sherman was suggesting is exactly what we did in WWII. Tens of thousands of German, Japanese, and even allied civilians were indiscriminately killed by bombing raids. The result : VICTORY the desired end result of any war. That the same result was had for the Union in the Civil War without exposing the civilian populations to such suffering attests to good strategy, leadership, and execution of the war plan.

Indiscriminately? In many cases particularly, but not solely, with the RAF effort the death of the civilian population was the desired effect.

"Even when fully justified, war is a dirty business which can foul those who set out with pure hearts and noble intentions..... it turns victory into an absolute desideratum...." Norman Davies, No simple Victory. World War II in Europe 1939-1945
 
Gen. Sherman understood that this war was different from other wars-and had to be fought differently for that reason. He recognized that a "class of people" were the prime movers to the war's start. Their means of political influence and source of income was based on slavery. Eliminate the source of that influence and income means ending the war with victory. Until that "class of people" suffered, the war would continue. He did the somewhat unconventional thing in terms of military tactics, cutting off his army from its supply source, living off of the land and going through Georgia, then making a left turn at Savannah and going north after a brief stop in Savannah.

The fact that the "class of people" were Southern civilians? Oh well, they chose to inaugurate war as their solution by electing Jefferson Davis as president, electing a congress, proclaiming secession, firing on Fort Sumter, confiscating Federal property-in some cases even before firing on Sumter-and had to pay a price for what they started. Sherman did what he felt he had to do, based on President Lincoln's and the Congress's political direction and the orders given to him by Grant.
 
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