The Ladies TeaStop in and grab a quick cup of tea! All sorts of ladies issues are disscussed here. Both Ladies and Gentlemen are welcome to join in the conversations.
I’ve been meaning to post this for ages, since The Ladies’ Tea is a favourite thread of mine. I believe that this is not merely an interesting story but an almost unique case of a 19th century man including in his memoirs a series of anecdotes which compromise the reputation of a named lady. See what you think.
The evidence is taken from the memoirs of Asbury Coward. He spent most of the war in command of the 5th South Carolina Infantry, but his early service was on the staff of David R. Jones, a Confederate Brigadier General who had to quit active duty in the fall of 1862 because of the heart disease which killed him the following year.
Coward met Jones’s wife shortly after 1st Manassas when she paid a visit to her husband. He described her in the following terms:
Mrs. Jones was the niece of former President Zachary Taylor and a cousin of President Davis’ first wife. She was a pretty woman in her late twenties, free and easy in manner and very outspoken.
In the first winter of the war she returned to spend more time with her husband. They and his staff all moved into a house in Orange Court House presided over by a Mrs. Hiden, a Presbyterian.
Mrs. Jones, secure in her social position and high-tempered, was a little worldly perhaps for Mrs. Hiden, a deeply religious woman, who believed that duty came before pleasure.
At all events, she made some very imprudent remarks. When Mrs. Jones held up the evening meal for an hour and then appeared looking like a picture from Godey’s Lady’s Book, with every curl in place and a gown that would have done credit to a Washington reception, Mrs. Hiden, regarding her ruined dinner said:
“It is time one paid less attention to personal vanity and more to the solemnity of the occasion. Time wasted in primping would be better spent in prayer.”
“In that case,” answered Mrs. Jones pertly, “Supper would still have been cold, as I would have spent the time seeking Divine guidance. But one still can’t afford to let oneself go, even in war, unless….” and here she looked Mrs. Hiden over critically, “one is beyond saving.”
The exchange continued to go downhill to the point where Mrs. Jones made some unflattering observations about the inhabitants of Orange Court House.
Mrs. Hiden answered piously that they were God’s creatures and of importance to Him, if not to Mrs. Jones.
“You’re a silly creature!” shouted Mrs. Jones angrily, “just like your father before you!”
“Don’t mention my dear father,” cautioned Mrs. Hiden. “He was a good man…a saint, called by God…”
“Oh, no” interrupted Mrs. Jones, whose prudence had taken wings. “God did not call your father. God called someone else and your father answered!”
All of this could have been avoided. It served no purpose except to promote ill-feeling and cause much gossip. Mrs. Hiden…did not hesitate to tell the story far and wide.
We return to the story in the second winter of the war, when Coward visits the ailing General in Richmond:
I was walking dejectedly down the street, for I felt that it was unlikely that I would see him alive again, when I heard the clop-clop of horses’ hooves on the cobblestones. A barouche, drawned [sic] by two handsome bays came to halt beside me and Mrs. Jones beckoned me to get in…
…Mrs. Jones was stylishly dressed in a plum-colored pelisse over a gown of grey Liberty satin with the full hooped skirt that was the mode of the moment.
I could not help but wonder where she got these garments when our women were wearing homespun and calico…
…Mrs. Jones began at once: “What do you think of David?”
I could not tell her that I thought he was a dying man. Neither could I tell her that I thought he was getting on all right. So I asked:
“What does the doctor say?”
She answered without her usual spirit: “Not much of anything. He says he must have rest and quiet…and he prescribed egg-nogs with brandy and nutmeg.” She brightened. “I make them myself, three times a day, and he always drinks them. It’s about the only thing he will take, but eggs are nourishing.”
“Where in the world do you get the eggs for three eggnogs a day?” I asked. For eggs were a commodity that few could afford at the time and I doubted that Jeff Davis could get enough eggs for three eggnogs daily.
She looked down at her hands, encased in black lacemitts, and she did not answer me directly. Instead she said vaguely:
“Oh, there are ways.”
It was time for the General’s eggnog, so I stopped the carriage and bade her goodbye. She smiled at me brightly and I must say that I had a warm feeling for her. For it is not easy for a young woman to spend her days making eggnogs for an invalid. And even if I did not approve of her over-stylish appearance at a time when it was stylish not to be stylish…she was a good wife to a man who needed a good wife sorely.
We now move forward to the very last days of the war in Virginia. General Jones is dead. On 2nd April 1865 Coward and a colleague attend the Spottswood Hotel in Richmond for breakfast:
During the meal I looked up and greatly to my surprise, I saw Mrs. Rebecca Jones accompanied by General Joe Davis, who took seats near our table.
The widow Jones looked like anything but a widow. There were no weeds to show signs of a late husband. She was handsomely dressed in lavender, her skirt as full and hooped as when I had seen her last…
…General Davis said he had lost his Regiment at the time A.P. Hill was killed and knew no more about his men.
I thought this very strange. The impression left on my mind was that he was not with his men that day…and therefore could not find…and evidently did not care to find them.
[Coward, The South Carolinians, pp.22, 29-30, 67-68, 169.]
A curious tale. What motivated Coward to drag Mrs. Jones’s reputation through the gutter like this, so many years after the event? I would be very interested to know what anyone else thinks.
Perhaps he was simply stating fact and, in his own way, doing so as politely as possible about a woman he both strongly disapproved of and admired.
As a friend of Gen Jones he would despise her "trollop like" actions while simultaneously admiring her standing by him
Perhaps he was also torn so simply reports what he sees without undue direct criticism, but making plain his feeling.
I use perhaps twice for a reason, all the speculation in the world could not explain this document as it is long past and beyond our ability to investigate, however the writer does manage to sully the lady in a way in which he stays a gentleman.
It is strange that any gentleman, let alone a southern one, would speak so about a woman he NAMED. Perhaps he didn't mean for his memoirs to be published?
Even in his praise for her care of her dying husband, he slips in inferences that subtley destroy the positive inference.
My best guess was that she spurned his attentions and ge was getting revenge.
Ole
would that really be the case? spruning him I mean. Why not as a defense of his old friend and commander about a woman sullying that name as a widow and before.
What a fascinating story! It made me want to know a great deal more about Asbury Coward, and in doing so, I discovered that Mr. Coward came from a strong military background, but his interest in law was won over by his greater attraction to 'outdoorsman.' This alone speaks volumes as to the ongoing struggle that must have existed in how he perceived Rebecca Jones - duty or pleasure.
There are patterns of dichotomy throughout Asbury Coward's descriptions and accounts of Mrs. Jones. His first recollection of Rebecca was to note that she was "very pretty and free and easy in manner and very outspoken." While acknowledging her beauty, Coward sees fit to mention her outspokeness, which of course was not the ideal of a 19th century woman.
I'm fascinated by the exchange between Mrs. Hilden and Rebecca Jones at the dinner in which Rebecca was an hour late. Both women possessed obvious wit, but I'm also interested in Mr. Coward's comments regarding this event, and if he had actually been privy to this conversation, or if he is repeating this dialogue through others? If these were Mr. Coward's own personal observations, then he certainly did take note of Mrs. Jone's appearance, from the perfection of her hair to the elaborate style of her gown. In any event, Rebecca Jones certainly made an impression from start to finish.
When next Mr. Coward sees Mrs. Jones, he confesses to having warm feelings for her because of her duty to her ailing husband, but then compromises this by suggesting that Rebecca's allegiance to her husband was attained through less then virtuous means. And finally, Mr. Coward's last inference to Mrs. Jones, along with again noting her appearance, is that she may have been responsible for General Davis' absence in battle.
I'm sorry Bill that I've turned this into a bit of a novella, but I have found it to be a very entertaining story, and I'm always interested in women who defied to be different, and who accomplished this through style and intrigue. In this case I think that Asbury Coward might have been conflicted between his strong sense of duty and honour and his own version of what a woman should be...and the appeal of a woman like Rebecca Jones who threatened to dismantle everything that he believed in. And it appears that Mrs. Jones was a spirited, intelligent, and fascinating woman.
I think this could be a case of unrequited love, and in dragging Rebecca's reputation through the gutter years later, perhaps this served not only as a vehicle for a man torn between his feelings for a woman who he could not define, but one also of last minute absolution.
Dawna
"If it is a crime to love the South, its cause and its President, then I am a criminal. I would rather lie down in this prison and die than leave it owing allegiance to a government such as yours." ~Belle Boyd~
I tend to believe that he wrote these things intended entirely for his family, not for publication. As it is widely known that men "gossip" as much as women do (Hold steady there, fellas!) I have a feeling that he threw this in just to entertain his family with his wit after his departure from this veil of tears.
After all, if this became public knowledge it would definitely call for either her husband or a brother of the lady in question to call "out" Coward for satisfaction to save the lady's "honor".
Also I find it exceedingly amusing that the man's name is so appropo, "Coward".
__________________ Thea
No one has permission to use any material from any of my posts on any CWT forum, the archives, or any other forum without my express written permission.
Last edited by thea_447; 05-08-2005 at 03:43 PM.
Reason: Forgot to add a smiley.
Oh yes, men gossip as much as women from what I hear. It struck me that he used the phrase "a plum-colored pelisse over a gown of grey Liberty satin" to describe one of Mrs. Jones's costumes. That's pretty observant for a man if you'll pardon the generalization. Now I wonder if this tale was embroidered or edited by one of Mr. Coward's female relatives or acquaintances. Whoever it was, it sounds like the writer/editor's purported ideal woman was frugal and meek, but Mr. Coward was attracted to Mrs. Jones as a kind of forbidden fruit or guilty pleasure.
Your guess, Ray, is as good as mine. Could have been either. Sockknitter makes an interesting observation about Coward's description of Mrs. Jones' dress.
Thea, too makes an interesting point: someone would have had to call Mr. Coward out for at least a thorough caning had his observations been published before his life ended.
I'd raise another question -- was Rebecca Jones more a lady than Asbury Coward was a gentleman?
I am of the mind that the story is just as it appears on the surface. Naturally I know some of both Jones and Davis in the field. I cannot account for Davis’ absence from his men but in truth on the 2nd the CSA was being destroyed. Why was he with her? He may have been on leave. Many soldiers were at that time. The belief that the Union wasn’t going to attack until May. Why was he not rushing off to the ‘front?" I wonder. If he had been there though, A.P. Hill may never had been killed trying to find out what was going on with his army. Just as with Picketts absence etc, bad things happen.
Now, about the gentlemen’s observations of the woman’s clothes. I do not find this unusual. First, men did observe and note clothing then. Often absorbing every detail of a woman and her finery. I do the same thing at times. There is one particular red dress I remember very well and I have never even seen a woman I cared for wearing it. Secondly, it would be even more noticeable for the fact she was wearing it at a time when other women were more concerned with duty and sharing a burden and acquiring such things would deprive you of others.
As to outspoken, that can be taken two ways. Many women who were witty, opinionated, bubbly and outgoing were called outspoken and it was not guaranteed to be a negative label. But the term was also used somewhat akin to the way today we’d call someone a B****. Believe it or not, not all women back then were wallflowers. There were also roses with thorns. A good example is the two woman, even the dour religious one spoke her mind in that cat fight. Held her own I thought.
Why the gossip? I think it was more of a reminiscing than gossip. I know my mind goes back to things in my life with stunning detail. A time of war would imprint things firmly in the brain. Do men gossip? Sure. But not usually like that. The cat fight between the two ladies would be noteworthy and memorable. Personally I think, maybe, he was, in his way, saying she was hot and he was likely hot for her but she was not a very nice person. To me he sounded surprized she was helping her husband. But not surprized how she'd possibly do it. What is the line from the song " The pretty girls never have to buy their drinks." Sounds like she was pretty, vain and may have used it. The ‘Pretty People’ both men and women, have always done so. They still do.
As to being a gentlemen, I'm not sure, for all we know Coward told the most benign version of the story. It could have been far worse and he was putting his version out there to counter far worse ones. Or he could have just made it all up while swigging laudanum.
I think though with no more info all I can do is speculate. Granted it is just my opinions on possiblities. I could have just as easily said I don’t know but where is the fun in that?
Yes, Tommy, men notice dresses, but how often do they describe "a plum-colored pelisse over a gown of grey Liberty satin." I'll give you that the 1860's gentlemen could have been knowledgeable of such terms, but I wouldn't bet you a sandwich dime on it.
I wouldn't expect you to describe, in designer terms, the red dress that you so vividly remember, but it might be interesting if you could.
The possiblities are fun, but I must conclude that neither Mrs. Jones nor Mr. Coward were, respectively, a Lady and a Gentleman. That cat-fight does sound like an episode from "Reba" or "....Raymond,"