1810 dated contract flintlock; opinions, please

Banjo Pete

Private
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Nov 14, 2014
Hello all,

This item is currently listed on everyone's favorite online firearms auction site. The seller noted that the reserve is $800, and I am interested.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=506512323

Two questions for those in the know:

Does this appear to be a re-re-conversion from flint to percussion and back again? Seller is quite upfront about the possibility.

Is a 40 inch barrel correct for such an arm or has it been shortened? Something looks funky up front.

Many Thanks.

Yours &c.
Banjo Pete
 
The way the description is worded is the dealer's way of telling you it IS a reconversion back to flint. The pan should be a faceted iron pan, not a round-faced brass pan.
Correction: The round faced, non-angled, brass pan is correct! Thanks to Garrett who posted the correct information below.
J.
 
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The way the description is worded is the dealer's way of telling you it IS a reconversion back to flint. The pan should be a faceted iron pan, not a round-faced brass pan.
J.
Actually the Pomeroy SNY contract muskets should have brass pans. These Pomeroy arms are very similar to those produced by Whitney, what is generally referred to as the Whitney M1812, but is in fact very similar to the Whitney M1798 contract muskets which also have brass pans.
The barrel has probably been shortened a bit. These should be about 42 inches, give or take 1/4 of an inch. I can double check with my copy of American Military Shoulder Arms, Vol.2 this evening if you like.

It looks like a reconversion from a drum type percussion alteration to me. The vent's edges as too sharp for it to have seen use consistent with the rest of the gun, and there looks to be a slight indication of a vent liner.

Cheers,
Garrett
 
Actually the Pomeroy SNY contract muskets should have brass pans. These Pomeroy arms are very similar to those produced by Whitney, what is generally referred to as the Whitney M1812, but is in fact very similar to the Whitney M1798 contract muskets which also have brass pans.
The barrel has probably been shortened a bit. These should be about 42 inches, give or take 1/4 of an inch. I can double check with my copy of American Military Shoulder Arms, Vol.2 this evening if you like.

It looks like a reconversion from a drum type percussion alteration to me. The vent's edges as too sharp for it to have seen use consistent with the rest of the gun, and there looks to be a slight indication of a vent liner.

Cheers,
Garrett
Do you know the extent that the Pomeroy conversions where used during the CW?
 
Well if muskets were Federally owned, anything pre-1812 would have been sold off long before the war. Since this piece is a State owned musket it is possible that it could have been issued. However, since it was in all likelihood a drum alteration to percussion, it was probably sold by the State of New York before hostilities.

Generally speaking Northern/Federal alterations are either cone-in-barrel (Belgian), or patent breech. There are some state altered arms floating around, I believe Ohio had some muskets and M1817 common rifles altered via the drum method in Cincinnati, but typically drum altered arms are ID'd as CS or civilian alterations.

If you are looking for a good representative pre-war arm, I would suggest a M1816. Percussion altered variants can be obtained pretty reasonably.

Attached is a drum conversion of a SNY contract Smith Cogswell M1808 with an unusual striker-in-cock alteration.
DSCN2464.JPG
 
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