Another NC Howdy

[samgrant]

Originally Posted by ole

Somewhere in the archives is a discussion on that particular quote. If you care enough to do quite a bit of research, it's well worth looking into. I haven't mastered the search function well enough to help you find it, but I do recall that it was Hanny who insisted it was a valid quote because it was listed in the Oxford Book of Quotations. Try searching the member list, find all posts by Hanny, and riffle through the hits.
Ole

Ole, that topic has been debated (and the quote debunked) on several occasions over the years in several different threads (search 'slavery' grant' 'sword').

It is summed up most succinctly, I believe, in a thread titled "Grant, Slavery and Cyber Pitfalls" by Tulip.

http://civilwartalk.com/forums/civil-war-history-secession-politics/19396-grant-slavery-cyber-pitfalls.html


I also had emailed a question about the quote to John Y. Simon (editor of the 26 volume "Papers of Ulysses S. Grant")
who replied:

"The statement attributed to Grant has floated about on the
internet for years, repeated often enough that some have thought it
authentic. It is not."

[partssman]

Originally Posted by suwannee

Nice to meet you Partssman.

The pleasure is mine suannee.

Ole I never doubted your honesty for a minute Sir.

suannee, I'm working on some research when I have time comparing Quantrill and Sherman tatics.It's gonna take some time but will be a good read I hope when it's finished.

[unionblue]

suwannee,

The only mistake the South made was summed up in a confirmed quote by General Grant on General Lee's surrender at Appomattox.

"I felt anything rather than rejoicing at the downfall of a foe who had fought so long and valieantly, and had suffered so much for a cause thought was, I believe, one of the worst for which a people ever fought, and one for which there was the least excuse."

I'll give you a hint on what Grant thought the cause was; it wasn't tariffs, freedom, a Second American Revolution or Constitutional rights denied the South, big government or capitalists greedy for business, or hearth and home.

Sincerely,
Unionblue
PS, if you want to see what else General Grant had to say on the subject, go to the Civil War A to Z, then click on Civil War Quotations, then click on General Grant. The man makes himself pretty plain on the subject of slavery being the cause of the war.

[larry_cockerham]

Neil wrote:

"I'll give you a hint on what Grant thought the cause was; it wasn't tariffs, freedom, a Second American Revolution or Constitutional rights denied the South, big government or capitalists greedy for business, or hearth and home."

Seems to me Grant could have been slightly in error. His origin from Illinois would not have put him on the same wavelength perhaps as a native Alabaman.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad he emerged "victorious", with a lost of only a few more than half a million lives. The South had no business winning the war, however worthy their perceived or real causes may have been. That's probably why G. Grandpa Cockerham was a Union man.

[suwannee]

I revere General Grant for his generalship.

In other areas - business and politics - his judgement was notoriously faulty. He was a failure at business and an even worse failure as a president, trusting any thieving scoundrel with the assets of a nation. I hope you understand if I don't think much of his opinions off the battlefield.

The fact remains that after Appomattox slavery was only legal in northern states, which it took an amendment to eradicate. The same amendment that could have eradicated it without a war.

That kind of puts a big cannonball hole in the propaganda balloon of Frederick Douglass et al.

The point that Douglass partisans never bring up is that slave cotton was the enabler of much of northern industry. If slaves had been paid a worthy wage then northern textile mills wouldn't have had the advantage they did in world markets, and northern industry would have failed sooner than it did.

The Douglass argument doesn't cut it anymore now than it did then.

However starting a war when you don't have to is a foolish mistake - one both sides made.

[unionblue]

suwannee,

You make your case with some interesting observations that would be worthy of more debate on another thread.

I suggest that you take your comments from your last post here and repost them under the Civil War History - Secession and Politics forum under a thread there entitled, Slavery, THE Cause?

This way we would not also twist up partssman's greeting thread into a debate one and preserve your observations for all to see in a aprobriate one.

I am sure you are aware that I disagree completely with your summation of the causes of the war and would like to discuss it with you in more detail.

I hope that you do too and would look forward to such a disscusion with you.

Sincerely,
Unionblue

[samgrant]

Originally Posted by suwannee

I revere General Grant for his generalship.

In other areas - business and politics - his judgement was notoriously faulty. He was a failure at business and an even worse failure as a president, trusting any thieving scoundrel with the assets of a nation. I hope you understand if I don't think much of his opinions off the battlefield.

I thought I had posted a reply to this, but it was magically disappeared. Anyway Suannee, I have started a "Ulysses S. Grant" thread inspired by your post. Check it out an contribute if you will.

[FSPowers]

Greetings from Texas.

Welcome to the best CW site (IMHO) on the WWW.

[larry_cockerham]

Finally, another Southerner! Thank you. May your stay be warm and pleasant.

[cash]

Originally Posted by larry_cockerham

Finally, another Southerner! Thank you. May your stay be warm and pleasant.

I'm in Bossier City, Louisiana, further south than you are Larry.

Regards,
Cash