M1855 Harpers Ferry with "s" barrel band?

Powelltc1

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Good evening! I have been trying to figure something out with a gun I recently bought and can't figure it out. I thought if anyone would know it would be someone on this forum. I appreciate any help you can give me!

I have a type II M1855 Harpers Ferry rifle dated 1859. It's all iron, so late 1859 make...the shorter two band rifle. The gun is in great condition and all original except...the front barrrel band is troubling me. It is marked "S" while the rear one is the standard "U." I have never heard about or seen an "S"...has anyone else? The metal on the band does appear to be slightly different than all of the other on the gun, but certainly doesn't look like it was recently made.

Just as an aside for those that pay attention to this stuff, the gun has a rack mark stamped on it and it looks like a pronounced "T" is the wood of the base of the patch box on the inside. Thanks for any help you can give me!
 
As you know, you have a Harper's Ferry Model 1855 Rifle. Look at the rear barrel band, it has no shoulder where stock and barrel join. The upper band has a shoulder, or "indent" in the surface. That band is from a Rifle Musket. I have no idea why it has an "S" instead of a "U", unless the "U" is on the other side of the band. Original 1855 Rifle upper bands are like looking for Hen's Teeth!
J.
 
Thanks J! I hadn't even noticed the difference, but you are right. No "U" marked on the other side, and the "S" is stamped straight up and down as you look at the gun as opposed to the "U" being stamped on its side with the "U" pointing to the retaining clip. It is definitely weird! I appreciate you responding.
 
Nice piece. I will look in my Harpers Ferry book when I get back to the house, but from what I remember the band with the S in the early production designated it as the swivel sling band before the swivel was added. I will double check it as my memory aint was it used to be.
 
UCV...that would mean an awful lot to me if you would take the time to check it out. Thank you in advance!
 
IIRC, many of the weapons that came out of the Harper's Ferry arsenal where "parts" guns. The '42 .69 cal. smoothbore Springfield model my brother has that was made there (stamped Harpers Ferry 1852 on the lock) has a barrel marked 1851.
 
JPChurch...agree with you100%. I don't think this one is though...that's what's so weird about it. The lockplate is dated 1859, and so is the barrel. Also, all of the furniture matches and is the same patina. The M1855 Harpers Ferry rifles in early 1859 had a brass nose cap, while the later ones that year went to all iron. It also has a rack number of "B22" making me wonder if this gun was sitting in the arsenal at Harpers Ferry or Washington and that's where it got marked...I don't know. I wish I did!
 
There was a guy that was in our N-SSA musket/carbine Team, 7th Regt VA Vols., Potomac Region back in the day (late 1980's) that wrote and published quite a few books regarding CW weapons. He also was a contributing editor to the "American Rifleman" NRA magazine for years...many of his articles appeared once in a while. His name was John D. MacAauly. Not sure if I spelled his last name right. I'm not sure if he's still alive as to this day. That guy would be able to tell you all about what you have. There is a curator at the Harper's Ferry National Park that is pretty knowledgeable about weapons produced there over the years when the arsenal was in full production swing. Well, there was the last time I was there (back in in like '08). They have a wonderful collection of weapons on display produced there. Harper's Ferry is a great place to visit if you've never been there. I would suggest you go and see the place since you have such a wonderful weapon that came from there...Hopefully the weapons curator that's on duty now can help you.....
 
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Thanks JP...that was on my list of things to try to do this summer, but I never thought about asking them about it. I appreciate the suggestion. I was there a long time ago when I was a kid, before I really got into the CW. So much history there, and it is drop dead gorgeous to boot. Thanks for the suggestion!
 
may sound like a stupid question, but what is that small compoartment in the buttstock used for? storing caps doesn't make sense in my view
Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but they are storage compartments used to store patches. The Baker Rifles the British used in the Napoleonic Wars had these, so the ball would fit snug in the barrel.
 
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Thanks JP...that was on my list of things to try to do this summer, but I never thought about asking them about it. I appreciate the suggestion. I was there a long time ago when I was a kid, before I really got into the CW. So much history there, and it is drop dead gorgeous to boot. Thanks for the suggestion!
Do it!!! Spend an entire day there; then you could visit Charlestown VW and see the courthouse that John Brown was tried for treason in, or venture to the Antietam Battlefield, or do all 3!!! Parts of the Harper's Ferry town were used for the filming of the battle scenes of Fredericksburg City in the "G's and G's" movie.
 
Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but they are storage compartments used to store patches. The Baker Rifles the British used in the Napoleonic Wars had these, so the ball would fit snug in the barrel.
Yes, it's called a patchbox. According to Claud E Fuller's Rifled Musket (1959) the US 1861 proto-type had a round patchbox, but it was done away with as a cost saving measure and to speed manufacture.
 
The "Patch Box" on the M-1841 Rifle, M-1855 Rifle, and M-1863 Remington Rifle, each held a spare nipple. Although, both types of the brass bound H.F. 1855 Rifle patch boxes also held a hooded globe, set screw mounted, front sight attachment with cross-hairs for "Sharp Shooting" when needed.
J.
 
The "Patch Box" on the M-1841 Rifle, M-1855 Rifle, and M-1863 Remington Rifle, each held a spare nipple. Although, both types of the brass bound H.F. 1855 Rifle patch boxes also held a hooded globe, set screw mounted, front sight attachment with cross-hairs for "Sharp Shooting" when needed.
J.
I remember my Italian repro Remington that I used to shoot with during the N-SSA days had a nipple in the patch box, same with the repro Mississippi Rifle one of my team mates used.
 
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