Culp's Hill. BGA 150th Gettysburg Reenactment

Waterloo50

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I haven't done any re-enactment 'Yet' so I was looking for something that would give me an idea of what its like to be a re-enactor, I understand that there is more to re-enacting than the battles but having said that, this battle at Culp's Hill looks fantastic. For me personally, the only thing that detracts from the authenticity is the way in which they advance up the hill, it looks more like a leisurely stroll through the woods or have I have been watching too many war movies? At the beginning of the clip, the men look a little confused about what is supposed to be happening, a few shots are fired and then the order to advance is given, its at this point that the re-enactors get their act together and advance as one. Once the men reach their position, they are given a fire at will order and they let rip with everything they have, it was difficult to see what they were shooting at because the smoke was starting to hang in the trees, they then advance, but again confusion seems to take hold, I can't hear anyone taking command or giving any orders. I am in no way criticising the re-enactors, I would just like to know if the initial confusion of an engagement is normal, I guess that it must be difficult to organise so many re-enactors and keep everyone up to date on what they should be doing.
I'm quite interested to know how battles/skirmishes are organised, are re-enactors expected to know how a battle unfolds, should they have a good knowledge of the history that they will re-enact or is there normally a briefing prior to the battle? In all, I thought these re-enactors were superb. I found this short vid and it offers a first person point of view of a battle. I thought others may enjoy it.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOoWYlAs_ug
 
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Thank you for posting; it was an interesting watch.

You have noticed a few unfortunate problems with many reenactors. The drill is almost non-existent even school of the soldier. This is not entirely attributable to the men as many officers don't know the manuals very well themselves and tend to make mistakes such as ordering to fix bayonets at when the men are at the right shoulder shift (neglecting to bring arms to the shoulder first). There always seems to be confusion early on in reenactment battles because often the officers aren't sufficiently organized. Even if they know their orders if another company makes the wrong move it can confuse everyone. Of course there was confusion back then as well, but the men generally knew to stay in their ranks without going automatically to in place rest just because no one happens to be telling them to do something. Nobody seems to be in command of the company being filmed until about 2:00- maybe the officer went off to see what they were supposed to be doing? Then the move into the woods and become a mob. Rough terrain does play H--l with lines, but the extent shown here is ridiculous.

The men portrayed don't bother to even act as though they're being shot at, which is another common problem that stems (in my experience) from the same lack of drill- the men are more actively thinking about how to load and fire rather than being focused on what's going on around them.

I'm not trying to be rude here or criticize all reenactors. I have seen some officers and units that really have it down. I'm rather new to reenacting myself and perhaps don't have the most thorough perspective. I'm not that great at drill and unfit to command. It's just it seems things could be done better is all.
 
Thank you for posting; it was an interesting watch.

You have noticed a few unfortunate problems with many reenactors. The drill is almost non-existent even school of the soldier. This is not entirely attributable to the men as many officers don't know the manuals very well themselves and tend to make mistakes such as ordering to fix bayonets at when the men are at the right shoulder shift (neglecting to bring arms to the shoulder first). There always seems to be confusion early on in reenactment battles because often the officers aren't sufficiently organized. Even if they know their orders if another company makes the wrong move it can confuse everyone. Of course there was confusion back then as well, but the men generally knew to stay in their ranks without going automatically to in place rest just because no one happens to be telling them to do something. Nobody seems to be in command of the company being filmed until about 2:00- maybe the officer went off to see what they were supposed to be doing? Then the move into the woods and become a mob. Rough terrain does play H--l with lines, but the extent shown here is ridiculous.

The men portrayed don't bother to even act as though they're being shot at, which is another common problem that stems (in my experience) from the same lack of drill- the men are more actively thinking about how to load and fire rather than being focused on what's going on around them.

I'm not trying to be rude here or criticize all reenactors. I have seen some officers and units that really have it down. I'm rather new to reenacting myself and perhaps don't have the most thorough perspective. I'm not that great at drill and unfit to command. It's just it seems things could be done better is all.

That was one of the things that I noticed, the men appeared to be working hard to load and fire, it would be more convincing if they were able to load and fire more naturally, like it was second nature which I suppose it should be, even a relatively new re-enactor would gain a great deal from spending time getting to know his weapon., I could see that they were enjoying themselves and that's a big part of re-enacting but for me they just didn't move like an experienced unit, there seemed to be some awkwardness about the whole thing. I even spotted one officer using his sword as a walking stick to get himself up the hill. Also at one point, an officer on horseback heads to the edge of the woods, I guess he was taking a look to see if he could spot the enemy, I even heard one person say 'I bet they aren't even in there'.
One other question that I have, is, was it normal practice during the CW for the second rank in a firing line to fire their weapon over the shoulder and next to the head of the man in front, British tactics would be for the front rank to kneel and reload, whilst the second rank fired, either that or the second rank would step forward through the front rank to fire.
 
I haven't done any re-enactment 'Yet' so I was looking for something that would give me an idea of what its like to be a re-enactor, I understand that there is more to re-enacting than the battles but having said that, this battle at Culp's Hill looks fantastic. For me personally, the only thing that detracts from the authenticity is the way in which they advance up the hill, it looks more like a leisurely stroll through the woods or have I have been watching too many war movies? At the beginning of the clip, the men look a little confused about what is supposed to be happening, a few shots are fired and then the order to advance is given, its at this point that the re-enactors get their act together and advance as one. Once the men reach their position, they are given a fire at will order and they let rip with everything they have, it was difficult to see what they were shooting at because the smoke was starting to hang in the trees, they then advance, but again confusion seems to take hold, I can't hear anyone taking command or giving any orders. I am in no way criticising the re-enactors, I would just like to know if the initial confusion of an engagement is normal, I guess that it must be difficult to organise so many re-enactors and keep everyone up to date on what they should be doing.
I'm quite interested to know how battles/skirmishes are organised, are re-enactors expected to know how a battle unfolds, should they have a good knowledge of the history that they will re-enact or is there normally a briefing prior to the battle? In all, I thought these re-enactors were superb. I found this short vid and it offers a first person point of view of a battle. I thought others may enjoy it.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOoWYlAs_ug
In a video lasting 8.5 minutes we heard & saw perhaps many thousands of rounds fired. We did not see a single soul hurt, wounded, or killed until the last 30 seconds, & then only a few. How hard can it be to determine what your casualty rate will be BEFORE the charge, & take steps to insure those casualties take place at a logical & reasonable rate. In this video, as in many reenactments I have seen & participated, they seemed bullet proof.
 
At the BGA-Gettysburg, this was a side scenario representing the fight on Culps Hill... several completely different evolutions were conducted to allow more troops to participate in it that wanted too. Not sure which one this video was taken of. One was done earlier one day... the other late in the eve that ran overnight slept on arms... sporadic action during the night... till the next dawn... then resumed again.. This was not a spectatored action. It rained much of the event... cant really see it as good in the video but much of the hill was rather steep... and attempting to gain footing through the underbrush and walking uphill over wet leaf covered slick rocks was a bit precarious at best.... So is why you see guys moving forward a bit slow and cautiously. Federals were well concealed just over the crest of the hill, sitting silently in wait..... They were not visible while on the initial advance.... One end of the line made contact before the other... So you can hear firing... but the troops in the foreground hadn't yet... when they first engaged it was still at a good distance... The evolution at this point in time was not a general attack... "we have reports there are federals up there somewhere... take a couple companies up to determine where they are and check their possible strength"... These troops shown were quickly pushed back.... The general assault across the line came later... repeatedly... and much more intense... and hoards of casualties.... till darkness prevented any further feasible action... Slept on arms in line of battle the rest of the night in the woods at the base of the hill... which heavy rains joined us throughout the long night...

Not all reenactors nor reenactor groups are created equal... nor are battle events either. Different organizing and hosting groups use different event models.... Some are more of a themed camping cowboy style powder burning carnival shoot'em ups.... Others adhere more to the historical narrative and replication of unit portrayals... and the movements and actions that actually took place... Because we may find photos or video clips of a given event... doesn't mean that it is a good representation of all reenactors or reenactment events.....

In most cases with a scripted battle scenario... command officers from both sides are taken on a "walk-through" in advance... with scripts in hand... to familiarize with the terrain... positions... and movements... So they will know where to be and when the need to be there.... Guys in the ranks may be familiar or even well versed in the actions of a given battle... however are normally not included in these scenario familiarizations.... Actually most prefer to not know in advance what is going to specifically happen that day... let the events play out... follow the commands and orders of the officers... who do know.... some degree of confusion within the ranks is normal... both then and now.... Most like this because it adds to the experience.... It has also become common practice to implant an event command staff member that tags along with each respective Brigade or Battalion on the field... whom has direct communication with the command staffs to better relay and orchestrate the scripted movements upon the field... This is also done for safety, if someone accidently is injured... immediate notification is available to quickly address and respond.... It also helps prevent the possible wayward officer that thinks its ok to break the scenario so he can play some free lancing heroics on his own accord..... This issue habitually had been a frequent problem with some groups in past decades at lessor quality events...

Non-scripted tactical scenarios are something different.... These are commonly not spectatored... and give some degree of leeway that command can act and react upon given events being played out before them... not attempting to replicate a given historical action per-se... A war game style of sorts..... Many larger and some smaller battle events include at least one of these evolutions so the guys can use their tactical knowledge.

I frequently hear complaints from pards in other units.... tired of the same-o, same-o events.... everybody just stands there blasting powder... no one ever takes hits..... Yet year after year after year they only go back to the same 4 or 5 annual funnel cake carnival events... yet somehow expect something different or more interesting out of them.... There are other better events out there.... but seems difficult to get them to think... or try anything out of the box and their umbrella groups comfort zone... to see that there are indeed better quality events existing out there... that do lots of other more interesting and authentic stuff....
 
Much as already mentioned above this Culp's Hill battle at BGA Gettysburg was a side event for the participants primarily and not a spectator event. There were a few spectators there that had wandered into the Federal camp just by happenstance and enjoyed the ensuing event. But for the most part this battle was for us. I was in the Federal ranks on top of the hill for this scenario.

With reenacting in general for these large events there is good and bad as with anything. But the reality is the choppy movements are a by product you won't really be able to get away from. First off nearly all of these guys are civilians and not professional military so they are not going to move cohesively. Their understanding of the "school of the soldier" is going to be well versed to non-existent and everything in between. Secondly a lot of these units get thrown together at these events and have never drilled together before so its hard to present a full military bearing with one to two hours of real drill time as a unit. The other thing is a lot of these guys traveled long distances to be at this event. If a guy saved his money for two years, begged and pleaded with his company to have the week off and ensured his wife that everything she could think of on her "honey do" list would be done when he got back just so he could go is going to take a hit in the first 5 minutes of the battle for authenticity sake is probably not going to happen. I'm not trying to be a smart-aleck its just the truth.

For the first days battle the unit I was in portrayed the 24th Michigan. They gave us "fate cards" or letters from home explaining who we were and what happened to us. Each of us was assigned the role of an actual soldier from the Company and regiment of the 24th Michigan. My fate/the fate of the soldier I portrayed got shot in the left leg on the first day. Now they didn't say when or where I had to take this hit so it was up to me on that point. On the day of the battle which was a full spectator event our company was crunched into the end of the line right next to the crowd. Our company was blazing away with a Confederate unit maybe 50-60 yards away. Obviously at this range men on both sides should have been dropping like crazy as its practically point blank range. Well of course that didn't happen exactly. Several of the guys in my company did take their hit at this point to give the crowd some idea of what it would have looked like though including myself. The battle scenario continued on for a couple more hours and I was out literally 20 minutes in to it. Some of the guys hobbled off the field wounded and than when they were out of sight ran to rejoin our unit. I decided not to do this as it was very warm and my unit was a considerable distance from where I was at that point. Some guys stayed right where they were "dead on the field" so bully for them.

In speaking and over hearing many "of the boys" talking about the Culp's Hill battle that night and some time afterward many said that was one of the best scenarios they had ever been in. Some of these guys had twenty years of reenacting/living history under their belts too. I thought it was a dandy event myself. Sure there were short comings but for the most part the energy of the scenario felt good. The confusion of being called to arms right when we were getting our dinner, falling into line not knowing what was really happening and than a full blown battle exploding was a great spontaneous feeling. The shooting from dusk all the way into the darkness and the smoke hanging in amongs the trees was an amazing sight. When the shooting died down you could not quite see but hear and vaguely make out hundreds of wounded moving around and trying to crawl back to their lines. Many screaming for mercy, water and death. We posted pickets and tried to go back and eat our dinner which the critters had been helping themselves to in the meantime. I decided to just eat some hardtack and have a smoke than the rain came. Yeah this was living history and it felt pretty real at that moment.
 
Non-scripted tactical scenarios are something different.... These are commonly not spectatored... and give some degree of leeway that command can act and react upon given events being played out before them... not attempting to replicate a given historical action per-se... A war game style of sorts..... Many larger and some smaller battle events include at least one of these evolutions so the guys can use their tactical knowledge.

I bet non scripted events are great fun, I haven't done any re-enacting although I did come close. When I was in the army (Height of the Cold War) I was given an AK47 and a green boiler suit with red flashes on the collar, I was told that I would be going to a place called Nesscliffe, its an infantry training ground. Our newly formed small Russian section had to protect a few Russian 'Inflatable' tanks, we were told that we were to expect an attack from the Royal Green Jackets. I will never forget how badly wrong it went for us.

It was getting dark and we had neither seen or heard any enemy movements, (The British Army always stand too at first and Last Light) we, the 'Russians' decided to forget that little rule, the thing is, us Brits always believed that if the Russians did attack, it would be under cover of darkness. For our little skirmish, we were the Russians, so we decided to just play it cool, no laying about in firing positions for us, it was far to cold and icy. Anyhow, I decided that I needed to take a leak, so I headed over to the tree line. Whilst I'm standing there minding my own business, I couldn't help but notice that one of the trees looked slightly different, then I noticed a pair of eyes and then another and so on staring at me. Rather than give the game away or let them know that I had seen them, I slowly turned and picked up my rifle, I casually headed back to the tanks and my section, my intention was to notify the section that I had urinated on a couple of Green Jackets and that it would probably be best if we ran away, but that is when all hell broke loose. There was an entire Infantry platoon hidden just where I had decided to answer the call of nature.

It didn't bother me that our small section and our tanks was wiped out, and I could live with the bruises and cuts but, it really bothered me that I had stood there in front of an entire platoon of the Queens finest with tackle out. The shame of it all.:redface:

I can imagine that there are hundreds of stories out there where people have accidently found themselves facing the enemy when they least expected it, its normally the way of things. I'm reminded of the time (1879) when a British officer looked over the crest of a hill and down into the valley below, to his complete horror, he had discovered 20,000 hidden Zulu warriors they were waiting to attack the British main force, Awkward. At least he wasn't stood there exposing himself.

Edit: I forgot to mention that they took my AK47, I was in a world of hurt after that.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRZ7OkYBV0hDusvrH0S-NHGT_IvXcjWrtXWe2KBgUCgCelj_dOPig.jpg
 
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I was with the Confederates at this event, though as part of the film crew, not as as a reenactor. Culp's Hill felt more realistic than any other reenactment I've been to, and I've heard that from a lot of others, as some have said here. It was quite an experience to run through the smoky woods and come upon the Federal lines, and to see the musket flashes stand out vividly against the twilight and smoke.

Here's a video that we put together that shows more of the reenactment:

 
I was with the Confederates at this event, though as part of the film crew, not as as a reenactor. Culp's Hill felt more realistic than any other reenactment I've been to, and I've heard that from a lot of others, as some have said here. It was quite an experience to run through the smoky woods and come upon the Federal lines, and to see the musket flashes stand out vividly against the twilight and smoke.

Here's a video that we put together that shows more of the reenactment:


That's was great, I really enjoyed that, It helps to look at the battle from a different perspective, that was much better than a first person point of view. Thanks for sharing.:thumbsup:
 
One other question that I have, is, was it normal practice during the CW for the second rank in a firing line to fire their weapon over the shoulder and next to the head of the man in front, British tactics would be for the front rank to kneel and reload, whilst the second rank fired, either that or the second rank would step forward through the front rank to fire.
Yes the acw armies used translated french books and this was the way they did things.
So did the danish, Austrain, and danish armies. (when i close order)
Iam also pretty sure that the british army did the exact same thing when in close order.
(you use kneeling when in square and in open order)

There is no good reason for the first rank to kneel. It makes the loading slower when armed with a muzzleloaded musket and you don't make the unit a smaller target.
In the clip posted by Joshua Horn we see a union units with both ranks kneeling. That makes sense because it makes the unit a much smaller target.

The british did not have the rear rank step forward when in close order. It would be slow and clumsy and likely make a mess of your formation. And there is no advantage in doing so. (In open order is was used, just like everyone else did)


By the 1870 with the change to breach loaded rifles things did change.
(similar the prussian did thins differently from 1861 because of their breach loaded rifles)
 
Yes the acw armies used translated french books and this was the way they did things.
So did the danish, Austrain and danish armies. (when i close order)
Iam also pretty sure that the british army did the exact same thing when in close order.
(you use kneeling when in square and in open order)

There is no good reason for the first rank to kneel. It makes the loading slower when armed with a muzzlelaoded musket and you don't make the unit a smaller target.
The british did not have the rear rank step forward when in close order. It would be slow and clumsy and likely make a mess of your formation. And there is no advantage in doing so. (In open order is was used, just like everyone else did)


By the 1870 with the change to breachloaded rifles things did change.
Thank you, I wasn't sure, I understand that with the introduction of Breech loading things changed, I recall the movie Zulu where the tactics that I described were used. I have also read accounts of some Infantry units during the Napoleonic war moving forward by interchanging front and rear rank but it was normally used to advance the firing line. It was however quite rare.
 
The main issue is that you are mixing open order or skirmish line when there is a bit of room between each man,
with close order when the men are standing shoulder to shoulder in two ranks.

All european style infantry used both formations. (by 1860ties)

In open order you use cover and fire and movement is used. and it was normal for the rear man to advance past the front man.
Less casualties at the cost of less firepower.
Was used for screening own troops and disrupting the enemy formations. And it was used for scouting.
Would not be able to stop an enemy in close order.

In close order you fight standing in two ranks.
More firepower at the cost of more casualties.
Was used for the main fighting.

What we see in Zulu is a open order drill. And should not be compared to acw soldiers in close order.

By the late acw we do see units experimenting with a more open line of battle.
In both danish and Prussians armies a very thick skirmish line was the normal formation for combat.
 
The main issue is that you are mixing open order or skirmish line when there is a bit of room between each man,
with close order when the men are standing shoulder to shoulder in two ranks.

All european style infantry used both formations. (by 1860ties)

In open order you use cover and fire and movement is used. and it was normal for the rear man to advance past the front man.
Less casualties at the cost of less firepower.
Was used for screening own troops and disrupting the enemy formations. And it was used for scouting.
Would not be able to stop an enemy in close order.

In close order you fight standing in two ranks.


What we see in Zulu is a open order drill. And should not be compared to acw soldiers in close order.


By the late acw we do see units experimenting with a more open line of battle.
In both danish and Prussians armies a very thick skirmish line was the normal formation for combat.
Again, thank you, The skirmish line was what I was thinking of, I made the assumption that the two ranks in the Culp's Hill battle were advancing, I see now that it was a case of drawing up the firing line in close order and both front and rear ranks shooting at the same time. :thumbsup:
 
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